The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Heym Big Game Express vs Rigby Big GameGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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If you had to choose between the Heym Big Game Express or the Rigby Big Game, which one would you choose? In South Africa the Rigby is significantly more expensive(+/- 30% More). The Heym can be had in 404J, and supposedly they don't just have one standard action, so you could end up with a much lighter package than compared to having the Rigby in 416 Rigby, although for interest's sake let's just compare both of them in 416 Rigby. I would imagine that the Rigby will have the better resale, thanks to the name that you are buying, at least I think so, but you do pay for it intially. What say the experts? Or would a custom CZ be the best bet  "A peculiar virtue in wildlife ethics is that the hunter ordinarily has no gallery to applaud or disapprove of his conduct. Whatever his acts, they are dictated by his own conscience, rather than by a mob of onlookers. It is difficult to exaggerate the importance of this fact." | ||
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You might be giving too much resale value to the Rigby name! I recognize the Heym name as quality, but with the changing of hands over the Rigby name in recent years, I would do more homework on a used Rigby than a Heym. Given comparable options, I would have it come down to the fit and feel of the gun. Just my .02! | |||
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AHR-CZ550 NRA Life Member, Band of Bubbas Charter Member, PGCA, DRSS. Shoot & hunt with vintage classics. | |||
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I have carefully looked at both at SCI and talked at length with those at the booth and as you noted, the Rigby is much heavier, bulkier and expensive and other than an old, legendary name I saw nothing of addition value with it. When I asked the guys at the Rigby booth why their 375 weighed so much I was told with some distain "because it is a heavy rifle" I could see that ! Heym on the other hand, besides having gun builder Ralph Martini at their booth, was asking as many questions about how they could improve their rifles as I was about their rifles. My personal preference, money aside, would be the Heym. As you mentioned, a good builder who understands how to build a proper DG rifle could probably build a nice CZ for a little cheaper than the Heym. But I would pick carefully. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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my choice- the Heym Martini. You can spend more money, to get a different,- but not a better, rifle. | |||
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This^^^^^^^ without a doubt is spot on. _____________________________________________________ A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened. - Winston Churchill | |||
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Whoops, somebody forgot to tell Rigby that the .375H&H is a medium not a heavy....How embarrassing. | |||
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Interesting to see the opinions of those who have actually handled the rifles. I am just an armchair spectator and I love old English guns full of classic features and nostalgia. Sad to hear that the new Rigby does not meet those traditional standards. I guess the AHR upgrade would be a great way to go for an affordable, elegant and reliable rifle. "When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick." | |||
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And for those whom price is a major consideration there is always the Ruger 416. It has virtually the same weight, balance and performance as the original Jeffery 404.  Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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A heavy 375H is a pig. I have an original that is 8lbs 2oz, unscoped (and never will be). That is on the Magnum Mauser action. I also used to have a 404J that weighed maybe 8 1/2lbs, perfect. Wish I still had it. Too many manufactures use same stock, barrel profile on their 375's as they do on their 458's (e.g. Winchester) which, to me, makes for a club-like handling rifle. To the OP, try both rifles, they are expensive, and see if you like either one. DRSS | |||
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The original H&H 375's weighed around 8 1/2 pounds. So does my original Jeffery 404. That makes for a quick, lively handling rifle and is an ideal weight for a hunter who carries their rifle all day. The recoil is a little stiff, but not bad, but recoil lasts for only a fraction of a second, while gravity last forever ! Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Phil. My H&H 375 H&H takedown was delivered May 1913, at factory records of 8lbs 2oz, which corresponds to my scales. This is the old H&H takedown style, where the forend screws off with the barrel, so a little more weight in the steel plates. 23" barrel. However, the stock is very fine and shoulders very nicely. I have shot and owned a number of heavier 375's that are not as kind to shoot. That 404 of yours is a beauty. Cheers, Chris DRSS | |||
