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Winchester 70 conversion to .458 Lott Login/Join
 
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Picture of Dieseltrucker
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All,

I am left handed. I have acquired a magnum length LH Winchester 70. I plan to convert to .458 Lott by my hometown gunsmith. The donor gun has one crossbolt in the stock. I need suggestions on barrel length, overall weight( I am thinking 10 pounds), and any other pertinent information relating to a re-barrel of such a heavy recoiling rifle. Thanks!
 
Posts: 241 | Location: Alabama  | Registered: 30 November 2009Reply With Quote
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Whatever details you decide upon, just make sure your local guy is up to doing it correctly.


Hunting: Exercising dominion over creation at 2800 fps.
 
Posts: 3114 | Location: Southern US | Registered: 21 July 2002Reply With Quote
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I am very fond of barrels 22" to 24" in length, with a banded ramp front sight, a pop up peep or folding peep sight or a single standing rear sight (non folding).
I absolutely detest muzzle brakes.
458 Lott has some recoil but it isn't unmanageable, if you like shoot standard 458 Win in it.
Make sure it is well bedded and that it feeds like butter, accept no substitute.
Before starting make sure that this is a project your local guy "can do", "wants to do" and that you work out a time frame with him so your expectations are met.
Good luck on your project!
 
Posts: 5604 | Location: Eastern plains of Colorado | Registered: 31 October 2005Reply With Quote
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As a total noob, I feel that the magazine box(s) on the win 70 is too small for it.

With the wide older ones the rounds do not sit high enough to be picked up by the bolt as much as I'd like, and the narrower mag boxes that are bent at the rear places the rounds better (higher) but would sometimes pop a round loose from the feed lips when the bolt is worked hard.

I've since gone to a CZ for my irrational 458 lott craving.

Will have to find a solution for the win 70 later though, as it's a nice rifle other than those set backs.

Maybe I'm just spoiled by the reliability of my semi-auto AK's, AR's and pistols...
 
Posts: 72 | Location: Colorado | Registered: 05 April 2013Reply With Quote
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I rebored a m70 375 classic stainless to 458 and chambered it in 458 Lott. 22" barrel iron sights weighing 9 lbs scoped. No issues feeding and shoots very well.

 
Posts: 395 | Location: Canada | Registered: 06 March 2010Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Dieseltrucker:
All,

I am left handed. I have acquired a magnum length LH Winchester 70.

What year was it made? Classic from Connecticut or later?
What is the current chambering?


I plan to convert to .458 Lott by my hometown gunsmith. The donor gun has one crossbolt in the stock.

Add a second crossbolt in the little web between trigger well and magazine well.
Use steel allthread hidden in epoxy, or plugged or visible oversize head, whatever to match the current one to your liking.
Get a secondary recoil lug on the barrel for a walnut or laminate stock. All thread there too, for a third crossbolt.
And get pillars with glass bedding from the barrel lug back.


I need suggestions on barrel length,

23" minimum or 25" maximum is to my liking.
If you cut it to 21" barrel, your 3.6"-COL .458 Lott will equal a 24"-barreled, 3.4"-COL .458 WinMag at same pressure.


overall weight( I am thinking 10 pounds),

9 to 9.5 lbs dry weight of rifle is more usual.
You will add 1 to 2 pounds to that when you get it field ready, depending on how you ready it.
A 10-pound-dry-weight .458 Lott is going to turn into 11 to 12 pounds in the field
if you scope it and load it.
It will be 10.5 pounds with 4 rounds and iron sights.
The last generation of Ruger RSM .458 Lott: About 9.25 lbs with 23" barrel was about perfect.
A 25"-barreled, Pre-'64 Winchester M70 African .458 WinMag weighed 9.0 lbs.
Don't re-chamber or re-barrel one of those to .458 Lott.
They only made 1226 of them, and they are worth considerably more as .458 WinMags.
Wink

and any other pertinent information relating to a re-barrel of such a heavy recoiling rifle. Thanks!

Oops. Forgot the uber reinforcement for a .458 or larger caliber DGR: Use about 5"-length of 3/8"-diameter steel allthread, hidden in epoxy, through the long axis of the grip of the stock.
Deep drill from just behind the grip cap toward the middle of the rear action screw/pillar.
Do this if you have a walnut or laminate stock.
Plug the entrance hole cosmetically,
unless you are able to get it hidden under the grip cap.

Oops again: Get a barrel-mounted front sling stud, or a forend tip stud. Brockman style is primo, or mount the Uncle Mike's type of stud on the foremost tip of the stock, with a nut hidden in epoxy.
You'll figure it out.
tu2


Rip
.
 
Posts: 28032 | Location: KY | Registered: 09 December 2001Reply With Quote
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RIP,

I am not sure on the year made. I assume (although one hates to) is a New Haven gun from what little I have gathered. (perhaps some of the other south paws could chime in as to where one ascertains the year produced from our Winchesters??)

The donor originally was going to be a custom shop .340 Weatherby. However, it is stainless and a rather nice rifle, so I opted to cannibalize a 7STW chromemoly instead.

After some candid conversations with the hometown smith, we both agreed that this OUGHT to be sent out for someone in the dangerous game smithing. I then queried the infinite knowledge base in the custom guns section for suggested builder. One of the suggested was none other than our very own, toomanytools. I late afternoon phone call and bang, a deal was struck.

I am thinking 23 inches for barrel, but John is pushing for 25. Perhaps we meet in the middle?

