Here are some velocities that I am getting with my 470 capstick. It has a 26" barrel including brake, about 23.5 or 24" without.

The brass is 375 cylindrical from Huntingtons, and the primers were F215.

84.0 grains IMR 4064 500 grain Hawk 2269 fps
84.0 grains IMR 4064 500 grain GS Custom FN solid 2315 fps
84.0 grains IMR 4064 500 grain Trophy Bonded Sledgehammer Solid 2279 fps
86.0 grains IMR 4064 500 grain Trophy Bonded Sledgehammer Solid 2343 fps
86.0 grains IMR 4064 500 grain GS Custom FN solid 2341 fps

Pressures were OK.

Those are good velocities. If the loads are accurate and the points of impacts of the solids and softs are fairly close, I wouldn't change anything.

500,
Looking real good but I can't help but ask if you have tried slower powders? I'd have to try IMR-4320, RL-15 & Varget.

Nick

Nick,

No, I just used some low to mid level loads out of the A2 loading manual. Maybe Don will model for me again, then I can try some slower powders in order to break the 2400 fps mark.

I have used up to 90 grains of 4064, but I did not chrono those loads. I stopped using that much powder after my A2 brass was sticky in the chamber, but the HDS brass was never sticky, so that was probably a soft brass issue, not a pressure issue.

500,
If, in the end, it works out that you must go in the opposite direction, as to burnrate, try RL-7. My Lott liked the HDS / RL-7 combination with Fedral 215 GM primers.

Thank you 500 grains,
Your data is most interesting. Kevin Jenkins finished my 470 Capstick, and it is a work of art. Looks like a factory Winchester Super Express at first glance, but with some special touches. It holds three in the box and one in the chamber and feeds and ejects perfectly.

My barrel is a chrome-moly McGowen, #5 sporter, 0.750" at the muzzle, 26", no muzzle brake. The twist however is 1 in 10".

I would estimate a velocity change of about 20 to 25 fps per inch for barrel length differences. I wonder how my faster than normal twist will affect pressures and velocities for a given load? Something to sort out by comparing to other rifles, being aware of chamber and barrel differences between guns of course.

Hence, your data is very interesting.

How about the twist rate of your barrel? I don't recall if it has been stated before.

If my gun shoots, it will surely be a favorite of mine.

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

Dr. Berry,

I am not sure, but I think I have a 1:14 twist. Your 1:10 twist should give higher pressures, but I don't know how much higher.

Did you use the factory stock, or do you have a custom stock on yours?

I just picked up my 585 nyati and will post pics of it soon. It looks great and shoots pretty good. With a brake, the recoil is about like an unbraked 416 rigby.

500grains,
My stock is the factory wood, pillar bedded and barrel recoil lug cross bolted by Kevin. The factory bedding and fit were atrocious on the original 375 H&H, but I liked the ruddy, dark, walnut straight grain, the checkering, and the soft red rubber butt pad. It is now pleasing to my eye and perfectly bedded and reinforced. The finish on the McGowen barrel is a matte black that matches the factory receiver perfectly. Understated elegance and 10 pounds even.

I expect to get 2400 fps from the 26" barrel, but maybe pressures will be high? I will be happy with a safe load and 2300 fps with the 500 grainers in the fast twist 470.

And you already have the 585 Nyati? Mine is still a pipe dream. It may stay that way since I have seen what one shot from a 416 Rigby can do to a cape buffalo.

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

[QUOTE]Originally posted by R. A. Berry
RAB and 500 Grains,
Have you guys tried WW748 in your 470 Capsticks. It worked out to be the powder of choice for my 450 Ackley and the Capstick should be approximately the same volume. You might even have a little more capacity with the 500 grain .475 bullet being shorter than the 500 grain .458. With the Ackley 96 grains with the standard Bruno barrel produced 2380 fps.and 100 grains went to 2410 fps. I used a drop tube and the load was compressed. I used the 96 grain loading as a working load with very good accuracy. 470 Mbogo

470 Mbogo,
I shy away from ball powders, as I like full cases, lightly compressed and consistently ignited. Maybe just an irrational prejudice because of 458 Winchester lore. I will try the WW748 however. Thanks for the tip.

