Guys, maybe I'm wrong but I think but I think the shooting public has already made a decision with respect to the Ruger/H&H/Rigby. Go to Guns America or Guns International and you will find H&Hs and Rigbys stacked up like cord wood. However, the stainless Alaskan seems to be really hard to find.

quote:

Originally posted by Scott King:

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:

Myself I don't understand how overkill can apply to an animal that can easily outrun the fastest human beings and that can shred a human body in seconds - but then I'm not a bear lover so if I'm hunting bears especially Alaskan bears I'll be using the largest caliber rifle that I own that I can accurately shoot 'cause I prefer to return home in no worse condition than I left in.

If this is true then why stop at a .458 win?

A 378 should deliver nicely, a 450 Rigby or the 460 weatherby the same. The 12ga from Hell, the 6 or 700 Nitro,......

We can drive this topic into internet hysteria but it it won't change the bears or moose and what is a very good firearm to take them with.

If you don't feel safe without a bazooka by all means,...........

Scott,

I understand that you're quite comfortable using your 9.3x62 to hunt Alaskan bears but I am reminded that the 458 Alaskan and 50 Alaskan cartridges were developed in Alaska for hunting big bears with lever guns and I'm sure that you're counting on your .366 caliber bullets to expand to at least the .510 caliber that the 50 Alaskan starts with.

Anyway I personally have no issues with someone using whatever caliber rifle they desire to use hunting Alaskan bears - just as long as its a legal caliber to use.

Myself, if I ever do travel to Alaska to hunt bear and I happen to be facing one across a berry bush I just might wish I had a bazooka shooting an expanding bullet (don't want to blow myself up).

But as my current shoulder arms jump from 300 SAUM to 12 gauge shotgun I'll likely not do such a trip until sometime after my .423/338 Lapua Magnum and .500/338 Lapua Magnum rifles are completed. And yes I'd likely take the .500 caliber rifle especially as RIP has already proven the cartridge to be very accurate and flat shooting out to 300yds with the 430gr CEB MTH copper HP spritzer bullets and Michael has already proven that they'll properly expand to 1660 fps velocity which is about 650yds and are absolutely deadly within 100 yards - so definitely my preferred rifle/cartridge combination for Alaskan bear.

From the Alaska Fish and Game site:


"Big Magnums Not Needed"
"The rifle you bring hunting should be one with which you are comfortable. Because of the presence of brown and grizzly bears, many hunters have been convinced that a .300, .338, .375, or .416 magnum is needed for personal protection and to take large Alaska game. This is simply not true. The recoil and noise of these large cartridges is unpleasant at best and plainly painful to many shooters. It is very difficult to concentrate on shot placement when your brain and body remembers the unpleasant recoil and noise which occurs when you pull the trigger on one of the big magnums."

"The two most common complaints of professional Alaska guides are hunters who are not in good physical condition and hunters who cannot accurately shoot their rifles. Because these hunters do not practice enough they cannot shoot accurately enough. They miss their best chance at taking their dream animal or worse yet, they wound and lose an animal. Most experienced guides prefer that a hunter come to camp with a .270 or .30-06 rifle they can shoot well rather than a shiny new magnum that has been fired just enough to get sighted-in. If you are going to hunt brown bear on the Alaska Peninsula or Kodiak Island, a .30-06 loaded with 200- or 220-grain Nosler® or similar premium bullet will do the job with good shot placement. Only consider using a .300, .338 or larger magnum if you can shoot it as well as you can the .30-06."

"It is very popular now to purchase large magnum rifles equipped with a muzzle brake. Most muzzle brakes are very effective at reducing recoil. A .375 magnum with a muzzle brake recoils much like a .30-06. Before convincing yourself that you should use a muzzle-braked rifle, consider its disadvantages. A muzzle-brake increases the muzzle blast and noise to levels that quickly damage the ear. Even when just sighting in or practicing, everyone near you at the range will find the blast and noise bothersome. Anyone near the muzzle brake when the rifle is fired may suffer hearing loss or physical damage to the ear. You cannot wear ear protection when you are hunting and neither can your hunting partners or guide. An increasing number of guides will not allow a hunter to use a muzzle brake because of the danger of hearing loss."

