I'm thinking of converting a BRNO 602 to 500 jefferey or 505 gibbs - anyone have a prefrence?

I see a Pac-Nor barrel and the regular bells and whistles for the sights, etc...

No way would I put a muzzle-break on it!

I also see a small mercury recoil reducer in the forearm (probably have to be custom made to accomodate the barrel's recoil lug) and at least one in the butt.

What should this gun wiegh? Close to 12lbs? Even with a reducer in the forearm and the butt?

Anyone done this? Howe effective are the combined recoil reducers?

Also, what diameter bulled does cylindrical .404 jeffrey brass hold (without modification?)

The BRNO 602 is not the optimal action for either the 500 Jeffery or the 505 Gibbs.



As for the 500 Jeff, the BRNO 602 is much longer than is necessary for that cartridge so you end up with an oversized action carrying a short cartridge. A well done Mauser 98 is perfectly suitable for the 500 Jeff.



As for the 505 Gibbs, due to the large rim diameter (0.640"), there is not much left of the bolt (0.700" diameter) of the BRNO 602 after it is opened up for the Gibbs. It can be made to work, but a 0.750" bolt will serve you better. Granite Mountain Arms makes a magnum mauser for the .505 with a .750" bolt. Another option is a P14 enfield (not P17) which has an extended recoil lug on the left side, but there is so much labor involved in getting the action ready that you are better off just buying a GMA action.



Another option is to wait until mid 2005 when CZ will offer the CZ550 in 505. Unless CZ changes the action design of the CZ550, it will suffer from the same disadvantages as the BRNO 602.



Personally I would get a mauser 98 in 500 Jeff set up by an expert like Ryan Breeding, Duane Wiebe, Sterling Davenport. If you do not have your 500 jeff set up by an expert, it might not feed.



Weight: 11 or 12 pounds



Mercury tubes: 1 in forearm and 2 in butt. They WORK. If you are in SLC, I will let you shoot a rifle with one and I guarantee you will be convinced.



Barrel: 24" to keep muzzle blast reasonable.

I don't want to speak for him, but a regular poster on this forum, JEFFEOSSO, has built a .500 J on an Enfield action. He has said a few times that it would be much easier to build a 500A2. Brass is readily available, the bolt diameter of the CZ550 is made for the 416 Rigby, which is essentially the same diameter as the 500A2. Feeding would be MUCH easier to obtain. Just a thought.

Mike,
that's exactly right...

If you start with a 550 in 416 rigby, doing it in a 460 weatherby based case is a breeze...

the 500 jeffe is a BEAR to get to feed...

if i did another one, i would start with a cz 550 or MRM long action (not wait for the PH) and go from there..

the barrel MUST have a recoil lug on it...

9.5", no tube, kicks like heck...

11# with tube, it's pleassant
jeffe

500, you've voiced the concern about bolt diameter several times when the subject arose and I am curious as to the disadvantage of the thin rim issue on the CZ/505. I can see a certain fragility if the bolt were dropprd on something hard and rolled that edge over but what is the operational disadvantage?

As another 500 Jeffrey on an enfield owner, I concur with Jeff, go A-sq, it is much easier and less expensive, and the difference in case capacity isn't worth the effort.

If you have to have a classic chambering, I'd go 505 gibbs, with considerations of 500 gr comments.

What about cylindrical 404 jeffrey - anyone know what diameter bullet that case would hold?





Silly me - a cylindrical 404 wouldn't have anything to head-space off of!



Ok, then how large a bullet (wildcat) has the 404 been necked up to?

Thanks for responding. I can't disagree in principal; I just don't make a Principal's salary so I went with the CZ.

Get the 500 cal and not the sissy 404 (.423)
500 A-Square or Jeffery not .505.
You want a cal. .510 and not a .505
More bullets available.

535 grn and 2400 fps is a nice combo

Get a DWM 1909 Argentina mauser or go CZ 550.

Cheers,

Andr�

New guy

Waffenfabrik Hein in USA makes an action specially tailored for the 500 Jeffery, it's wider than normal action and is not to long. http://www.rifleactions.com/

My choice would be 450 Rigby rimless or 500 Jeffery. A 450 Rigby rimless stoaked with 550-600 grain bullets will hopefully deliver the message

Selection of 458 bullets wide, from cheap plinking bullets to premium missiles

Cheers
/ JOHAN

It can't be set up any better than this:

really? an '09 will handle the jeffrey? Guess I didn't realize there was that much room in there... hell, i know where a good 09 is! Spend a few hundred on that - then i've got to get the grissel bottom metal - which is about another 400. An '09 can get expensive pretty quickly.

Harald Wolf builds on the DWM 1909 Argentino mauser action.

He is very expensive and do not do this over night.

Cheers,

Andr�

Yes, there are a lot of good gun builders out there that will build a nice bolt gun for 5,6 - some even 10 thousand... No, I've been down the expensive bolt-action route before. The problem with that model is, 4 or 5 thousand dollars in a bolt gun equals a heafty deposit on a double!

I was hoping to have a little "inexpensive" fun with the 50 caliber, but I'm not going to put a whole lot of money into a bolt gun (no offense to the bolt gun guys.)

.

.

Yup Alf, but they are NOT OPTIMAL.



The 602 action is too long for the 500 Jeff, and the bolt body diameter is too small for the 505 Gibbs. Is that a magazine block behind the cartridge in the picture?



Just because someone did it in the old days does not mean it was the best way to do it. Those guys drove Model A Fords too. We don't drive Model A's today, do we?

Alf,
every time I look at that first pic, of the feeding, I just cry at the simplicity and elegance, and WISH i could do that well

thanks
jeffe

.

.

You have a PM, Alf.

I can reccomend SABI in Nelspruit So. Africa. A PH friend in Zim has one built by them . It's on a military 98 action with their own bottom metal (dropped)NECG banded front ramp. Nice quarter rib on 20" Bbl with banded sling swivel.Their own ghost ring rear on the rear ring. Fully adjustable. Timney trigger and 2 position Mdl 70 style safety. Very nice piece of turkish walnut with very very good fit and nice fine checkering. Feeds flawlessly and is quite accurate. All in all a VERY nice gun. Took about 10 months. They have a web site and I would highly reccomend them. Fit and finish are excellant. I don't know what their prices are now. This was cheap as the rand was at about 12
when it was ordered and paid for. They have a measurement system like none I have ever seen and the results are truly a CUSTOM fit second to none.

Alf,



As I explained above, the action is longer than is necessary for the 500 Jeffery. And so a magazine block is used to take up the extra room. Keep in mind that a magnum mauser is intended to take the 416 Rigby which has a length of 3.75" compared to the 500 Jeffery of 3.465". Using a magnum mauser (long) action for a 500 Jeff is like using a standard Model 98 to build a .308 Winchester - there's more room than necessary in there. Unless the extra room is filled up, problems can arise. Why not just use an action that is the correct size for the cartridge?



The Duane Wiebe rifle pictured is the most elegant solution.

I have a 500 jeffery built on a 98 action that has a single stack drop box bottom metal and feeds with the help of spring clips that come in from the sides like the 425WR.It seems to feed very well.

WVFRED

Somewhere in my shop I have a non-descript M98 that I have set up with a Home made single stack mag for the 500 AHR( 500 jeffery improved). The action has s spring set-up ala a WR to control the feeding. It seems to work well with dummy rounds. In my opinion a M98 would need to be re-heat treated to survive any serious number of full house rounds. I have lost interest in this thing and if anyone wants to complete the project let me know.-Rob

Rob,

I bet you a can of coca-cola that Jeffe will have an interest...