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Re: Has anyone shot a critter with 416 Speer 350 grain Login/Join
 
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George,

I cannot wait to see the 'ploding pumpkins! I hope you shot video clips!


FishCreek,

If I pegged your BS meter I would say that 20 years in the military has done nothing to improve your ability to determine BS from fact. I HAVE SHOT ELK with 350 gr Speers, and not in the neck! Strange that neck shots tear up the bullets worse than chest shots! I wonder why that would be? The neck of an elk is only about 9" to 11" thick on a bigger bull, while his chest is ~ 20". The vertibrae of the spine in the neck aren't that big either, MUCH smaller than the shoulder blades and upper leg bones. I would really love to see pictures of these recovered neck bullets.

To the guy who made a 359 yard neck shot, WOW, that is some damned good shootin'!! I take my hat off to you. You didn't happen to recover any of these 350 gr Speers did you?By the way, you won't get any 2" exit holes with Barnes "X" bullets, they make caliber sized holes, for the most part, as they tend not to expand to any great degree, and if they do they tend to shed their petals. I hate the "X" bullet (they are basically solids with a rapidly decreasing mass since the fronts disapear shortly after impact), IF I wanted a solid that is what I would be shooting in the first place.

ASS_CLOWN
 
Posts: 1673 | Location: MANY DIFFERENT PLACES | Registered: 14 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Quote:

I HAVE SHOT ELK with 350 gr Speers, and not in the neck! Strange that neck shots tear up the bullets worse than chest shots! I wonder why that would be? The neck of an elk is only about 9" to 11" thick on a bigger bull, while his chest is ~ 20". The vertibrae of the spine in the neck aren't that big either, MUCH smaller than the shoulder blades and upper leg bones. I would really love to see pictures of these recovered neck bullets.

To the guy who made a 359 yard neck shot, WOW, that is some damned good shootin'!! I take my hat off to you. You didn't happen to recover any of these 350 gr Speers did you?By the way, you won't get any 2" exit holes with Barnes "X" bullets, they make caliber sized holes, for the most part, as they tend not to expand to any great degree, and if they do they tend to shed their petals. I hate the "X" bullet (they are basically solids with a rapidly decreasing mass since the fronts disapear shortly after impact), IF I wanted a solid that is what I would be shooting in the first place.

ASS_CLOWN






It was a deer and not an elk. I haven't shot a elk with this rifle/load as of yet and probably wont this year. I have been muzzleloader hunting for elk the last 4 years. I just built the rifle this summer.

359yds isn't that far for a rifle this accurate. It regularly shoots 1/2" or better 3 shot groups. I build my rifles for accuracy first and therefore my rifles tend to be heavy (this one is a little over 11 lbs ready to hunt). I personally would rather leave a few things out of my backpack or deal with the weight rather then sacrifice accuracy. The rifle also has a target knob on the top of the scope so I can hold right on for the distance instead of holding over. The shot I had was the back end of the deer (texas heart shot) or his neck as he looked back at us. I held on the back of his neck where the black stripe is and hit to the right within 1" of where I held. The bullet passed right under the spine. That was the only 350 Speer I have fired at game and didn't recover it. I did shoot a modified 300x through a whitetail doe at 40yds last week. Once again no recovery.

I modify my X bullets on the lathe to obtain better expansion and to retain the 4 pedals. For the better BC and higher velocity (thus higher energy at longer ranges) I'm going to switch to the Modified 300 X's. The Speer's have a miserable BC. A .416 shooting 300X's (2950) has nearly the same trajectory as a .300 H&H out to 500yds with 2/3 more muzzle energy.

BTW the 359yd shot was to finish of a wounded deer for a buddy.
 
Posts: 179 | Location: Boise, ID | Registered: 16 February 2004Reply With Quote
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IdahoCTD,

Thanks for the added details. How are you modifying those Barnes "X" bullets? Are you drilling the hollow point deeper and/or larger? I have heard of this being done to improve terminal performance.

My 416 Rigby isn't accuate enough to attempt 350 yard neck shots. The rifle is a consistent 1.5 MOA shooter and weighs in at ~ 11.75 pounds with scope. I get similar trajectory with my 350 gr Speer loads as my 30-06 with 180 Core Lokts, but with 2X the energy on target.

I tried the Barnes bullets and wasn't impressed with the terminal performance; however, if you have found a reliable way to "fix" that I may revisit my previous decision. Although, for this rifle is may prove to be a mute point since it isn't (and never has been) overly accurate.

Thanks again.

ASS_CLOWN
 
Posts: 1673 | Location: MANY DIFFERENT PLACES | Registered: 14 May 2004Reply With Quote
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AC,

I use a drill bit 1 size larger than what will slip inside the existing hollow point. I dont know the exact size without checking it. I do know that it doesn't take all of the 4 ridges out that barnes forms in the hollow point. I chuck the bullets up in a 3 jaw chuck and run the drill bit up to the bullet until it touches. Then I run the drill bit in .750 which puts the end of the hollow point right at the top of the cannelure. The reason normal X's fail is because they end the hollow point to early (.330) where the nose is too thin and therefore they tear off or peel back. Basically the copper isn't strong enough to retain it's shape.

