Was over on AuctionArms.com when I found some .405 Winchester ammo loaded with 400 grain bullets to a velocity of 2000 fps. I contacted the loader who turned out to be a commercial loader specializing in obsolte cartridge loading.

The ammo probably won't work in M95 Winchesters but will work just fine in TC Encores and Ruger #1s.
After emailing with this gentlemen it turns out he makes the bullet that are loaded in the rounds. He was also agreeable to sell me 20 bullets just to try. The bullets came yesterday...they were not quite the quality I was expecting...they were FAR beyond. If they shoot and preform as good as they look this should be one great penetrator for the .405 Winchester.

Contact Bob Shell at Shell Reloading Rel4350@aol.com

Bob

Bob,

Can you post photos of the bullets, so the .405 shooters can see for themselves?

George

The closeup feature on my camera program is messed up so I can not right now but will as soon as I can. Best I can describe them would be a Barns Classic or Hornady .416 RN. They are nothing like the squat little 300 grain bullets from Hornady. The diameter is .412. The jacket is more silverish in color and has expansion notches in the nose...something I did not expect on a "home made" bullet.
I wrote and asked if he had any plans for a FMJ RN....wouldn't that be something Teddy would have liked!
Bob

Just received a reply to my note to Mr. Shell. He makes bullets from 180 to 400 grains including a 400 grain solid for the .405. Email him and he will send you his online catalog.
I can not open it right now because the crash that took my camera also took my "Word"...Bob

Another question for those of you who have "been there and done that" on large dangerous game....how would you rate a 400 grain .411 bullet of decent construction at 2000 fps muzzle velocity... a little slow or ok? Would a solid due for braining an elephant?

Thanks,

Bob

A .411 bore with a 400 gr. bullet at 2000 FPS will kill anything on this earth...The 450-400 comes to mind and its a proven track record..In its original loadings that made its reputation that was probably the true velocity it had...

I am suspecious the Model 95 can take a steady diet of such loads, it may be quite dangerous in the hot climes...Like the man told you it was developed for No. 1s....Why risk injury or ruining a nice rifle for a couple of hundred FPS...

quote:

Originally posted by RJM:
Would a solid due for braining an elephant?

Thanks,

Bob

Bob,

I have a Ruger #1 in .405 Win that I have shot a lot. I have throated it deeper where bullets can be seated out about 1/4" more. The 400gr bullets are the most accurate and the Woodleigh 400gr .411 soft will shot 1/2" groups at 100yds with a 2080fps MV. That said, these loads are at the pressures of the .416 Rem Mag and I agree with Atkinson and wouldn't want to use them in a Win 95. They are too long as I load them anyway.

I have also made sizing dies to reduce .416" bullets to .412". The new Hornady InterBond and encapsulated solid .416 bullets sized to .412" are also wonderfully accurate in the old .405.

As to your question quoted above:

I tested the new Hornady Encapsulated solid (again sized to .412") against some of my stringy semi-petrified Laurel logs. I put a .375 H&H with a 300gr Hornady steel-jacketed solid right next to it. (old steel jacketed Hornady before the newer bronze one).

The 400gr .412" Hornady at 2050fps impact penetrated 62 inches deep! The .375 at 2400fps impact was five inches less........

While I have not personally "brained" an elephant; the wealth of experience here can tell you there are bigger bullets in Africa than the ol' .375.......... But I don't think anyone will tell you the 300gr Steel-jacketed solid from it lacks penetration in DG....

BigRx

Thanks so much for the opinions and information.

Ray, this guy doesn't recommend that these loads be fired in a M95. They will probably chamber but are way too long for the magazine. At 2000 fps they probably hurt the shooter more than the gun. His test rifle is a TC Encore (I can not even imagine that one) and it doesn't hurt that break open. I looked up the loads on the 450/400 and saw that they were in the 1900-2100 fps area. Guess a .405 with 400 grains bullets would share good company.

Rx....what powders do you use for heavy bullets? Mr. shell gave me what he considers the max loading for WW760 and IMR4895. I have reloaded for almost 40 years and know how to work up a load but choosing the right powder from what one has on hand rather than going out and buying some powder for just one gun is a little wasteful. Your resizing .416 bullets down to .411/412 sounds great. I wonder if a Corbin die and press could be made up to do the same thing.
I just can hardly wait to see what other bullets this guy has to offer..but until the computer guy can come over "Word" is dead...

Thanks again....Bob

RJM
I don't have the testicular fortitude, nor shoulder to launch some of those 400 grainers at 2,000 or 1,800 fps. But my standard for my Winchester 95 is 54 grains of IMR 3031 behind a 350 grain cast slug.
56 grains was nearly as accurate but the shooter failed the test. That load was real enthusiastic!
Considering the velocities of the 405 it's a cast bullet gun. Before you find bullet failure with a cast bullet, because of high pressure, etc. you and the gun will have gone south.
Jim

quote:

Originally posted by RJM:

Rx....what powders do you use for heavy bullets? Mr. shell gave me what he considers the max loading for WW760 and IMR4895. I have reloaded for almost 40 years and know how to work up a load but choosing the right powder from what one has on hand rather than going out and buying some powder for just one gun is a little wasteful. Your resizing .416 bullets down to .411/412 sounds great. I wonder if a Corbin die and press could be made up to do the same thing.
I just can hardly wait to see what other bullets this guy has to offer..but until the computer guy can come over "Word" is dead...

Thanks again....Bob

Bob,

I like H-4895 for the softs and I use R-15 for the solids. Both are uniform in the .405. R-15 seems to like the Fed 215 primer. I won't post loads as mine are for the free-bored throat and would be hot for a standard chamber configuration even in a #1.

Yes Corbin makes a die similar to mine. It will take a powerful press though! I size to .414" in one die, then to .412" in the second and it works an old RCBS A-2 press I have that is a powerful press compared to most new ones.

The solids take a third die as the very thick jacket springs back about a thousandth. These are a bear to do and I would probably buy Woodleigh 400gr .411" solids (for the .450/.400) if I wanted enough for a hunt.

Let us know on these bullets you have found from this new guy. I bet several of us would like some close up pictures if you can get your camera going.

BigRx

Bob,
If I was going to shoot an elephant with the No1 in 405 I would use a Woodleigh. You can get them from Midway or Huntingtons. I would not want to try a "home made" solid. As long as my 400gr velocity was above 1950 fps I think they would do the job.
The 480 Woodleighs from my 450 No2 I recovered could be reloaded and fired again, except for one that went through the braun cavity, and split down the sides when it hit the spine. Range was 6 yards, frontal brain.

You might get a Bridger 350 gr. .411 bullet, if they still make them..That would be a pretty good elephant bullet, that hard flat nose solid really penitrates...Pierre van Tonder and I killed some buffalo with them in my 450-400 a few years ago, and they really zapped the black bulls from stem to stern.

I have a supply of those old 350 gr. Bridger flat nose solids in .423 caliber that I have set aside for my 10.74x68 as I can churn up 2415 FPS with them and a dose of IMR-4198..

Northfork is offering a 360 grain in the .411.

I have some 300's in .411 on order and he said they should be available around the middle of May. Not sure of the avaiability of the 360's.

A 360 gr. Northfork would then be my choice of bullet for a 405 WCF...