As for weight, I have always appreciated heft in my higher recoiling rifles. You bring up an excellent distinction. I was thinking the whole package out the door would be around 10-11 neighborhood.

I want iron sites and well as a barrel band. Suggestions?????

Nice turkish walnut for the stock. Dense and straight grained.

What bottom metal to get the most rounds??

What else am I missing?
 
Posts: 241 | Location: Alabama  | Registered: 30 November 2009Reply With Quote
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Built a 458 lott on a LH early 2000's Mod 70. It broke the bolts on the test fire fixture at Trinidad! I used a 26" Lilja barrel. #5 contour IIRC. Hoped to get more velocity for extra powder with longer barrel. Added an additional recoil lug on the barrel. Added mercury tubes in butt and fore-end and went a little nuts on bedding compound. Sub 1 MOA w Barnes tsx but case is too long to crimp at crimp groove unless you shorten case. Fitted iron sights and low power Leupold.

HTH,
Steve
 
Posts: 1739 | Location: Maryland | Registered: 17 January 2004Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Dieseltrucker:
RIP,

I am not sure on the year made. I assume (although one hates to) is a New Haven gun from what little I have gathered. (perhaps some of the other south paws could chime in as to where one ascertains the year produced from our Winchesters??)


I guess it is a Classic from Connecticut.
Some fear sabotage for 2005-2006 last year of production.
Something like Monday morning and Friday afternoon production in most things.
You can call BACO and ask them to give you the year from your serial number: 800-333-3288
Or give us a serial number with XX for the last two digits and sumbuddy who know might chime in.


The donor originally was going to be a custom shop .340 Weatherby. However, it is stainless and a rather nice rifle, so I opted to cannibalize a 7STW chromemoly instead.

After some candid conversations with the hometown smith, we both agreed that this OUGHT to be sent out for someone in the dangerous game smithing. I then queried the infinite knowledge base in the custom guns section for suggested builder. One of the suggested was none other than our very own, toomanytools. I late afternoon phone call and bang, a deal was struck.

I am thinking 23 inches for barrel, but John is pushing for 25. Perhaps we meet in the middle?

Yep, 23 to 25 inches. I can't decide either. Wink

As for weight, I have always appreciated heft in my higher recoiling rifles. You bring up an excellent distinction. I was thinking the whole package out the door would be around 10-11 neighborhood.

Then you need a 9 to 9.5-pound bare-naked-empty rifle to load up to 10 to 11 lbs. tu2

I want iron sites and well as a barrel band. Suggestions?????

Wisner's copy of the M70 African rear sight,
or just start scrolling around at NECG for what suits your fancy.


Nice turkish walnut for the stock. Dense and straight grained.

Keep it beautiful, do all the stock reinforcement mentioned above. tu2

What bottom metal to get the most rounds??

What else am I missing?

I'll start adding some bottom metal stuff below.


















Wiebe bottom metal is built like a bank vault,
thick-walled, one-piece bottom metal with integral box, no sheet metal.
Custom made to fit your cartridge and action:





Another option for a drop-floor-plate/drop-box magazine, this time with stock to match:



Parts you need for the last one above:



And some sight system suggestions, this one on a 1958-vintage Winchester M70 .300 H&H action donor:














Rip
.
 
Posts: 28032 | Location: KY | Registered: 09 December 2001Reply With Quote
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Dang, Rip, you shore know how to get the juices flowing! I'll be checking my '53 70 Winnie for tapped holes for a Foolproof! This is gonna be ROUGH on my bank account.
 
Posts: 432 | Location: Wyoming/ Idaho, St Joe river | Registered: 17 November 2005Reply With Quote
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Rip,

Thank you for the great info!!
 
Posts: 241 | Location: Alabama  | Registered: 30 November 2009Reply With Quote
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Dieseltrucker,

Here is an example of .458 Lott rifle bare-naked-empty/"dry" weight
versus field-ready/loaded weight:




Rip
.
 
Posts: 28032 | Location: KY | Registered: 09 December 2001Reply With Quote
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The 53 is tapped for receiver sight. Good to go!
 
Posts: 432 | Location: Wyoming/ Idaho, St Joe river | Registered: 17 November 2005Reply With Quote
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Is the reinforcement at the front of the mag box a must? Will the rounds eventually dent the sheet metal under recoil?
 
Posts: 72 | Location: Colorado | Registered: 05 April 2013Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Quickstrike:
Is the reinforcement at the front of the mag box a must? Will the rounds eventually dent the sheet metal under recoil?


If you have any space ahead of the sheet metal box's front wall, you WILL get dents,
from the bullet meplats smacking in recoil.
That is definitely a potential feeding issue waiting to happen at the most inopportune moment.











If the bedding is such as to be tight against that wall, no reinforcement is needed.
So a pad of epoxy can be used to support the front of the box.
But there is often plenty of room for a reinforcing steel plate to be soldered onto the box,
which I think is flash, and a more sound way of bedding.

If you have Duane Wiebe or other integral magazine box of thick steel at front wall (not one of the sheet-metal boxes),
that'll do.





Wisner floor plate and reinforced sheetmetal boxes, ain't bad:





tu2

Rip
.
 
Posts: 28032 | Location: KY | Registered: 09 December 2001Reply With Quote
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Rip,

The info is solid. Thanks for going to the trouble to post pics. I am a visual learner.

I take it your a GOT fan????!!
 
Posts: 241 | Location: Alabama  | Registered: 30 November 2009Reply With Quote
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