Here's the dilemma. I have a 9.3x62. I want (don't need) a 375H&H. I have handled and really like the Sako Kodiak. It is a super handy gun and I like the iron sights that it has.

However, I've seen a few Whitworth and Remington 798s around town for a pretty good price (600-850 USD). If I bought one of those, to bring it up to the Sako's level (laminate or synthetic stock, barrel band, front and real iron sight, a little action work to slick it up, and perhaps Cerakote), I'm right at or above the Sako's price.

Anyone have an opinion on the Sakos or a Whitworth/Mark X based gun?

Thanks.

Nothing wrong with a Sako, no doubt about that. But I kind of like the idea of going with the cheaper CRF 375's and doing it up exactly the way you want. Best part is, you can pick and choose every modification. Personally, I'd be happier doing that than just buying something. Then again...there is a lot to be said for the buy it and fly it method.

Dave,

Personally, I like the CRF design. I have a new Sako 85 in 270 Win. It claims to be a controlled feed system but it is really a partial CRF IMO. The bolt face doesn't grab the cartridge like the Whitworth, 798, CZ, M70, etc. It pushes the cartridge into the chamber but then grabs the rim once pushed in. In other words, the bolt face grabs the cartridge PRIOR to closing the bolt handle, but not until the cartridge is pushed all the way into the chamber.

Now, I've had some other Sako owners state that possibly mine is out of adjustment. That could be as I'm new to the Sako action. For me, in a potential DG rifle, I prefer the CRF design that I know. I may change my mind with continued exposure to the Sako, but for now, I'd buy cheap and do the upgrade you speak of. I've got 2 CZ's, one modified (416 Rigby) and one stock (375 H&H). Both are great at what they do. I've also got a stock Rem 798 in 375 H&H that works just fine. On the other end of the scale, I have a Stainless M70 in 375 H&H as well. There is no doubt that the M70 is a much smoother action.

Again, just my preference, but I like the better known CRF over the Sako 85.

Ah, excellent point. I hadn't thought of that. Not sure why the CRF point hadn't occurred to me. Speaking of the M70, do you find the swept back bolt handle raps your finger when you fire it or is it not a factor? I kind of like the look of the Sako's straight bolt (or minor sweep back anyway).

Another option is to buy a Montana Rifle Company action and go from there.

I,m partial to CRF myself, but I,ve looked at the Sako,s, and they do seem pretty slick. Tend to stick with CZs, but the Winchesters often seem to feel a lot slicker when you run the bolt. I,ve seen some pretty good deals on .375s of all persuasions in Anchorage. If you,re close to Anchorage, you might consider giving Steve a call at Alaska Custom Firearms... He does good work with out any run around. Be easier to make an informed decision with some prices to consider, and the ability to figure out what your target weight, barrel length, and all those other fun little details.
I,ve seen Win .375s at 900 bucks, for a fair bit less than the Sako, you,ve got a lot of what you,re looking for, some cash left over for a differnt stock.
Course, if a Sako is what you realy want, probably cheaper in the long run to just buy the one you want.

quote:

Originally posted by A7Dave:
Ah, excellent point. I hadn't thought of that. Not sure why the CRF point hadn't occurred to me. Speaking of the M70, do you find the swept back bolt handle raps your finger when you fire it or is it not a factor? I kind of like the look of the Sako's straight bolt (or minor sweep back anyway).

Another option is to buy a Montana Rifle Company action and go from there.

Dave, the swept back bolt handle on the M70 hasn't been an issue but then again we are talking a 375 H&H which really is a pussycat in terms of recoil. I think you can probably find a M70 for a similar price as the CZ and it will be lighter and smoother. Of course, you can put 5 down in the CZ though so there is another item to consider.

I've owned a push feed 458WM in a M70 in the past. It's been awhile since I sold it but I do seem to remember being hit by the bolt handle on a few occasions. I couldn't get it to feed reliably even after several trips to the gunsmith so I sold it. It would handle round nosed solids (all I knew about back then) but would always hang up on the jacket with softs.

If you do go the CZ route, I highly recommend Wayne at American Hunting Rifles to do the conversion work. He worked on my 416 recently and I couldn't be happier. He got to it in a timely manner, did a great job, charged a fair price, and got it back to me pronto! I went with the green "Gunkote" finish to match my synthetic stock. He also replaced the trigger, smoothed the action, straightened and filled the bolt, and the biggie, put a M70 safety on it. Here is a pic of the gun after Wayne finished with it.

The Whitworth express rifle is the way to go
crf,
express sights,
barrel band
8lb 10 oz
usually a very nice piece of wood
D/t for scope
very good pad
The good ones have additional bedding block
Some have crossbolts and
some have in the bow floorplate release

If that is what you are looking at the price is great.
Frank

Cool looking gun, Todd! Thanks for the tips.

The CZs are very nice and their prices are reasonable. AHR does some nice work.

