Does this phenomenon really extend beyond the borders of the U.S.? I know we have Members who are big-bore fanatics from Canada, southern Africa, Australia, Europe, and the U.A.E.; besides yourselves, do you know of many big-bore fans in your countries?

George

I know two guys who have 45-70 guide guns and I have a buddy that has a 375 H-H. So I wouldn't say they are really big bore fanatics. But me on the other hand am infected with the big bore virus.

I have a 375 ultra and a 458 win. And I figure I'll get me a 550 mag before long just to have it.

I am mostly stuck on the 375 caliber and am always thinking about having my rifles rebarreled to different .375's.
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Its -44 outside this morning. (teeth chattering).

I loaded up a box of barnes 600 grain originals in my .458 a couple winters ago. Problem was I came up with a max load at 15*F and they blew the primers at 45*F. I bet today would be a good day to shoot them off. Plus I'll have so many clothes on there won't be any recoil either .

My take on this subject is that the big bores are the standard, and the small diameter high speed cartridges are the fad. I think we will see more and more shoters using big bores, and cartridges with moderate to low case volume to bullet diameter ratios. The barrels last longer, and when used for hunting, less meat is destroyed. Next year I'll be using a 458 WSM, then a 500 A-Square.



500 A-Square





458 WSM

George,

The kangaroo, pig and goat would be our counterpart of your white tail deer and I would say that a much higher percentage of Australians shoot those animals with either the 223 and 22/250 or 375 and up than would be the case for the American hunter with deer. In other words we tend to use either very small calibres which is the large majority of shooters or many of us will use very large calibres.

I know several shooters with rifles from 375 H&H through to 460 Wby but of course you do get to know shooters with similar interests to yourself.

375 and especially in the CZ/BRNO would be the number one big bore and also plenty of 458 BRNOs being used with 45/70 type bullets and of course the Marlin 45/70s.

You don't see many 338 Winchesters and I think that is because most of us are only shooting pigs, goats or roos and so once we move past 270 or 308 then we are into fun guns.

Mike

I like that 458 WSM. I am picking up a 300 WSM today and I am already thinking about it in a 458 WSM. That is bad.

What are the ballistics of the 458 short mag ??Or is it just a 450 mag also....What are its deminsions???

Mike

I'll start a new thread about the 458 WSM.

There will always be guys out there who will shoot big-bores. But, as the number of new rifles being bought by new shooters get caught up with the demand, the sales will drop a little bit. When I was buying up stuff left and right, I allowed quite a few guys and gals to shoot any toy they wanted to. After showing them the proper technique on the bench for a few rounds, I then took them to off-hand at 25 yds. to start. They would then start to go down to my toy store and bug my guy for big toys. Demand for new stuff will always be out there even though in limited numbers.

I may be all wet, but I have a feeling that interest in big-bores tends to be more internally generated, rather than instigated by gun rags and advertising and any "bandwagon" effect. [I am referring here only to rifles - big-bore revolvers are definitely the subject of advertising and gun-rag articles!] Nevertheless, PaulH makes a good point.

Time will tell.

I started out just looking around here and ended up buying one! I bought a right handed 375 H&H and since I have shot it and hunted with it I am very happy with it. Should have done it sooner. I am currently working on a left handed 375 H&H(I am a lefty)and my son is very excited over me giving him the RH rifle.
I am seeing a few more LH rifles out there and am now hearing rumors that CZ may be making some as well, we can only keep our fingers crossed...

To all you left-handed shooters, what is wrong with the Ruger No1 as a big bore.
I won a rapid fire match in our big game club with my #1 458Lott against a number of CZ 375's. 9 rounds in 30 secs (And I just had the tenth chambered before the whistle!)

well, lets see, 505 gibbs and 416 rigby around for almost 100 years, that is the kinda of fad i like

For me it has been a progression from small to large. I started at 11 years old with a 6mm Remington. The performance was horrible and soon I had my Father's 7mm mag. That worked so much better that I wanted more and soon talked a friend into loaning me his 375 H&H. After a few animals with that rifle I was hooked. I went Through a Ruger #1 in 458 win, then onto a Weatherby MK-V in 416 wby mag. Both were great rifles and they killed what ever I aimed them at. Now, I have slid back a bit and do almost all of my hunting with a 338-378wby mag. It kills like nothing I have ever used on North American game. But having said that, Dan at MRC and Rod at Acrabond are right now working on my new left hand M1999 in 458 Lott.

