I'm thinking of making this my all around bullet for NA. anyone have experience on similar size NA game or african plains game with this bullet?
seems to perform well through logs

Its an excellent conventional bullet. I have used it extensively for buffalo and such things in the past with 458 Winchester and 458 B&M. The 450 performed excellent for me at velocities running 2200-2300 fps.

However, if I were choosing a 458 caliber bullet, conventional, for North America it would not be the 450 weight. I would drop that weight down to 350 grs, I think Swift has a great 350, North Fork has an even better 350, both conventional, that would do anything ever required of them in North America. As velocity increases they make a bigger impression on the animals you would be working with, say moose/bear.

My new Do everything in NA bullet is that 250 gr #13 NonCon in .458.

Michael

About the only soft I use in my 458WM. Very short so it does not take up case capacity and with max loads of AA2230 @ 2260 - 2270 FPS will shoot 4 shots into less than a quarter at 100 yards.

EZ

tried the 350 hornadies and they just dont shoot as accurate, I think because there is so much jump to the lands. 350 gr aframes may shoot better. I thought about going with 400grs. for some reason I just want to use the heavier weights. I want to find one bullet for everything and one load and just practice and practice with that load.

quote:

Originally posted by eezridr:
About the only soft I use in my 458WM. Very short so it does not take up case capacity and with max loads of AA2230 @ 2260 - 2270 FPS will shoot 4 shots into less than a quarter at 100 yards.

EZ

Oh just for comparison reasons, what's you max charge? I tried 75gr and go no flattened primers but showed .0006 case head expansion and backed down to 74.5 into the accuracy node.

I shot 10 buffalo with the 450 grain A-frame in the .458 Win, and recovered some of the bullets. The others are .375 270 grainers also recovered from buffalo.

My load at the time was 74 grains of H4895 for a tiny bit over 2200 fps.It was heavily compressed. 74 grains of A2230 matches the speed, and 78 grains of the same powder takes it up to 2350 fps.That last load is firmly in the "you're on your own" category, but primer pockets stayed tight for 8 fireings during the work-up.

I have had nothing but excellent results with swift A-frame bullets... I have shot qute a few of them in my 338 win mag and 375 RUM--they have worked everytime for me...not the most accurate bullet, but good enough.

Ed

Browning Safari Grade; 24" barrel 458 Win Mag.
Hornady brass
Fed 215 primer
450 Swift A frame
Powder AA 2230
73 gr; Hi 2262 ; lo 2242 (5 Shots)
74 gr; Hi 2291 ; lo 2269 (5 Shots; avg. 2281)
Ohler 35 chronograph; 12' from muzzle 93F

500 gr Hornady DGS
Fed 215
Hornady brass
Powder AA 2230
72 gr; Hi 2167; lo 2136; avg 2147
Chrono; Ohler 35 12' from Muzzle 93F

This next load was fine in my rifle but would definately try the 72 gr load first and work up slow!!!! I do not think this load is necessary as the 500 gr load above achieved the desired 2150 FPS.

Hornady brass
Fed 215
500 gr Hornady DGS
Powder AA 2230
74 gr; Hi 2190 ; lo 2177 ; Avg 2183
Ohler 35 Chrono 12' from muzzle @ 93F



I highly suggest anyone begin 5 grains below this charge. All guns are different.
The top two loads are awesome 458WM loads. The 450 Gr @ close to 2300FPS might double as a good 200 yrd plains game load. It is plenty accurate!!

EZ

quote:

Originally posted by gohip2000:

quote:

Originally posted by eezridr:
About the only soft I use in my 458WM. Very short so it does not take up case capacity and with max loads of AA2230 @ 2260 - 2270 FPS will shoot 4 shots into less than a quarter at 100 yards.

EZ

Oh just for comparison reasons, what's you max charge? I tried 75gr and go no flattened primers but showed .0006 case head expansion and backed down to 74.5 into the accuracy node.

thats pretty neat. I'm chronoing only about 2 fps difference with the same loads you listed, but in my win m70

quote:

Originally posted by Dogleg:
I shot 10 buffalo with the 450 grain A-frame in the .458 Win, and recovered some of the bullets. The others are .375 270 grainers also recovered from buffalo.

My load at the time was 74 grains of H4895 for a tiny bit over 2200 fps.It was heavily compressed. 74 grains of A2230 matches the speed, and 78 grains of the same powder takes it up to 2350 fps.That last load is firmly in the "you're on your own" category, but primer pockets stayed tight for 8 fireings during the work-up.

Dogleg,

What is the recommended impact velocity for expansion? What's your experience?

I still have 2/3 of a box and want to use the remainder in my Ruger #1 .45-70 IMP (Improved).
2300 fps is easy using H335. My goal is to use them on black bear at around 2100 fps, and possibly moose at about 2300 to get the trajectory I want (or need).

Thanks

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

quote:

Dogleg,

What is the recommended impact velocity for expansion? What's your experience?

I've never seen a published velocity range for these bullets but can talk of my own experience.These bullets were started at 2200 fps and the longest shots would still have had about 1850 left. There is no discernable difference in the expansion of any of them. Lack of any secondary bulge tells me that there is still room to bump the velocity up,certainly the 150 fps gain of my new hotter load won't strain the bullets. Since 2350 is all I can realistically (or even unrealistically) expect to get out of the .458 I'm feeling fairly confident at least to that speed.Until I move to a Lott, its all the bullet I need. Maybe even then.

The .375 bullets were started at 2650 fps. Although I hestitate to compare bullet to bullet, these ones performed as well as could be expected when expanded to the point of the double bulge.

These observations only apply to thick skinned game like buffalo. I haven't had any luck with lighter game stopping one.They just die.

Thanks Dogleg;

I appreciate you sharing both your experience and analysis.

The Swift website shows pictures of some of their AFs giving adequate expansion at 1650 but not in .458". I think the 450gr would work well on bear at an MV of around 2100 - 2150 fps. I think I'll give them a try.

Thanks for your input.

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

The 450 A-frame is my current bullet of choice in my 458.

I'd love to hear the story of this hunt

quote:

Originally posted by 458Win:
The 450 A-frame is my current bullet of choice in my 458.