Ok first of all I want to confess I am stealing most of this info from Cartridges of the world. After doing some daydreaming over my morning coffee I cam across the 510 NE This would be a killer project on a Ruger #1 tropical action. This Wildcat was the combined effort of Bob Schneidmiller (?) and D'arcy Echols. It will push a 500 gr SP/FMJ roughly 2300 FPS with a ME of 6000+ lbs Development of this cartridge began after Mr Schneidmiller took a 50-90 Sharps to Africa for a Cape Buff hunt. He was apperently less than pleased with the performance. He tried to get D'arcy Echols to build a 50-140 sharps on 3 1/4 " cases but D'arcy was not wanting to build a rifle for a obsolete round. Compromising they used the same basic case deseign as the 50-140-3 1/4 " sharps with modern components to better the ballistics of the 500 NE. Mr Schneidmiller suggested they call the new cartridge the 510 Echols Express, Echols declined. The first rifle was built on a Matin Hagen falling block action. The first shot with out a muzzle break tore the fore arm off the gun. After rebuilding with a MB Mr.Schneidmiller says it's a pussycat

I know a lot of guys would not want to build a DG SS but it certainly is a interesting proposition. The appeal is that you could seemingly build a adequite DG gun for a fraction of the cost of many doubles. It certainly seems a better option to me than a over the top lever gun but I expect that depends on just how well a individual could shoot either weapon.

Has any one here experimented with this caliber ? Thoughts ?

Chuck,
sorry to burst this idea...

1: the 500 NE 3", in a ruger, can EASILY chunk a 500 gr at 2300 (~50kpsi, ONLY ruger loads)
2: the 535 .510 bullet is barely .300 sd, so should be considered to be the minimum for a .510 DGR
3: the 500 ne 3.25" can EASILY chunk a 570gr woodleigh 2300" at the same pressure.

both with 24" barrels.

So, no need for a wildcat

jeffe

Unless you just wanted to.

There is an unfortunate line of reasoning among American shooters that they should beef up the old bison calibers, like the 45-120, etc., to turn them into cape buffalo calibers. In single shot and doubles, that is really a waste of effort since the British already invented many fine cape buffalo calibers that exceed even what these wildcat bison calibers can do.

Further, rifles in these bison wildcat calibers have very little market value.

I really think that is the point with most wild cats. You actually have to want to do the project and enjoy time working up loads etc. I rather doubt to many of us would appraoch a wild cat from a investment stand point. IMO that's only a view that became "acceptable" as those who were buying the britsh stuff started to spend in excess of 10k for a well used bolt action. Their are purists in both the classic British camp and in the lever action camp. I find the grey area in the middle more appealing.

If you want the max 50 cal that Ruger diameter actions can handle, there is my 510 HE.Built very easy on 475 #2 brass
straightened out. Rimmed case 3.6 in long.Also work great on doubles and singles.Close to 12,000 ft lbs if
you want.It is in the middle of picture with a 600 gr bullet. 1st is a 458 Win
and 3rd is my 458HE..Ed.

On a Ruger no. 1 there are so many good calibers available and my pick would be the 406 Wby necked up to 50 cal., but it would be my pick for one of you not me...

What we have here is just fun and games and if it stirs your innards then do it, you don't need permission...When it comes to Wildcats today it all boils down to the only difference in men and boys is the cost of the mens toys, that is why I shoot a .470, 404, 9.3, I sure don't need them...I just want them...

Thanks for your view Ray. I just like kicken some of this stuff around for fun and I thought it was interesting considering the number of times we D'arcy echols name come up here. That Ruger # 1 in 404 Jeff seems more appealing all of the time. I have no idea why.

Hubel, Thats a bit much for me thanx. Just looking at it I can feel the recoil

In the Ruger, if you go with a standard classic NE cartridge, you can either use it like it is, or beef up the loads a bit. In my 470, I get 2300 FPS with 500's and it doesn't even work up a sweat doing it, so there isn't really much need to go to the "new and improved". You probably will shoot reduced or standard velocity loads most of the time anyway.

Chuckwagon--You don't have to load full tilt.And with light

450 gr at 2200 fps loads and a real slow powder,

never even had to resize cases in the Enfield we load tested

with.With that huge volumne you can get the speed and never

have high pressures. The 600 gr at 2200 is such low pressure brass lasts for 15- 30 rounds, sometimes more.Ed.

Ed - would a ruger #1 in 45/70 be a good platform to go to a larger case (but still maintain the .458 bore) or should a #1 in 458 win mag be used? A friend has the #1 in 45/70 and asked how to get more "power" - does a low cost method exist ? What do you make your 458HE brass from? Thanks - KMule

Kmule-My 458HE is made from 450NE brass.You can go two ways
to more 458 power in a #1-- Rechamber a 458 Win to my
458HE or rechamber a 45-70 to a 450NE 3.25 case.If the
450 NE brass is as good with a thick base, as what I built my wildcat from you can run full pressures in a #1.
Outdo a 460 if you want.Ed.

HI,

500Grains, I agree and I diaagree,you are right about American shooters,they want to beef up old bison rounds.And the British have been there and done it.Here I disagree, I think to put the beef up rounds in a rifle with more than a single or two shots would have a place in the market,and I am going to use the L- word, ,levers,this can and is being done because of stronger materials and some design changes not a whole lot.And again I say this the big makers of levers are making a big mistake by not doing so and are being told something different pertaining to the market place for such a rifle?,they would sell well.And other reasons is people like tradition and just like the big double rifles, levers and old bison rounds have a long history also, American west.This is just my opinion and I may very well be wrong,Kev

Did you do both a 458 and a 50 HE on a ruger # 1 ? On the 458 HE did you rebarrel or rework a 458 Win barrel ? What other mods did you have to do on the #1 ?

Sorry, I forget all about levers until someone brings them up. It's as though they don't even exist!

I did them in bolt actions for testing and developement.We plan on doing the 510HE in a #1 in future.We will get a 50 cal long barrel, chamber, and modify extractor on the #1.
That is about it.
On the 458HE we rechambered a 458Win Ruger factory 24
inch barrel, tested 1000 rounds, then put on a 30 in barrel and retested another 900 rounds on same gun.Tested 458HE
with 200 rounds on another bolt action with 27 in barrel.
On the 510 we tested one bullet wt with a 100 rounds in
a 32 inch barrel with bolt action..Ed.

Instead of a Ruger #1 you could do it on an Encore! Much cheaper and you have a very nice takedown gun in the end!-Rob

Rob-Yes that long case in an Encore would get good velocity
at 30k, about 20-2100 fps with 600 gr.A far as Ruger #1,
they are my personal favorite, and got to have one with
one of my hairy cases.And the 510HE is only wildcat of mine
with rim, so it is the one that mates to the Ruger...Ed.

It would take about 30 minutes to rechamber a Ruger No. 1 from a 458 to 458 Lott and have factory ammo...A good handload would get up near 2500 FPS in that strong action and a 26" barrel....