Hi all

Let me say that Africa is a dream for me and that I dont have a big thumper at the moment. I remember years ago (and still today) reading of Africa and the big 5 and the guns of the Dark Continent.

One of the rifles that I have had a "craving" for has been a Side by Side in one of the really classic "african cartridges". When Ruger came out with the 77 in 416 rigby I made a deal with myself that I would someday get one. I will in the next year or two make that a reality if only to hunt that most dangerous of game animals the North Alabama Whitetail deer.

The question that I have is, if one were going to do a 3 month safari of old in shorts, knee high socks, and a pith helmet shooting a double, what is THE definitive cartridge for the gun?

Thanks

Jim B.

Traditionally-built double rifles aren't particulary versatile firearms.
They are regulated for a certain load at a certain distance; they bullet paths cross after that.
If you accept that limitation, and have your rifle regulated to hit POA at 100yds., a .500/.416 (Krieghoff) or a .450/.400NE would probably be your best choices.

George

ask 5 hunters, get 10 answers

I would say 470 ne, for the most part
500 31/4 for stouter souls
500/416 for sissy's like me

jeffe

Jim,if I follow your question I would say the either the 450/500 3 1/4" or one from that time period,

The first of them all, the 450 Nitro Express. My dream caliber!

I find nostalgia an added addition to the fun of hunting and the use of guns...I also find it easy to combine the two as Nostalgic guns have proven themselves over the last couple of hundred years....

I dare anyone to show me a 40 caliber better than a 404 Jefferys or a 416 better than the Rigby..What new double rifle calibers better what we have had for the last 100 years...NONE

Sure you can dazzle us with velocity figures, SD and BC, but you see that equal all equals BS.

Pith Helmets and knee socks, well maybe thats a little bezarre, but hell whatever blows your skirt up.

Order of Edwardian Gunners

http://www.vintagers.org/

___

BFaucett,

Does the fellow with the pith helmet ALWAYS shoot that way? Nice steady hold, but the bullets out of my FAL seem to have trouble gaining altitude when I pull on the barrel like that.

Inquiring minds want to know.

I'll second Ray on the nostalgic choices and add 375 H & H and 30-06 as worthy additions to the club, with the 45-70 receiving an honorable mention.

Mac,thanks I still get a little confused on the Brit rounds

Jim:

There are many facets to a decision concerning double rifle choice, almost all of them subjective. Based on my own experience from having bought several, don't be practical or you will never get there! And don't compromise or you will end up disappointed. When I finally decided to scratch the same itch as yours, I already knew what I wanted. Conventional wisdom then was to get a .470 - ammo and components for all the others would be a serious problem. At that time, as it turned out, this was good advice. Problem was that, having grown up on Corbett and Taylor, a .470 wouldn't scratch MY itch, it had to be a .450/.400 so that's what I got. With 15 years of hindsight, I'm glad I did. Too damn much money to scratch the spot next to it, instead of the itch itself.

In the unlikely event that I ever want something else, my pick would be one of the .450s. Can't say which one, I like all three. I like the .500/.416 a lot and have shot one quite a bit, but it is new and so lacks the nostalgic cachet that you seek.

The truth is, from .450/.400 to .476 Westley Richards, they are all good and component availability problems for all of them are a thing of the past now. There has to be one that pulls on you more than the others - that's the one to get!
---------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

Hey Jim B., I'm in the same situation. Since I too live in the dark jungles of Alabama, stalking the elusive and possibly dangerous whitetail deer, I've decided that I need a big bore rifle. I think I've decided on two of them. The first one would be a .375 JRS which would also make a good elk rifle and a .450 Watts Magnum. Both of these will be in either CZ 550's or Model 70's. Just depends on how much spending money I end up with after this year. Good luck with the bucks!

500 NE

But let's skip the knee socks because too many seeds will get stuck in them.

It has always amazed me how my countrymen and the Dubai Flash we are all fond off, always want to improve the 375 H&H, no such animal as an improved 375 H&H..That is a caliber that cannot be improved, all you can do is blow the shoulder out and get more velocity...

If I wanted one bolt gun for a three month safari, it would be chambered in .375 H&H.

If I wanted a double to go along with it, I'd choose one in .500 Nitro Express.

AD

JR-280, There aren't many jungles around Gulf Shores anymore if my geography is correct- but move a little east -over into Covington county and the beasts are positively ferocious!

Dr. Duc--Well, I'm actually in a little town about 15 miles north of Gulf Shores but most people know where the beach is so I don't bother telling them I'm in Robertsdale ("Where's that??" ) I guess you would call it more of a big swamp than a jungle Actually, most of the deep dark jungles in Alabama are in Perry County. There's lot's of scary jungle out there. Might have to break out the 2 and 4 bores for that area

Recono,
Good point. The aiming pose with a tight sling on a double rifle is bogus. The sling should be gone, and only put back on for long portages through open country.

Jim B.,
One rifle battery for the grand safari: 416 Rigby with 400 grain and 350 grain bullets sighted properly.

Two rifles for the humdinger safari: 375 H&H magazine rifle with scope, and 470 NE double rifle, with no scope, and a gunbearer at your heels.

Gentlemen

I would choose a 416 rigby for the big stuff, a 9,3X62 as medium and a 270 or 280 as the small one.

What do you plan to hunt? Djungle or Savanna? If I should hunt in the djungle were distance to elephants and buffalo is close a 450 rigby would be welcome, perhaps a 500. It can easily be less than 30 yards.

/ JOHAN

Johan,
I wouldn't be particularly frantic if all I had was a 9.3x62 as long as I had some solids, in fact I would be quite comfortable, but knowing their are probably better alternatives......

I'd take my William Evans 450/400 3 1/4 double rifle. It's an underlever hammer gun. Talk about a thing from the past. Built in London in 1898. Hammer guns rule.

A double without hammers is like a hound dog without ears. It just don't look right.

Mac

Poor old Mac, I think he is about in the last stages of Nostalgic bulemia consadation melania...

It only happens when one loves projections on various articles such as guns, private parts and antique mirrors etc...sorry Mac!! the devil made me say it.

Very clever Ray! I like your diagnosis, seems spot on!