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The design and the function of the Heym is mutch better (more praktical and it lokks "nicer" in the traditionall way) also the accuracy. I have both testet two weeks long, both are "not bad", but the Heym is mutch better. | |||
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Here's a photo of the Heym Express just in case some haven't seen one of them.   | |||
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Very nice! | |||
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Wow, the Heym is a beautiful rifle and I've only best wishes for those who can afford one. As 458 mentioned above, sometimes a simple 416 Ruger or even a 375 ruger is worth playing with. The 416 Ruger clocks in at UNDER 8 pounds, while the 375 Ruger hits closer to 8 pounds even, presumably because of the smaller hole in the barrel. Now I've been playing with my wife's 375, in between her own shooting, in order to develop loads. The following seems to have paid off.  The load was 84grain Rel-17 on a Rem 9.5Magnum primer with 250 grain TTSX for a chronographed 2826 fps from her 20 inch barrel. Group was 0.366" at 100 yards. Additional good loads were found with 4451, but the 84 grain Rel 17 loads were exceptional. The rifle started out 'so so' with groups 1"-2". It has undergone a rebedding with cross pins added, a 1/4" 4" all thread epoxied down through the wrist/handle, careful centering and free-floating, including bedding along the side of the tang. The point in this is that this $600 rifle (bought used/nearly new) has been worthwhile getting to know through shooting, bedding, and testing. The stock is a pepper laminate that will only gain character from a ding or two in the bush. Here is my wife enjoying a shot. Notice the nice 5-inch eye relief to keep her brow lovable. (OK it would be lovable even with a scar.)  she plans to do her hunting mostly with the 200 grain GSC:  Ok-- back to pretty, more expensive rifles. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
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Very lithe and beautiful rifle, I have never been a fan of split top ring scope mounts, as I don't think they look traditional, and I don't think they are attractive, and I know they lack the gripping power of a properly built 4 or 6 screw ring mount. Saying that the rifle is so nice I don't spend all my time bitching about the mounts. Nice rifle!
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I have a Heym 404 Jeff purchased new from NewGuy (Chris) in 2008. It is, without a doubt a phenomenal shooting and handling rifle. I'd put it against any similar rig out there. It doesn't matter what I shoot in it....less than MOA out to 250 yards....haven't shot it any further. G | |||
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That Heym looks so British I am sure it has some of the Mountbatten genes in it!  "When the wind stops....start rowing. When the wind starts, get the sail up quick." | |||
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I picked the Heym after looking at and handling all the others. I went with the 375 h&h. It is a little heavier than I would have liked but VERY well balanced and an amazing stock. Today I went to the range with it to sight in the new Leupold VX6 1-6 scope. My 50 yard target for four shots was .4 in and for three shots .26 inch. I didn't event have to tune my load to it. I also like the idea that with the Heym, each caliber has its own magazine destined to that specific caliber, really smooth. | |||
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 DRSS | |||
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Some interesting opinions. I personally prefer the look of the Heym. Have handled the Rigby and the Mauser M98 (essentially the same thing) but not the Heym. The Rigby did seem very heavy in my hands, especially seeing that I'm used to hunting with a Blaser R93 in 416 Rem Mag. I think a big draw card to the Heym as was mentioned, is that each magazine and action is caliber specific, so a 404J can be had in a much lighter rifle than a 416 Rigby, and the difference between the two calibers is academic as I wouldn't plan on loading a 416 Rigby to 2600fps with 400gr Bullets. 416Tanzan, you are far to practical mentioning 375 Rugers and the sort on this tread We might discover that pretty wood and elegant looking rifles don't assist in a quicker death of Mr Buffalo, although Heym do make a SR21 Super Classic in 375 Ruger, which has a stock and barrel bands etc along similar lines to the Express. Just might be the prettiest 375 Ruger on the market and I would imagine, cheaper than a Rigby in 375H&H and significantly better handling. To afford a Heym or a Rigby I would have to sell a few other rifles and scopes to fund it. Pretty doesn't make them any deader, and neither will a 404J or 416 Rigby work any better than my 416 Rem Mag, but I guess it is nice to be a little nostalgic at times. We all know the Jeffery is much more of an African rifle, earning its reputation in the Game Departments with no fuss or glory,than that oversized showpiece that Ruark made the Rigby to be  "A peculiar virtue in wildlife ethics is that the hunter ordinarily has no gallery to applaud or disapprove of his conduct. Whatever his acts, they are dictated by his own conscience, rather than by a mob of onlookers. It is difficult to exaggerate the importance of this fact." | |||
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Deon, Nice post!