Sound advice. The guides in Alaska sound an awfully lot like the guides in Africa. Shot placement is everything.

Another option for an all weather rifle in the ruger calibers is Montana Rifle Co. You can choose belted magnum calibers also. They are a bit more expensive but come with the B&C stock which is much better than the Hogue stock IMO. I know they have been bashed a bit because of production delays but I really like their lineup and hope they start appearing on dealer racks.

I will choose quality over quantity any day and like the idea of them making better rifles instead of trying to cut costs. I understand the big companies trying to cash in on the low cost gun trend but personally do not want any of them. Ruger makes a good rifle but has done things to them I wouldn't care for. Others may love the guide stock and muzzle breaks and that's fine. I just treat every gun as an investment and buy them for keepers so I am willing to pay a bit more to get something special. Anyway just another option to ponder which is always a good thing.

In my humble opinion, there is absolutely nothing a .375 can do that a .416 can't do better. Ruger's in either calibre wouldn't be my first choice.

quote:

Originally posted by lavaca:
In my humble opinion, there is absolutely nothing a .375 can do that a .416 can't do better. Ruger's in either calibre wouldn't be my first choice.

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:
Alaskaman11,

The .416 Ruger Alaskan rifle with the Hogue synthetic stock can still be found NIB via the Internet.

I haven't seen one in quite a long time. I check gunbroker, gunsamerica, and gunsinternational. Is there something I have been missing?

quote:

Originally posted by FOsteology:

quote:

Originally posted by jorge:
And here is "Pigmaster" under his other handle. Moderators, isn't there a RULE about multiple logons?

Jorge,

No, silvertip1 is Kevin aka. "22WRF", not Larry Root.

So much for the multiple handle shell game restriction. Is this Kevin over on 24 as well? This would be SUCH a much better place is EVERYONE abided by the rules...

quote:

Originally posted by frank4570:

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:
Alaskaman11,

The .416 Ruger Alaskan rifle with the Hogue synthetic stock can still be found NIB via the Internet.

I haven't seen one in quite a long time. I check gunbroker, gunsamerica, and gunsinternational. Is there something I have been missing?

I should check before I insert both feet in single large mouth... I just checked and nothing... I did find two a few months ago and unfortunately assumed they were still cropping up... Sorry...

I see no reason for a 416 over a 375 short of Elephant Hunting..The 375 is much more practical, less recoil and generally flatter trajectory for longer range shooting, and more than powerful enough for Brown Bear, Moose.

The only justification on this continent for anything more powerful than a .375 is " want "
and thats fine with me but even then the .375 may be more than is needed since the 30-06 IMO with 200 gr. Noslers will do in any animal on this continent and do it well, as will the 300 magnums, 338s, 338-06, 35 Whelan, 9.3x62 and a few others.

But if a .416 fills one heart with joy, then why not!

I wish that CZ would make a stainless synthetic in 9,3X62. They do make a Kevlar carbine with a 20.6 inch barrel in that caliber but it's not stainless. However, send it Wayne and get it guncoated and you would have a really sweet gun that would work in Alaska.

If you want a classic African caliber, the 9,3X62 is even more classic than either the either the Rigby or the H&H. It's been around longer,there were way more of them and they took much more African game. Heck, before 1980, I think there were on something like 200 Rigbys ever made and the .375 H&H didn't really become popular until after WW II.

Thanks for looking. I made the decision to buy just a little too late. It never occurred to me they would discontinue the rifle, it seemed perfect for Alaska.

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:

quote:

Originally posted by frank4570:

quote:

Originally posted by capoward:
Alaskaman11,

The .416 Ruger Alaskan rifle with the Hogue synthetic stock can still be found NIB via the Internet.

