I am considering ordering a Dakota rifle in 458 Lott. How good are these rifles? Are they worth the asking price?

IMO no they are not.....they seriously over rate their wood grades and for the asking price one could have a very good custom built by a known smith.

Thewy might have been a superb gun in the past but I'd not look to Dakota today for a top shelf gun.

Dakota are so-so. Inconsistent quality.

Don't know. But I don't like the pricing, nor the styling of that wide open, rearward arching pistol grip.

IMO. Overpriced for a mostly factory rifle. You can do much better for the same coin.

That said they are fine useable rifles.

John

Investigate Ed Brown or Sisk or Hill Country Rifles if you want to spend the big bucks and have something truly yours. Nesika Bay actions run about $1100-1500 (Dakotas are $1800+) and you can get one in 60 days. They have a slew of different models and can put the bolt on one side and the ejection port on the other, if that's what you want. And they are gorgeous pieces of work; check out the Hunter and Classic actions. My next build will be a .223 or .22-250 on a Nesika.

http://www.nesika.com
http://www.nesika.com/actions.htm

I have two Dakota rifles from a while ago, seven or eight years I think. I had to send the rifles back for a couple of reasons including what I thought was poor wood for the money, I wanted exhibition english walnut, and a few quality control issues including an off centerline barrel band swivel stud. I got what I wanted but it took some firm resolve including telling the Allens that either the rifles needed to be what I wanted or they could keep the rifles. In the end I got two really great rifles with really great wood, but three stocks were rejected and they ended up sending me blanks for approval. I kept sending them back til I got two I thought were great.

I've looked at some newer Dakotas and have gone the full custom route since then.

By the way I really like the open grip and find it quicker and more comfortable than a tighter grip. In fact I love the stock design as a whole.

If I were to want a good quality rifle at a good price I would shop the second hand market for a good custom rifle or a good second hand Dakota. But I'm a lefty and its tough finding what I'm looking for.

JPK

I bought one in Jan. 1994 from Kesselring's Gun Shop of Burlington, WA. It has very nice Q-sawn English, a Shilen barrel and was made circa 1988 as far as I can tell. It is very accurate with Nosler 250 Partition Gold Molyfrees over 77 gr. RE-22 and with Fed. factory 225 TBBCs and the stock design handles very well for me.

The rifle was returned twice for some custom touchs and minor parts fitting and it would not feed properly until I substituted a P-64 Mod. 70 follower for the Dakota unit which made it feed like dambusters and eject everything into the same small circle. I do not care for the flimsy ball detente bolt shroud lock, but, consider this action to be a superb design otherwise.

I called Dakota about obtaining a new shroud/lock just last spring as well as a front banded ramp; they said that they would contact me concerning this but never did. My impression is that Dakota is now a pretty crappy outfit and I certainly wouldn't buy another rifle from them. I might add that I got a hell of a deal on the one I have, but, there are better options available, even built on a re-worked Dakota action.

If, a person finds a nice used one, it is a good platform to customize, if the price is right. Overall, considering the price charged by Dakota, I would buy an Echol's Legend, or a Browning Safari FN-LE and change out the crappy alloy TG-mag. box and garish Claro stock.....and have a better rifle, IMO.

Those Neisk actions look top rate. Thanks for the tip. Does anyone know of any other stainless left handed long actions suitable for 375 H&H - 458 Lott cartridges?

Dakota rifle used to be priced reasonably, but their prices have more than doubled in the last ten years or so.

I build my own rifles and I have used some of their actions. they are OK, but I have found it cheaper to buy a pre-64 Winchester and rework it. That is why you can find true custom rifles built for the same price as a mass produced Dakota. There are so many magazine rifle builders out their, it is worth a look somewhere else.

As for wood, they take a marginal $200 piece of English Walnut and call it Exhibition grade. This is pretty much standard for Dakota. Find a true custom builder and go for it.

Buy a used one. I bought a new one in 1995 and the retail price has increased $200.00 per year since then. No way can I afford them now.
John

quote:

Originally posted by kutenay:
I bought one in Jan. 1994 from Kesselring's Gun Shop of Burlington, WA. .

Ron Kesselring hand selects and sends wood to Dakota for each and every rifle that Kesselrings sell. Ron has told me many times that the wood that Dakota uses is for shingles, slats, and pallets not for gunstocks.

Empire makes a nicer rifle for less money. If you have to have a M70 go custom, or buy a used custom rifle. For $3500 you can usually find something a hell of a lot nicer than you can spend $5000 on through Dakota.

