As I recall I read that the original 500 Jeffrey factory loads were claimed to drive the 535 gr bullet to 2400 fps. I've also read that real world performance was more likely 2200 fps.

Has anyone (Alf?) been able to chrono original factory loads, and if so, what was the actual speed. With current factory ammo, what is it loaded to?

TIA

Paul

I have put a few rounds over the chrono of David little's current .500 Jeffery, his ammo from 2 years ago runs from a 24" barrel at 2280 fps from my rifle. There appears a variation of about 20 fps between solid and soft nosed.

David has in the last year or so backed off his Jeffery load a little by the use of a non-magnum primer, this results in a loss of about 40 fps or so only but does for some reason make the rifle feel little more pleasant to shoot, not that the recoil is in any real way troubling.

I have some original , Kynoch loaded, Jefery ammo. It is believed that the brass for such was made in Germany and brought to the U.K in cylindrical form, here Kynoch loaded it with a flake powder, unusual in the U.K at that time and added to it a bullet of their own making.

The headstamp on my examples states simply .500, nothing more is added. I would not use this ammo as today here such rounds command prices of around the £80 per round for collectors. consequently I have no idea as to the velocity generated but have heard that such rounds over the chrono relised around 2250 fps.

Remeber when Kynoch produced ammunition velocities were almost always quoted as from 28-30 inch barrels.

I think Jamiesons "Leonnard" built Jeffery had a 26inch barrel, so velocity would have been a tad higher than 2250

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Alf

I understand that 2 of my examples are loaded by Kynoch per their Loading drawing Number BK82 dated Aug 21 1928, whilst the latter GECADO example is loaded to the RWS Drawing M466, dated 18/7/1940 I have a copy of these drawings from the Kynoch factory archives supplied to me by David Little who holds all these drawings and blueprints at the Kynamco factory in Suffolk.

I cannot add anything more useful than to quote a narrative prepared by Kynamco when the specification for their contemporary .500 Jeffery was submitted to CIP for inclusion in the yellow book as a "Standard". This publication dated 22nd July 1998 held:- .......

...." Kynoch, on behalf of Jeffery imported straight (un-necked) formed Schuler cases, probably from G.C Dornheim (Gecado) in Suhl. Cordite due to its stranded form, was invarably loaded in un-necked cases, over wadded with a glazeboard disc of case body inside diameter to retain the strands at the base of the case and the case was finally necked over the wad for bulleting. The dual use of the Schuler case probably explains the lack of any complete calibre designation (such as ".500 Schuler or .500 Jeffery) in the headstaamp; both firms promoted their respective versions as a ".500" - Schuler did not use the metric designation for his promotion of the calibre."

"This explains the existence of the Kynoch drawing BK82/132 1928 as a loading drawing for the case giving final external dimensions, and a detailed manufacturing drawing of the bullet, which would have been of Kynoch manufacture; German solid bullets of that era were very thin jacketed and would not have been acceptable to Jeffery or their customers. This also indicates independent design by Jeffery and Schuler and intentional differences in the Jeffery Cartridge."

"Although it may have been expedient ( and cheaper) for him to import part finished brass using Schuler's base dimensions from GECADO, the use of a Kynoch bullet and his own more sloping shoulder profile was very probably done to intentionally prevent Schuler cartridges being used in Jeffery Rifles."


"Although it is still uncertain to this day as to the exact provenance of the .500 Jeffery, and whilst it is true to say that no examples have been seen exhibiting a "K" or Kynoch on the headstamp, it does certainly appear the case that external case dimensions and the bullet used in the Kynoch LOADED rounds are different to those found in the GECADO loded ammunition." ends

As to which version of event is correct I doubt any person living can say for certain, but evidence certainly exists to show that Kynoch did have their own loading drawing and bullet drawing which tends to suggest that they did in fact load ammo during this period.

The of 3 rounds in my possession one solid and one soft nosed simply state .500 on the head, the latter, a soft nosed, is stamped SCHULER 500 GECADO. there is a slight but distinct difference between the 2 load makes i nthe area of the shoulder.

Alf, you may well be right, I really don't know, I just cite what David has researched and told me in person. I do have a small photo copy of the 1928 Kynoch drawing and 1940 RWS drawing for loaded amjunition if you would like a copy, I can e-mail them to you.

Reegards

JT

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Hi Alf

you certainly have put in some time in your research, fascinating stuff. I too have some of the original loaded ammo from David, he has since reduced the load slightly although he says only by substituting a standard CCI (I think) primer instead of the Magnum primer. The velocity is said to only be 40 or so fps lower than the initial load.

In my own rifle I have never done better than round about 2280 but not with such an accurate chronos an Oehler, so there could easily be a little blue sky in my own findings.

A friend here, Martin Golland, possibly the biggest collector of historical cartridges in the U.K, has amongst several tons of ammo, an original box of Gecado Schuler rounds (soft nosed if I recall correctly)12 rounds remain, I think it was also Martin that showed me a (buff coloured cardboard slip top 10 round box retailed by Jeffery with a full complement of 10 rounds of solid nosed. The box looks very similar to that used for the .505 Magnum, other than it was labelled as being made by (for) Jeffery!!

I seem to recall a production date stamped on the box underside in the usual Kynoch way and if memory again serves well the date was sometime in the mid 1930's. The headstamp on the rounds was again .500.

I may well be mistaken as to whether my rounds bearing the .500 stamp are loaded with a stick propellant or a flake but I shall look at them this p.m.and try figure it out.

Out of interest have you ever fired any original rounds over the chrono, I have but 3 such rounds, so have no spare capacity to do any trials, and given the scarcity and cost here I regret they will remain keep sakes.

Also as my own rifle is of contemporary make and has no signifacant or historical value unlike yours, in which case modern ammo is probably the ideal.

I took to using this calibre a few years ago having used a Lott for the previous 10 years, that was a teriffic calibre, but the Jeffery IMO is a better one.

Have you taken much game with the calibre, if so how do you rate it?

Aslo I did not know that Weatley had ever built a double in this calibre, do you have much info on the build spec or of the commissioning owner?

Thanks again for the information

regards

Jonathan