I haven't seen one in quite a long time. I check gunbroker, gunsamerica, and gunsinternational. Is there something I have been missing?

I should check before I insert both feet in single large mouth... I just checked and nothing... I did find two a few months ago and unfortunately assumed they were still cropping up... Sorry...

quote:

Originally posted by jorge:

quote:

Originally posted by FOsteology:

quote:

Originally posted by jorge:
And here is "Pigmaster" under his other handle. Moderators, isn't there a RULE about multiple logons?

Jorge,

No, silvertip1 is Kevin aka. "22WRF", not Larry Root.

So much for the multiple handle shell game restriction. Is this Kevin over on 24 as well? This would be SUCH a much better place is EVERYONE abided by the rules...

The best rule, I have learned the hard way, is to try hard to live and let live.

Here is a rule On another forum I frequent. I wonder if it would be a good rule here?

"Readers of "For Sale" posts should refrain from intruding on the thread by making negative comments about the item or the price being requested. Doing so is rude, and thus in violation of general forum guidelines."

I like the idea of the Ruger 416 but untill Ruger bring back the quality levels that were around while Bill was there then I wont be buying that calibre unless someone else makes it. I have had a R77Mk2 and now a Hawkeye nd niether are reliable for DG. On both the bolt wants to bind up closing and opening. They need to put an anti bind rail on them.

So I will stick with my CZ550 416Rigby.

I dont use my CZ in375H&H now as my Rem 700SPS 375H&H is just as accurate, 7 1/2 pounds and felt recoil is way less.

quote:

Originally posted by Rule 303:
I like the idea of the Ruger 416 but untill Ruger bring back the quality levels that were around while Bill was there then I wont be buying that calibre unless someone else makes it. I have had a R77Mk2 and now a Hawkeye nd niether are reliable for DG. On both the bolt wants to bind up closing and opening. They need to put an anti bind rail on them.

So I will stick with my CZ550 416Rigby.

I dont use my CZ in375H&H now as my Rem 700SPS 375H&H is just as accurate, 7 1/2 pounds and felt recoil is way less.

I have a 550 in 416 and love it but reserve it only for the heaviest loads due to its bulk. It was worked over many years ago by Tom Burgess so I don't see it going down the road anytime soon. I wanted a lighter, nimbler 416, so I built my 416 Ruger on a Mauser 98.

I have owned both the 416 and 375 Ruger. I actually liked the 416 better, which also seemed to be less finicky reloading than 375 at the shoulder. Keep in mind that components for 416 are usually harder to find than 375. I don't use either caliber now, for me the 338 win mag with 225 gain TSX bullet is plenty medicine for anything in NA, but I am bringing my open sighted 458 out next week bear hunting just for the fun of it, do I need it....NO, but it needs bloodied so why not. My son will be taking his 375 Ruger bear hunting with it next week, he has shot elephant and cape buffalo with it, one shot kills, he knows he's over gunned but shoots it as well as his 30-06 so why not.

quote:

Originally posted by pigmaster:
You really want neither. A 375 H&H or 416 Rigby will do as much or more, can be purchased in a quality rifle (like a CZ) ammo is far more available in out of the way places.

Once Ruger stopped making the RSM model, they tossed quality on the scrapheap in favor of getting guns out the door and adding another cartridge to the "does the same as" list.

and now muzzle brakes ?????? Bill must be spinning in his grave.

+1 I would find a RSM instead of a new gun.

I have both the .375 and .416 Ruger. Recoil difference is barely noticeable. I don't use the .416 much as I had it built for Africa and big stuff but haven't been there yet. For the US, the .375 is all I would use. The Rugers are fine tools. I want a gun that functions as designed 100% of the time and delivers its bullets where I aim. If you want to gild your gun, that's fine with me.

