The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Winchester Model 70, Safari Express questionGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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I just saw a NIB Model 70 Safari Express, chambered in 375 H&H for sale. The barrel stamp didn't make sense to me. It says: - MODEL 70 SAFARI EXPRESS - - MADE IN U.S.A BACO. INC.. MORGAN. UTAH - Why would Browning Arms Co. be stamped on a Winchester Model 70? Shouldn't it be made in Portugal, South Carolina or New Haven, CT? Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | ||
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IIRC correctly in around 2006, Winchester licensed Browning to produce Winchester designed firearms and use the Winchester name. A google search would probably turn up a press release. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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I see the license agreement for the Miroku made lever guns under the Browning name but nothing on the Model 70's What Winchester says: Winchester Model 70. It is no secret that Winchester Repeating Arms is part of the greater Herstal Group, with factories all around the world. The best factories are used for each model. Some assembly and some production of Model 70s has been shifting to our Viana, Portugal plant as indicated on the barrel inscription on some rifles. USA-made guns are marked as such. Many Model 70 bolt action rifles were produced at our factory in South Carolina, U.S.A. for several years. Previous production was at the New Haven, Connecticut factory. That factory closed in 2006. The origin of each Model 70 is marked on the barrel. Generally today, key parts are likely sourced in the U.S and the rifle assembled in Portugal. Some hunters and shooters have reasons for purchasing only Made In USA firearms. We understand. But it would be incorrect to base your decision to not buy a Model 70 from our Portugal plant due to a fear of poor performance. Model 70s made and/or assembled in Portugal have stellar quality, accuracy and overall performance that matches or exceeds any production Model 70s ever in our history. I did find this but it doesn't say which rifles. 8/15/2006 Winchester and Browning Enter Firearms License Agreement East Alton, IL, August 15, 2006 -- Winchester announced today that it has entered into a long-term license agreement with Browning for the manufacture and distribution of Winchester brand rifles and shotguns. “With this new agreement, Winchester is confident that Browning will produce innovative firearms worthy of the Winchester name, continuing a tradition that people around the world associate with the Winchester brand,” stated Richard Hammett, President Winchester Ammunition. “We are proud of our heritage as The Gun That Won the West and consider this arrangement as entering a new era for the legendary Winchester firearms brand.” Charles Guevremont, President of Browning is equally optimistic and excited about the opportunity to continue the production and distribution of Winchester firearms. “We are more committed today than ever before to the development of exciting new Winchester firearms designs,” said Guevremont. “We will continually strive to build the quality products that generations of loyal Winchester customers have come to expect and will be proud to own and use for decades to come.” Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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I think you found your answer. Nothing stops Winchester from having them made in multiple places. Mike Legistine actu quod scripsi? Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Are you going to wind up with two different guns from the different manufacturers? Didn't FN make some changes from the New Haven design? Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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Primarily a new trigger design--- more delicate and more complicated---- Why they wanted to mess with the best hunting trigger design-------  "The rule is perfect: in all matters of opinion our adversaries are insane." Mark Twain TANSTAAFL www.savannagems.com A unique way to own a piece of Africa. DSC Life NRA Life | |||
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I am not sure where they were assembled but I just bought two current Mod 70 375 H&H magnums safari models and they are very accurate, one almost a "one holer" at 100 yards. Never had a pre 64 mod 70 in that caliber shoot so tightly. Triggers cleaned up nicely. Surprisingly accurate | |||
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They are made in South Carolina by FN. I have a .375 H&H and a .416 Rem. and they are deadly accurate. | |||
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Yeah, not sure why they changed the trigger. I spoke with Mark Penrod a few years ago, and at that time, he preferred the New Haven rifles over the SC ones. Not sure if he has changed his opinion or not. It is a bit odd they aren't stamped South Carolina though, since they are (were) made there. Perhaps they started off with stamping the corporate address in an attempt to obfuscate the manufacturing origin of their rifles, knowing full well the ultimate plan was to move production offshore. Hunting: Exercising dominion over creation at 2800 fps. | |||
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I believe the parts are made in SC but assembled in Portugal now. Now sure if that's the entire line though. | |||
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http://www.calguns.net/calgunf...=408106&d=1429911246 Frank "I don't know what there is about buffalo that frightens me so.....He looks like he hates you personally. He looks like you owe him money." - Robert Ruark, Horn of the Hunter, 1953 NRA Life, SAF Life, CRPA Life, DRSS lite | |||
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Plus 2 on Sean Russels post..Fix the best trigger every produced on a firearm and screw it up..The bean counters are at it again, those bastards need to be stringhaulterd and gil flurted. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Winchester Model 70, Safari Express question
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