If you are talking about a wood stocked rifle, I tried the "buy a good used rifle from a famous gun maker" route. I won't embarass anybody by naming names-all of them were beautifully to look at, but worked terribly. Poor feeding, poor accuracy, stiff and nearly unworkable safeties-the list goes on. In each case it was quickly apparent why the rifle was on the used market in the first place-stupid me. I went with Dakota for my wood stocked rifles, and have been pretty happy. I have four-three are tack drivers, one shoots OK. They feed well, and I haven't had any problems with them. The criticism about the wood upgrades is appropriate. I simply don't get an upgrade, and the wood has been pretty decent. I use my rifles hard, so exhibition grade anything doesn't interest me. Wood stocked rifles from a good gun maker (HCR, Echols, Miller, Holehan)run in the $15,000-20,000 range. I too am intrigued by Empire rifles, but they do cost a bit more if you go the wood stocked route. I'm sure there will be multiple retorts, but I have found it difficult to get a wood stocked rifle, with the action worked over and a good barrel, built for less than $4000, assuming you are starting from scratch (ie don't have an action in hand) and don't do some of the work yourself. You are from AK-if you are talking about a synthetic stocked rifle the situation changes-by all means go with an Echols, HCR, Simillion, etc.

The fit and finish on Empire rifles is not so hot, although I prefer them to Dakota.

My only experience with buying a custom rifle was about 12 years ago. I purchased a used (but never shot) left handed Brown precision rifle on a Rem 700 action rebarreled to 450 ackely, Win 3 position safety added, custom finish,etc. Rifle looked gorgeous. Decided to load up some dummy rounds to see if the feeding and cycling was ok before I headed to the range. Not one round reguardless of bullet type would feed. Took Brown 2 months to correct that. Since then I just been shy of spending extra cash to see if I get something that will work as well as what I buy off the shelf, go figure.

You can get a better rifle from Roger Biesen and less costly than a Dakota.

Regards,

Terry

I think Dakotas are decent rifles for about $2,000 to $2,500. Unfortunately you can't get one for anywhere near that price.

quote:

Originally posted by Mikelravy:
I think Dakotas are decent rifles for about $2,000 to $2,500. Unfortunately you can't get one for anywhere near that price.

Your onto it!

Interesting observations on Dakota rifles. What is more interesting is they continue to raise the prices on their rifles and they still seem to sell every one of them.

If you are going to spend $5,000 for a rifle, I would suggest that you meet the manufacturer face to face and discuss the details of what you want including hand selecting the wood. That way, there are no surprises.

There are a bunch of very happy Dakota owners out there - including me...

My go-to 375 H&H is a Dakota from when you could buy the Safari with a Clifton synthetic stock. I never had any problems with the action but the thing just would not shoot and Dakota was no help even after sending the rifle to them. I ended up screwing a Douglas SS barrel into it and it has been a joy ever since. I added a teflon finish and the rifle has served be very well. Would I buy another Dakota? No! Their customer service is delivered with an attitude. They basically just pissed me off.

Mark

P.S. The rifle is for sale as I'm about to have Lon Paul build a 375 Weatherby for me. E-mail if you might be interested.

Mark,

I have to agree that my experience with resolving problems was irritating at a minimum. In particular I really didn't apreciate the arguemnt coming from Dakota. If it isn't what the customer wanted it isn't right. Period.

On the other hand both my rifles shoot very well, especially the 375H&H.

JPK

IMO they are terribly over priced, there are so many fantastic struggling new gunmakers out there that will build you an equally good rifle for half the money, the trick is finding them, they get started then go broke...

What is your budget for the rifle you are going to purchase?

quote:

Originally posted by Snowwolfe:
I am considering ordering a Dakota rifle in 458 Lott. How good are these rifles? Are they worth the asking price?

I just looked at the price of a Dakota rifle in 458 Lott and have to say that " For that price why not look at a double rifle"?

luvrecoletta,

Well budgets are like glass vases....they are made to be broken!. I was thinking of about 4k or less and was just tossing the idea of a Dakota around. Being left handed my options are somewhat limited but if I get another large rifle I may just buy a LH win 70 and have it rebarreled and go from there for about 1500 tops.

Snowwolf,

How about giving Waffenfabrik Hein a look. They make southpaw actions and are up there quality wise.

Waffenfabrik Hein

Snowwolfe,

Roger Biesen, great rifles, honest people, great craftmanship, you can't go wrong.
Much better than Dakota, for about the same price you have a full blown custom gun.
http://www.biesen.com/

Success,
Roland

As I said in the above post I'm going to get a rifle built for me by Lon Paul. If you can live with a basic SS Model 70 action, douglas XX SS barrel and an Echols synthetic stock you can bring a buffalo stomper in at $2500-$2700 all tweaked and ready to rock through Lon. Of course if you start adding drop box mags, NECG's sights etc. the price goes up quickly. I think if you can pay Dakota prices this is a much better way to go with a better product.

Regards,

Mark