Second post and it's damned similar to what I posted under African Hunting. I'll try to keep it shorter here and more in tune with "Big Bores."

Background: I have a variety of "sporterized" 1917 Enfields of which my primary whitetail deer gun is a 308 Norma w. a Leupold Vari-x III 3.5-10x40. In speaking with my gunsmith he told me that I could get a 358 Norma barrel for this rifle and could then shoot either caliber with no other modifications to the rifle.

For this forum I will post this question, if I were to also end up with a 416 Rigby would you be of the opinion that it's of significant value to also obtain a barrel for my existing 308 Norma in 358 Norma caliber for larger North American game, and perhaps some African "plains game," etc.?

To a certain extent my thinking is this: if I were to get the 416 Rigby it would be very well suited to most anything in Africa as well as the "biggies" elsewhere. My 308 Norma, in my opinion, is very well suited for North American game up to and including elk and moose, and justifiably for African plains game as well. If bear were in the area (North America) I'd probably just carry the 416 Rigby anyway. Therefore, I somewhat question the utility of this 358 Norma barrel.

One last wildcard, my gunsmith is in his mid 70's and I'm somewhat of the opinion that when in doubt about a project I go ahead and do it as the future is quite unpredictable. (He's been very influential in my rifle shooting so I value his work greatly). It certainly wouldn't cost much to buy a good barrel and have him chamber it for 358 Norma.

I look forward to hearing about your thoughts on this matter.

Reed Herzig

The 358 Norma and the 308 Norma are both excellent. The 358 Norma can fire a 250 gr bullet at 2800fps+. The reason they both were not extremely popular was the introduction of the 338 Win and the 300 Win. The 416 Rigby can do everything 358 Norma can and a whole lot more. If you are hunting big bears there may not be any better than the 416 Rigby. For the rest of the North American game, if you are an Elmer Keith fan, the 358 would be a minimum caliber for hunting moose and elk and the 416 Rigby would be about right. The 308 Norma, as you know, will handle all North American game. Big bears, moose and elk are regularly shot every year with the 300 mags.

With any rifle though the question must be, do I want one.

I am not big on switch barrels and would keep what you have and get another rifle.

Good Hunting
Steve
PS When it comes to having an old friend build you a rifle, this is a very personal thing so build what you want to keep forever.
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Every man dies, but not every man really lives!!

[This message has been edited by Santala (edited 08-29-2001).]

What you say makes a lot of since, the problem is it just doesn't work...

Most gun nuts go through that switch barrel stage, most jump ship pretty quick...Lots of problems with accuracy, holding zero, returning to zero and you never have the right barrel on it when you need it. IMHO

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

I probably biased it a bit by the tone of my post. While a 358 Norma barrel for my existing gun would be fun to "play around with" it doesn't really seem to offer me anything I don't already have covered.

As for the 416 Rigby, with some modifications I'm making to 1 or 2 of my other Enfield based rifles I may have some stocks (a nice higher grade walnut Fajen or a laminate Microtec (sp?) and modified actions that I could use for a 416 Rigby so it may come down to the barrel cost plus labor to end up with a pretty nice looking 416 Rigby based on a 1917 Enfield.

That brings up another question. Not to name names but when I had my opportunity to purchase my 338/416 Rigby, I was told by a couple of pretty well known long range shooters that the Enfield couldn't handle that load. I was told to keep an eye on the lugs and make sure headspacing wasn't a problem as I put more and more rounds through it. Just today I read a bit of a thread that really seemed to expound the virtues of the 1917 Enfield for a 505 Gibbs (if memory serves). Ray then chimed in about the cost of modifying an Enfield that made me feel VERY good about the rifles I've obtained of that variety. The question is this, do any of you guys have reservations about these BIG calibers being put into use based on an Enfield action?

Thanks for the responses.

Reed

Reed, In a work NO. I you check you will find that all of A-Square's rifles were built on Enfield actions. Whoever told you that they wouldn't hold up were very wrong. For years after the old magnum Mausers were unavailable or too expensive to obtain the Enfield was used. Fred Wells, as well as many other built big rifles on the Enfield.

The only real problem with building a big rifle on an Enfield is finding a gunsmith that is willing to do all the work they require. Ray in a previous thread went into that better than I can.

Good Hunting
Steve

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Every man dies, but not every man really lives!!

The Enfields (M1917 or Pattern 14), as pointed out above, are good actions capable of handling most of the big bores. As another example, the original .460 G&A was built on an M1917 Enfield.

As to the .358 Norma, this is a very versatile round that does suffer from lack of factory ammo availability (Norma only) and, as pointed out by Santala, competition from the domestic .338 Win. That aside, the current Norma loading tables show loads from 225 up to 310 grains (Woodleigh's at 2300-2500 fps w/ an SD of .346) That's pretty big medicine. Plus, as often pointed out in discussions about the .35 Whelen, you can download with bullets intended for the .35 Rem as well as any .357 pistol bullet.

Chris