Since my hunting season is probably over I just may go see Steve at Alaska Custom. He's done some work for me before. Be glad to give him my business. If I can get the Whitworth I've been looking at, I'll give him my wish list and see what he says!

[quote]Posted 30 September 2012 01:16Hide Post
Speaking of the M70, do you find the swept back bolt handle raps your finger when you fire it or is it not a factor?

Dave,

I’ve used the Model 70 in 375 H&H , 416 Rem , 458 Win and 450 Ackley.
The swept bolt handle has never been an issue for me personally. The 458 Win which I had rechambered to the 450 Ackley was weighed on a postage scale at 8.25 LBS.
If you can find a Whitworth Express that would be a great choice ( I had one in 458 Win) and it’s hard to go wrong with the M70 (my personal choice) as there is a lot you can do to personalize it.
My feeling is that the CZ is better suited to the larger cartridges like the 416 Rigby and bigger.
Or ,if you want to spend at bit more ( read a lot) you can go with a Dakota 76.

NN

One of my favorites is the .375 Sako carbine.



Just a great little (and big) rifle!

I have the new Model 70 and for $1200, it is outstanding. I like it better than CZ. I have not shot the Sako but would assume the Sako is of good quality.

Though they are heavy, the Win is a nice rifle. I have one in 416 Rem and it shoots very well and feeds everything I have tried flawlessly. Pretty good deal on this one I think.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Aucti....aspx?Item=308628078

I just finished up my CZ ZKK and am very pleased with the outcome.

I have 4 375s.
Whitworth (best looking,, nicely set up for Africa, around $900, shoots great, carries great, CRF)
M70: (best overall choice IMO, very accurate, carries good, $1200, CRF)
Rem 700: (Classic stock, very accurate, carries great, not CRF)
Ruger Hawkeye African: (Not expensive, shoots good, slim, CRF)

If will eventually sell the Rem and Ruger and keep the Whitworth and Mod 70. My Whitworth looks and feels the best in my hands, but the Mod 70 is my go to rifle when dead nuts accuracy counts, like hippo and croc head shots.

BTW, I would be all over that M70 on GB if I didn't have so many already.

Been watching GB, didn't see that nice M70. That is a good deal.

That is a nice looking M70 on GB!

Funny. I missed that M70 on GB because it was listed as .375 H&H and my previous searches used 375 H&H. The "." made the difference.

It is a darn nice rifle though, per the seller, goes 10# all up.

I vote for the Sako, out of the box they shoot very accurately and have no problems whatsoever. My brother recently bought a new condition 458 whitworth and had to spend close to $1000 to bring it up to speed! Anyone who goes on about only using CRF actions (and I do have an original oberndorf mauser 404 with a magnum action so know all about it) I think is over exagerating its benefits. Of course you must be sure to check that any rifle ejects empties and feeds properly.

Thats no joke my Mark X .458 had major issues. Once its all worked out they are nice guns but I'd buy the M70. My .375 M70 is a tackdriver and fairly heavy and a pleasure to shoot

More nitpicking, but is do Whitworth marked actions/rifles get any more "smithing" than a straight Mark X? I've seen both for sale and the Whitworth looks identical but is more expensive (at the gun store anyway).

What kind of major issues did your 458 Mark X have?

If I was lucky enough to live in Alaska like you Dave I'd buy a Ruger Alaskan & carry it everywhere

Yup, in the end, I'll just be recreating a Ruger Alaskan, just with my minor (but more expensive) adjustments....

FWIW, I recently faced the same question you are posing. I decided on a Whitworth, purchased it during a visit to Alaska for a caribou hunt, and brought it home. I got the Express model which comes with a wood stock, barrel band, and iron sights. That seemed to me to be a better start than the models that don't have those features. It is a very serviceable rifle as is, but I will be spending more on it over time to "personalize" it as a poster above suggested. I think it is a good basis for going as far as you want. My research led me to believe the Whitworth will finish out at a lighter weight in a 375 than the Winchester and CZ, and that a 375 weighting less than 10 pounds is not a bad thing.

For some reason, there seems to be more of these rifles available in Alaska than in the lower 48. I suppose that may be partly because there are likely more 375's per capita in that part of the world.

Well, I ended up pulling the trigger on a Remington 798. Missed out on a good looking Mark X, but the 798 should work out fine as a base.

For anyone else who hasn't yet decided on a .375, the Zastava Model 70 is the same as the Rem 798, Mark X, Whitworth, etc. It's a M98 Mauser made in Serbia. There are plenty of them available in calibers ranging from 6.5X55 to .458 Win, including 375 H&H. They need some stock work to slim down the wood, but the current batch of stocks came from a grove of walnut trees in Armenia planted over 300 years ago. I have received some of these guns with amazing figure in the stocks. I buy them from K-VAR in Las Vegas. Have your dealer buy them as the dealer will get a discount. K-VAR may sell the gun to you at retail, but then you must have the gun shipped through a dealer anyway.