With an initial velocity of 3000fps we shot them into wet phone books at 200yds and the bullets look like the pictures from barnes only they are over 1" in diameter (1.060" to be exact). They might not be the best for penetration but with the low SD of a 300gr bullet they aren't the logical choice for that anyway. They are going to mess the insides up on some critters though. The nice thing is you can reduce the hole depth some if you want deeper penetration.

The 300X's ended up weighing withing 1 grain after drilling. I didn't weigh them beforehand but I will the next batch to see how close they are before and after. I haven't finalized a load for mine yet because I'm still searching for a screamer load. The best so far is 5/8".
 
Posts: 179 | Location: Boise, ID | Registered: 16 February 2004Reply With Quote
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FishCreek,



Here is some more BS for your "highly tuned" BS meter!



The 416 Rigby you seem to think is a "myth" wearing a it's 3X9 Zeiss Conquest along with the 350gr Speers both loose and loaded with 104.5 gr of IMR4350:







(the buttstock of the M1895 405 Winnie is visible on the right side of the picture, it is undergoing some sight work)



Other side:







Close-up on the barrel showing cartridge designation:







A few more close-ups:











Like I said before I HAVE SHOT ELK WITH THE 350 Gr Speer. From that 416 Rigby loaded with 104.5 gr of IMR4350, muzzle velocity is 2800+ fps.



I think you should take that BS meter of your's in for a calibration adjustment.



ASS_CLOWN
 
Posts: 1673 | Location: MANY DIFFERENT PLACES | Registered: 14 May 2004Reply With Quote
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so which lie pegs it, scotty?

your direct statements that you have no guns (several times issued, from your todde days, through axel, judy, 550ahr, etc)

to your statements that you have never own a 500ahr

to your pictures of someone else's reloading?


j
 
Posts: 40082 | Location: Conroe, TX | Registered: 01 June 2002Reply With Quote
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Ok ASS CLONE, it was your original Sh#t heal response. Now you send me a Privite Message and say that this is your girlfriend............



I would entertain this further but I have a sock drawer to rearrange.
 
Posts: 28 | Registered: 21 August 2004Reply With Quote
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The ignore button works really well. "D"
 
Posts: 1701 | Location: Western NC | Registered: 28 June 2000Reply With Quote
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jeffeosso,



There are only two possible answers. You can either pick the correct answer, or you can chose the answer which makes you feel best about yourself.



Someone elses reloading?? No, jeffeosso, I reloaded them there cartridges myself, actually I think those are on their 4th reloading. I believe I have now posted about 10 times the photographic evidence you have, strange that you cannot seem to accept the truth and move one. Like I said there are two possible answers chose as you see fit.



ASS_CLOWN
 
Posts: 1673 | Location: MANY DIFFERENT PLACES | Registered: 14 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Scotty,

i fully accept that everything you type is less than accurate.



can you deal with the fact that you are established as being totally inconsistent?

j
 
Posts: 40082 | Location: Conroe, TX | Registered: 01 June 2002Reply With Quote
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jeffeosso,

Quote:

can you deal with the fact that you are established as being totally inconsistent




No not inconsistent! There are two CONSISTENT stories. One for those that can handle the truth and another for those that have a problem with truth/facts/the way it is/etc.

ASS_CLOWN
 
Posts: 1673 | Location: MANY DIFFERENT PLACES | Registered: 14 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Quote:

jeffeosso,

Quote:

can you deal with the fact that you are established as being totally inconsistent




No not inconsistent! There are two CONSISTENT stories. One for those that can handle the truth and another for those that have a problem with truth/facts/the way it is/etc.

ASS_CLOWN





just capturing for prosPARODY
 
Posts: 40082 | Location: Conroe, TX | Registered: 01 June 2002Reply With Quote
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Quote:

Ok ASS CLONE, it was your original Sh#t heal response. Now you send me a Privite Message and say that this is your girlfriend............



I would entertain this further but I have a sock drawer to rearrange.




If that is Ass_Clown's girlfriend, then the bitch is two-timing me!
 
Posts: 19677 | Location: New Mexico | Registered: 23 May 2002Reply With Quote
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Quote:

If that is Ass_Clown's girlfriend, then the bitch is two-timing me!





 
Posts: 28 | Registered: 21 August 2004Reply With Quote
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Pecos,

No girlfriends here! Besides, if I had one, judy would undoubtedly find out (Murphy's Law you know) and cut my wanker off in my sleep or something of a similarly nasty fashion.