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Well if you think that British guns were built on German Mauser actions, or indeed German Mauser built barreled actions which were then stocked by Rigby, Westley Richard, H&H and many others its hardly surprising that a modern German built Mauser actioned rifle looks very British. Indeed Mauser used to build many complete rifles that were stocked in a British style for the tropical market - a lot of these were retailed by British retailers and badged accordingly. The British style seems all the rage in the North American market, albeit with much straiter stocks suited to scope use. In the UK there is a growing trend towards Germanic hogs back and squarish cheek piece styles. | |||
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I just bought a new Mauser M98 Magnum in 416 Rigby. I did consider the Rigby, I visited Rigby in London and handled a few rifles, but I actually preferred the "Mauser version". The Mauser stock has a slightly longer LOP than the Rigby rifles, and slightly longer barrel. Concerning weight, the Mauser M98 Magnum is roughly 10 lbs with the heavy barrel - which I think is just perfect for the 416 Rigby. This is also the original spec from the early Rigby rifles, I really don't see why a DGR in this caliber class should be much lighter. I haven't tried the Heym Express rifles, but I'm sure they are great as well. | |||
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Both of these factory rifles cost as much as a custom with a hand made stock. | |||
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+1 Nec Timor Nec Temeritas | |||
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I'm not anywhere near this market, but my choice would be the Heym. Just from a visual aspect, the Heym immediately presents with classic form and lines in their stock architecture. It just looks like such a natural pointer;the drop at the comb designed for irons or scope use. The visual proportions just look like it will put the weight between your hands, where you want it. If you set those good looks aside, I think incorporating forward looking features that are both practical and functional, like the integral 30mm Talley bases machined into those double square bridges is just good business sense and what sets it apart in it's category and market. Can you machine integral Talley's into a CZ550M?- of course and I had it done on my .416 Rigby chambered rifle and Wayne at AHR, as we know, builds a range of fine DGR rifles.  There's no lack of selection, or directions you can take and go in, in this market. | |||
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That is some sweet looking peep sight. We would like to see it with a stock and scope attached. When I get back on my feet, I will drag my London Rigby (1970) .375 out and decide what will make it feel and handle up to my shotgun specifications. By the way, what is this "good for scope, good for irons" stock dimension? I haven't found this dimension yet. | |||
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I think it's magic myself! I had one rifle like that..a pre 64 custom 270 previously owned by Bob Chatfield-Taylor and built for him by Len Brownell. It had a peep in the scope base,along with a 4X Kollmorgan Bear Cub in detachable top mounts and was quite as fast with the scope as the irons. I could never figure out how Brownell pulled that off but he did and I think it was the genius of a skilled stock maker. This Heym rifle has a butt stock that looks strangely similar and has me pretty lathered up which is not good...nice rifle. | |||
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I agree 100% with Phil. I came to the same conclusions after seeing both guns. | |||
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I went with the Heym, in 375 H&H. It has done everything I need a rifle to do in Africa, from buff at 10 feet, to waterbuck, impala, etc in excess of 400 yards. Not much has required a follow up shot. And, it's the prettiest rifle I have ever had the pleasure of shooting or holding in my grimy jaded hands.  I'm taking it back this week for a couple weeks tour of Namibia. No other rifle is making the trip, none needed. Master of Boats, Slayer of Beasts, Charmer of the fair sex, ...... and sometimes changer of the diaper..... | |||
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No question about it on my part, I'll take the Heym...But that said, I would take an old Jefferys rifle in 404 over any other big bore. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Heym Big Game Express vs Rigby Big Game
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