I just purchased a 416 rem barrel for my R8...included as part of the deal were a few boxes of custom loaded ammo by Safari Arms. The ammo that has me a little confused are 80 rounds of Barnes TSX marked "Reduced Velocity-2200 FPS". If you were going to have custom ammo made for practice why load a premium bullet and if these are hunting loads..are they simply for a "recoil sensitive" shooter?

..or am I missing the obvious? I plan on taking this rifle to Zambia next year and would happily use this ammo but I'm not sure I shouldn't just go with a standard 2400 FPS load...

what say you?

The 404 Jeffery made it's reputation with virtually those velocities, even a little less, and with bullets nowhere as good as the TSX so I don't think I would worry.

Here is a simple observation:

I shoot reduced velocity loads using hard cast lead bullets in my 404 and when compared to full tilt TSX's of similar weight the lead bullet fully penetrate a steel plate on our range and the TSX's stick in the plate ! go figure?

Its meaningless per se as a comparison unless the game animals one is about to hunt are driving around in armoured cars

2200 fps on a TSX on a 404 is more than ample as a game getter ! There are little of anything walking or crawling that is not going to go down when hit well with a .423 TSX doing 2200 fps !

2200 FPS will kill game just fine as others comment.

It may be that the factory full velocity ammo (which at times was loaded a bit too hot) caused some issues with sticking in a straight pull action like your Blaser. Less mechanical advantage compared to the camming of a turn bolt. It may be that the previous owner was just trying to make sure it functioned smoothly.

Is the TSX ammo you got loaded with 400 gr bullets ?

I have found the .416 shooting 400 gr. bullets at 2400 FPS is a much better Buffalo load and I've used both..If I were to cut my velocity back at all it would be with a 450 gr. Woodleigh at 2300 FPS.

Why would anyone cut back to 2100 to 2200 FPS and use a load from yesteryear, The .404 got a lot of complaints with their original loads at 2100 FPS and shortly thereafter kynoch jumped it up to 2300 to 2350 FPS to satisfy the complaints, and that's the load that made the 404 famous contrary to some reports.

IM not saying 2100 FPS wouldn't kill a buffalo, Ive shot too many with a 450-400 to believe that but then I wouldn't load my 30-06 down to a 30-30 either, and Ive shot deer and elk with a 30-30 in my youth..

Just my two bits, and I don't doubt its been done a thousand times, just can't see why unless one is recoil sensitive to a 416 or 404 in which case it makes a little more since, but going to a .375 might be an even better option under such circumstances.

quote:

Originally posted by Cold Trigger Finger:
Is the TSX ammo you got loaded with 400 gr bullets ?

I'll be damned..I took a second look when I got home and sure enough they are 300grain TSX at 2200fps. I should have looked more closely before posting. What would this load be for?

quote:

Originally posted by Heym 450/400:

quote:

Originally posted by Cold Trigger Finger:
Is the TSX ammo you got loaded with 400 gr bullets ?

I'll be damned..I took a second look when I got home and sure enough they are 300grain TSX at 2200fps. I should have looked more closely before posting. What would this load be for?

Target practice

When I purchased my old Jeffery 404 it came with paper wrapped cartons of Kynoch ammo which state on the front of the box
" IMPORTANT Muzzle velocity increased to 2225 ft/sec. Rifles sighted for cordite cartridges should be re-zeroed."

There is no doubt that sometimes higher velocity can make a difference but it will never replace bullet placement,( which is usually easier with less recoil), and bullet performance.

quote:

I shoot reduced velocity loads using hard cast lead bullets in my 404 and when compared to full tilt TSX's of similar weight the lead bullet fully penetrate a steel plate on our range and the TSX's stick in the plate ! go figure? Its meaningless per se as a comparison unless the game animals one is about to hunt are driving around in armoured cars

Maybe not meaningful to most but Not quite meaningless. It means that your reduced velocity Cast bullet properly directed to the vitals of that game animal will highly like result in the death of said animal. I prove that almost every year and I bet you have too in your shooting career.
Best regards,

Phil,
Your absolutely right, bullet placement can make the 30-06 and elephant gun, and has many times, as has the .308 Win.

I am working up practise loads for my daughter's new 416 Rem with 400 gr bullets @ 2000 fps. They should be stiff enough for realistic practice and still easy on the shoulder.
And I have no doubt will work on bears as well.

quote:

Originally posted by 458Win:
I am working up practise loads for my daughter's new 416 Rem with 400 gr bullets @ 2000 fps. They should be stiff enough for realistic practice and still easy on the shoulder.
And I have no doubt will work on bears as well.

Those will work, though you might consider the 350grain weights, too. Those have worked fine on cape buffalo could be loaded down to 2000-2200 for practice, maybe even easier on the shoulder.

quote:

Originally posted by Heym 450/400:

quote:

Originally posted by Cold Trigger Finger:
Is the TSX ammo you got loaded with 400 gr bullets ?

I'll be damned..I took a second look when I got home and sure enough they are 300grain TSX at 2200fps. I should have looked more closely before posting. What would this load be for?

Might be good for pigs, although I'd expect them to pencil through unless you hit the shoulder.

In a 9lb rifle 300g at 2200 fps produces 34 ft/lbs or recoil vs a 400g at 2400 fps produces 65 ft/lbs and a 450g at 2150 fps (Norma PH Ammo specs) produces 62 ft/lbs.

It appears the original owner was trying to bring the .416 down to 9,3x62 recoil levels for target practise

I may be wrong but I've never seen the benefit in learning to shoot big bores by shooting reduced loads, it would seem more practicle to shoot a .375 instead of a loaded down .416..

Shooting reduced loads then going to shoot buffalo and the sudden increase in recoil scares the sox off our boy and its 29 days of flinching. no guess, Ive seen it...

If I wanted to learn to shoot a .416 and was worried about recoil, Id shoot a .458, for awhile, then when I shot a .416 I would take a deep breath and say "man that's a nice shoot'en rifle and it hardly kicks at all" that's what it has always seemed to me..I spent a lot of time trying to conquer too light 505 Gibbs, finally did more or less, but shortly there after I got a .458 Lott and life was oh so much better. and my .404 and 416 Rem felt like a Red Ryder BB gun, and that's how I came to be a 404 and 416 fan, and put the larger bores to rest..It worked for me, maybe it will work for other, dunno???