For me its not a fad, but for those that I run into at gun shows and shops, its more an ego trip or an attempt to compensate for something. My 416 Wby was a bargain from such a fellow, it had only been shot once and his new glasses were already on order. There were 7 stitches over his eye.

Nothing wrong with the Ruger #1 from where I set. I just don't like the stocks and few smiths like to re-stock them. My 458 win was a Ruger and it just didn't fit. The trigger guard was punishing to my fingers.

Thank goodness for MRC and those left hand actions, makes nearly any big bore possible for us south paws.

I think the interest in the powerful big boomers is a fad. Eventually the guys buying them to hunt deer and fantasise about an African safari will loose interest. They will get sick of getting punched in the shoulder when it is not necessary.

The true big bore shooters who do use them on safari or where they are needed will certainly keep them going.

The cartridges that should succeed are the moderate velocity lesser recoiler ones that have always been around, at least in Europe and Africa. The 9.3x62, 9.3x74R, even the .375 H&H Mag. The .376 Steyr though probably never successful commercially would also be a good one.

No one needs a .458 Lott to hunt deer. And no one needs to have that recoil for a stag. BUT if you want one, why not!

I love and shoot my big bores in case of an outbreak from sabre-toothed field mice

I shot two foxes today with my .458 Lott loaded with speer 400 gr flats it did the job to say the least....I just love big bores

As people have more income they will continue to be drawn to the more exotic side of their respective hobbies. The internet has spotlighted the availability of exotic big bores and I see nothing but growing interest in the short term. Face it, sports of all kinds have become "equipment intensive" and shooting is no exception. Same reason for all the new cartridges and rifle variants, shotguns and such.

NitroX,
I concur most definitely. Years ago people would mock me for shooting the field artillery pieces at the range, and now most everyone thinks they are cool. Usually, however, when one of them works up the courage to actually shoot one of my rifles, they flinch badly, missing the mark horrendously, and comment about the recoil being so severe. This with a measely 416 Rigby, I don't let a newbie fire off anything real powerful.

I think the current love affair with the big bore has more to do with the macho man ego than anything else.

Pulling from memory. I believe 6 people have fired off my 416 Rigby at the range. Four of those six individuals shot 400 gr Hornadys over 104 gr of IMR4350, and complained that the recoil was incredibly harsh/painful (one guy still said it was too COOL though) none hit the inside the 6 ring, with most missing the target completely! I got the impression that these four were all recreational shooters and were in their 20's (the were shooting 223, SKS, AKs, various lever actions, no serious hunting iron). The last two gentlemen fired off 300 gr X bullets on top of 111 gr IMR7828 (not the fastest load but surprisingly accurate and used for elk this last season). One of these gentlemen was an experienced 375 (there is only one 375)shooter, he commented that the recoil was heavy but tolerable and he just had to get himself one of Rigby's 416s, the second gentlemen stated that the recoil was painful and beyond his limit (of course he did not take my advise and fired the rifle as if it were a 30-06 gentleman #1 and I were shaking our heads). Both of these last two gentlemen are accomplished hunters and they hit, first gentleman X ring, second gentleman inside the 10 ring, range 100 yards.

The fad will pass, it will only take time. They don't sell anywhere near as many big bores as the publicity would seem to indicate. The big bore isn't cheap to buy nor to feed.

Finally, I doubt you will see them bargain priced until loading components (brass & bullets specifically) become impossible to find. This is how it worked back in the 70s and into the 80s. There was a time when a mint condition 505 Gibbs made by a well known Continental maker could be had for less than $3000. They now demand well over 5 times that amount. The difference, cost of money so I would say the price has really only increased by 3 times, and the fact that one can now readily procure brass and .505" bullets.

Scott

I think it's definitely sustainable, but probably not at the levels we're now seeing.

Lots of media hype is feeding the popularity of the big bores right now. Seems like every time you pick up a gun or hunting magazine there's at least one article on the subject.

Some will try one for that reason only--after all, advertising does work. But most won't stay the course and actually hunt with and shoot them over the long haul, I would think. I have my eye out for bargains on the second hand market.

If only it were possible for us true believers to hunt more elephants, buffalo, hippos and rhinos . . . some day, perhaps.

Or, we can just use big bore express rifles for all of our big game hunting right here and now. I've actually heard people advocate that and I'm so far gone it doesn't sound crazy to me!!!!