I stopped at the H&H booth to chat with Russell Wilkin about the .400 H&H and .465 H&H. There are a couple of earlier threads on these cartridges, but I was looking for the nitty gritty details.

The .400 will use .411" bullets, and is based on the .375 H&H case; load is 400 grains at 2,375 fps. The .465 H&H will use the same bullets as the .465 Nitro Express, and is based on the .460 Weatherby case; the load is 480 grains at 2,375 fps. Both cases are belted magnums, and the taper will remind you of the .375 H&H. I have never been a subscriber to the "belts are bad" school, so I hope I don't diaappoint you by not whacking these designs.

I asked Russell if the these two rounds could be considered a .500/.450 Nitro Express and a .500/.465 NE for magazine rifles, and he allowed as how that was a fair comparison.

The had three prototype rifles in the booth; actions were Mauser M98s still in the white. Rifle will require one year after order, and will sell in the $23,000 range.

Ammunition will be available in about 4 months for the .400, and a couple of months after that for the .465. Wolfgang Romey will sell ammunition, and will make drawings available to the trade (as I understood it).

jim dodd

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"if you are to busy to
hunt, you are too busy."

I am not impressed.

The 400 H&H is just a goofy re-do of the 404 jeffery.

The 465 H&H offers no advantage over the 458 Lott.

Both new H&H cartridges have too much slope in the shoulder by modern standards.

H&H is just trying to be different, but should have opened up their minds to the advances in cartridge design that have occurred over the past 90 years.

500 grains,

So don't buy one! <--- humor

Take a read in Taylor's book on the .500/.400 and .500/.465; the originals were doing an excellent job -- these cartridges will too.

We don't buy rifles for what is "best" anyway!...jim dodd

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"if you are to busy to
hunt, you are too busy."

Ahh, but they will have the vaunted H&H label so they will sell to the current customers of H&H. This is good for H&H and meaningless for everyone else! Which comprise about 99.9% of the shooting public.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by John S:
John S has the story correct. The cartridges will be 4 times the price of any other along with components such as brass. I agree with Jim about the belted cartridges no one seems to mind chambering in 500 A-Square with a belted case.
470 Mbogo

Perfect solution to a non-exsisting problem

I do think that the folks at H&H have embarassed themselves by proving just how far behind they are technologically with these new cartridges. Not only are they decades late, they are also designed with features that were well thought of 90 years ago but which today we realize are a mistake.

For example, the long sloping shoulder tends to increase bolt thrust, is more difficult to get to stay under the rails, and stretches brass.

There is neither timeliness nor elegance in these new cartridges.

I agree that they are just a marketing gimmick.

Whose 98 Mauser action does H&H use?

The H&H cartridges that maintain their populatity today were quantum advances in design at the time of their inception. These two new cartidges, while fully adequate, offer no advantages over numerous existing alternatives.

A 400 H&H Improved might be just the ticket though - but a 416, either Rigby or Remington, seems more sensible.

I don't know what actions they used, but they had military clip slots, and they looked to have been "heavily modified" as the gun rags put it.

The .400 H&H could shoot .41 pistol bullets as practice loads, which some on this list think is a Good Thing in and of itself.

I am thinking about converting one of my .375 H&Hs to .400 H&H, especially after reading the information I have in various books covering the .500/.450 and .400 Pondoro.

jim dodd

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"if you are to busy to
hunt, you are too busy."

I have been laughing about the 400 H&H and 465 H&H ever since I first heard about them. Now that HunterJim has supplied some details that seem credible, I find them even funnier.
HO HO HO ...

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RAB