Thanks all, I got the 416. Hope to give a range report soon.

i just bought one of each, they are both good, hard working rifles. the new designs with brakes and those shit stocks, well, no more rugers for me......................lol

I like my 416 ruger Alaskan rifle, I load it to 2150 FPS, 4000 ft/lb at the muzzle. It's light, accurate, and soft recoil with this load.
More power than a 450/400, 375 H&H.

Hmmm, that's funny.

quote:

the new designs with brakes and those shit stocks, well, no more rugers for me

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. But when it comes to functionality, the new Ruger Guide Gun allows someone to adjust the length-of-pull for more than one person. Sounds useful to me in some situations. A person 5 feet tall and 6 1/2 feet tall could use the same rifle. Of course, we agree that the muzzle break would need to be replaced with the thread cap, making the gun both short and easier on the ears when hunting.

quote:

Guys, maybe I'm wrong but I think but I think the shooting public has already made a decision with respect to the Ruger/H&H/Rigby. Go to Guns America or Guns International and you will find H&Hs and Rigbys stacked up like cord wood. However, the stainless Alaskan seems to be really hard to find.

Dave--
were you arguing that the public loves the new 416Ruger stainless Alaskan so that it is hard to find and nobody is selling?
Or that the public didn't like the Ruger so that no one has any for resale?

I would expect Ruger to make some more runs of the stainless Alaskan model in both 375Rug and 416Rug.

I just love these type of threads,no reason not to own one if that's what you want,

I say push Ruger to bing them both out in the Scout Rifle with 10 round mag's, that will make every one happy!

Never delved into the Ruger cartidges. However, when I got my first .375 H&H, I thought I had the the answer to everthing. However, there is absolutely nothing that a .375 can do that a .416 can't do better.

I usually find if I am deciding between a lighter and heavier caliber for the same purpose what happens is if I am shooting a lot I always wished I had chosen the lighter one for recoil but if I am just plugging occasional trophies or frigging around at the range I wish I had chosen the larger for more fun. Also the decision process is all about the bigger caliber, either you want to be talked into choosing it, or not choosing it. The 'other calibre' the sensible one is not important. it could be anything, a 338 or 30-06 or even a sharp stick.So whether you actually need a 416 is the real question...Hell yes. Who doesn't?

quote:

Originally posted by Dresden:
I like my 416 ruger Alaskan rifle, I load it to 2150 FPS, 4000 ft/lb at the muzzle. It's light, accurate, and soft recoil with this load.
More power than a 450/400, 375 H&H.

What is your load data for these results?

quote:

Originally posted by Dresden:
I like my 416 ruger Alaskan rifle, I load it to 2150 FPS, 4000 ft/lb at the muzzle. It's light, accurate, and soft recoil with this load.
More power than a 450/400, 375 H&H.

When loaded to that level, it is less power than a 375HH and between that and a 338WM level.
But it's a better calibre however loaded.

HI, Alaskaman, I've been using a Ruger Alaskan in .416 for Asiatic Water Buffalo here in Australia and loading 350gn TSX to around 2350fps and it's easy to handle,accurate and very effective. At first I did have some minor feeding issues, which were sorted out very nicely under warranty. Since that, it's been a fantastic little rifle to use. Being short and light, it's really quick and easy to point which is what you want when hunting something that can trample and stomp on you or bite back!!!

After purchasing the Ruger .416, I weakened and also bought a .50B&M Long, which is an awesome rifle. With an 18" barrel and overall length of 38.5" and weighing 8.5lbs all up,it's perfect for hunting dangerous beasties in close quarters as well as being light enough to carry all day in the bush. To talk "the boss" into buying it, I had to sell some old clunkers to help finance the purchase, but I can live with that, especially when you get to handle another little rifle like the .50B&M. Again, you have to see and handle one of these in the flesh, to appreciate the package. Now I'm working on loads for a trip up north hunting buffalo in a couple of months.

You enjoy your.416 Alaskan, especially in the Far North where those Rugers were ment to be used,
Bob