Fishcreek,

Get that BS meter of your's recalibrated yet? I hope you don't NEED additional proof, such as idiotic post-it notes with your name, my name, the time of day, the latest daily paper, ect, ect, etc! If that is the case I suggest you avoid being a hypocrite and post pictures of your 416 whatever, and the 350 gr Speer MagTips you are going to shoot.

ASS_CLOWN
 
Posts: 1673 | Location: MANY DIFFERENT PLACES | Registered: 14 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Quote:

Quote:

Ok ASS CLONE, it was your original Sh#t heal response. Now you send me a Privite Message and say that this is your girlfriend............



I would entertain this further but I have a sock drawer to rearrange.




If that is Ass_Clown's girlfriend, then the bitch is two-timing me!



Hold up there Pecos, you can get in line after me!!
 
Posts: 1300 | Location: Alaska.USA | Registered: 15 January 2002Reply With Quote
<BMG>
posted
I shot a deer in MN with my 416 Rigby and Speer's 350gr bullet. It worked well and the deer fell at the shot. There was very little meat damage. It worked well for me.

BMG
 
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Pecos,

No girlfriends here!




HUGE SURPRISE

Quote:


Besides, if I had one, judy




is that "judy" your other hand, as she's DIVORCED from her recent hubby... and you "promised" she wasn't your wifie... or just more fecal matter to cloud the waters

Quote:

would undoubtedly find out (Murphy's Law you know) and cut my wanker off in my sleep or something of a similarly nasty fashion.

Fishcreek,

Get that BS meter of your's recalibrated yet? I hope you don't NEED additional proof,




scotty provides all the proof one needs to KNOW when the meter is PEGGED

Quote:


ASS_CLOWN


 
Posts: 40082 | Location: Conroe, TX | Registered: 01 June 2002Reply With Quote
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BMG,



What yardage, and what speed? By the way, your results are in-line with what I have seen.



jeffeosso,



Do you feel better about yourself now? Is the reason you post these types of post because you feel you are "doing some good"?



ASS_CLOWN
 
Posts: 1673 | Location: MANY DIFFERENT PLACES | Registered: 14 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Jeffeoso;

I'm probably going to be involved in some of your pissing contests her now but hey.....



If you and Pecos have some kind of vendetta going with ASS CLOWN would it be too much to ask if all you guys can have it by PM, phone e-mail or whatever. That goes for ASS_Clown as well.



Nobody and I mean NOBODY gives a rat�s ass if the three of you have personal issues. If you cannot contribute with information worth knowing for the rest of us, then don't contribute at all. At present you're all just polluting the forum with BS and that is unnecessary and annoying. I think it's kind of weird that people supposed to be adults find joy in picking a fight with others you have never met and do not know



Back to the strand, yes we have used the 350 Speer MT quite a bit in 45-70 Gov with good results. Before the premium bullets came in 350 and 405grs that was our bullet of choice.



Now we use a 405 Woodleigh/Kodiak or a 350 Northfork FN
 
Posts: 118 | Location: Norway | Registered: 02 October 2003Reply With Quote
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Sauer150,

Quote:

Now we use a 405 Woodleigh/Kodiak or a 350 Northfork FN




If I understand you correctly you are using these in a 45-70? If that is the case would you mind providing somemore specifics? I am specifically interested in muzzle velocities and ranges to target, and what game animals you are shooting. Thanks!

ASS_CLOWN
 
Posts: 1673 | Location: MANY DIFFERENT PLACES | Registered: 14 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Norwegian Moose and Red stag in terrain where there is a lot of brush and ranges are close. 25-100y.

I have mostly used 53grs of Vithavouri N-133 behind a 350grs bullet for a V0 a little over 1900f/s and 51grs of the same powder behind a 405grs bullet for about 1800f/s.

We hunt for the meat and the combinations above gives good effect on game and do not destroy a lot of edible meat as some high speed ultra super duper mags do at close range

I do use a 300Wea and a 375 wea as well when terrain and game reguires so.
 
Posts: 118 | Location: Norway | Registered: 02 October 2003Reply With Quote
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A buddy used my rifle to take a big mulie buck friday and the bullet didn't appear to open much. The entrance hole and exit hole were quite similar in size. The shot was at 230yds. I dont know why the first bullet blew such a big hole in the throat of a deer that was even further away. Hopefully my buddy will get a crack at a elk with me standing there so I can talk him into using my rifle for bullet testing purposes.
 
Posts: 179 | Location: Boise, ID | Registered: 16 February 2004Reply With Quote
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Plugged a small bull moose up in Newfie a couple of years ago w/a Ruger 416 Rem mag and the 350 gr Mag Tip. Nailed him in the lungs, he went about 25 yds, fell over and expired. No exit wound, but it killed it just the same. Distance was a tad over 100 yds and it was a starting load in the Speer manual (no sense beating myself or the gun silly with max loads)
 
Posts: 504 | Location: New Hampshire | Registered: 09 December 2001Reply With Quote
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