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

[QUOTE]Originally posted by R. A. Berry: Hi RAB,
There are a few other benefits to WW 748 being temperature stable and cooler burning temperature. I never had any problems with with the compressed loads in my Ackley. I pulled some apart after a two year shelf life and the powder was in small clumps but I've had this same situation with other non ball powders. Ignition was always good though. You'll notice a big barrel temperature difference after you've fired 5 to 10 rounds.
470 Mbogo

If you have access to any Vihtavouri N540, I'll bet you dollars to donuts it will do well in the Capstick. I don't have this particular rifle but in rifles with similar characteristics it has done great. It is a little denser than Re15 and in a couple of rifles it has actually given better velocities.

Ray,

What bullets do you plan to use in your .470 Capstick?

George

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Shoot straight, shoot often, but by all means, use enough gun!

George,
I didn't see any of Ray's posts above, loveable curmudgeon that he is, so I guess you might mean RAB? That's me.

I will of course use the GS FN since the .416 caliber FN is a one shot lightening killer of mbogo and passes through hardwood tree trunks one after the other in a laser straight line.

I already have a supply of the Barnes XLC 500 grain .475 cal spitzers, and 500 grain solids by Barnes. I also have a few 600 grain Barnes Original RNSP's, and would like to see how the 10 twist barrel does with the 600 grainers. 2150 to 2200 fps or bust!

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

Sorry, RAB. Brain cramp.

George

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Shoot straight, shoot often, but by all means, use enough gun!

George,
You are not the only one who does that Freudian slip. I can't spell "lightning" sometimes, if you will notice above. However, that GSC FN did have a lightening effect on the mbogo. I took a load off his hooves right now.

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

JohnDL,
Since Norbert gets such great results with VV N540 in the Lott, that seems like a good tip also. GSC has 560 grain and 600 grain FN's available. I want to try RL 15 and the vv N540 with the heavy bullets especially.

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

The last time I got involved with you guys talking about these big bores, it took me two weeks to cure my flinch that I got just from listening!!!

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

"Have you guys tried WW748 in your 470 Capsticks."

No, I have purposely stayed away from ball powder because of the coating which can congeal with compressed loads and high heat.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 500grains:
While you guys have been working up loads for your 470 Capsticks have you found any low velocity loads that George S could use for some 500 grain paper patch leads bullets. Somewhere in the 1800 to 1950 fps area. If you could please post them I'm sure he'll find them and thank you. 470 Mbogo

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 500grains:
"Have you guys tried WW748 in your 470 Capsticks."

No, I have purposely stayed away from ball powder because of the coating which can congeal with compressed loads and high heat.[/QUOTE

Doesn't your military spec ball powders because they are stable and maintain spec velocities whether they are in the tropics or the ice flows. In the 450 Ackley you will never have to compress the powder the way they did in the 458 Winchester. I tried compressing a heavy load and then left it along with a couple of others for a couple of years. When I pulled it apart the powder was in lumps somewhat but when I took the others out and shot them the velocity was the same as one that I loaded the same day that I shot . Try it for yourself and let me know in a couple of years what you think!! 470 Mbogo

Thanks for thinking of me, Dave.

A question for you fellows. How far away do you place the skyscreens when shooting the braked .470s?

George

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Shoot straight, shoot often, but by all means, use enough gun!

GeorgeS,
Mine doesn't have a muzzle brake. However, I would say 15 feet out would be 0.K., based on my experience with the 510/460 Wby. When I chronograph a 50 BMG hand load, 25 feet will usually assure the chronograph screens don't get knocked over.

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

470mbogo

Yes, I think the US mil does use ball. But Winchester used ball, perhaps 748, in the 458 with compressed charges. In high heat, the coating on the ball powder flowed and later hardened, turning the powder charge into one solid lump. When fired, those loads were lucky to shoot the bullet 100 yards down range.

Perhaps they changed the coating of the ball powders so that problem will not recur.

However, since I am not very knowledgable in the area, I chose to go the 'safe' route and use extruded powders about which I have heard no negative rumors. Not a scientific approach, I know, but it's the best I have come up with so far.

Thanks for the load suggestions though. I would not hesitate to use ball powders in my 470 for a bear or moose hunt.