Sometimes it seems that excellent, powerful, versatile calibers can be overlooked.

Consider the 416 Ruger.

It comes in 23" and 20" factory barrel lengths, something very easy to carry.

The case is 2.58" long and fits in a "standard" length action with 3.4" magazines.

The case is relatively large, having about ten grains more powder capacity than the more widely used 458WM. The 416Ruger basically duplicates the 416Rem ballistics in a shorter case and in a smaller, lighter rifle platform.

The Rugers weigh in at 8.0 pounds, or about 9.5 pounds with a scope and sling. That makes it an extremely comfortable rifle to carry on a long track. And the Rugers are fully controlled-feeding.

Their power can be loaded up over 5200 ft#, truly a dangerous game rifle.

Light all-purpose bullets are available for flat-shooting on plains game: CEB tipped raptors at 232 grains, GSC 245gn, tipped CEB at 307 grain, and 330gn GSC. These can be loaded between 3000fps down to 2600fps as a person wishes to hunt.

Traditional 416 loads of 400grain bullets at 2400fps are also doable and available.

The only downside might be that the Ruger rifles are so reasonably priced that people going on expensive safaris want to spend extra money?

PS: the .416" diameter puts them a notch ahead of the venerable 375's for dangerous game hunting and shorter follow-up tracking.

If I didn't have a bunch of 416 Taylor brass I would turn my Taylor into a 416 Ruger

Both the 375 and 416 Rugers are brilliant designs IMO. Persons will argue whether they were 'needed' or not. Probably not 'needed', but they bring something to the table that is unique: more powder capacity in a standard size case/action than a 416 Taylor, AND smaller, trimmer rifles, like the Ruger Hawkeye African. I love that rifle and its dimensions; so small and trim in the wrist and forearm. And if we're arguing 'neediness', what can we say about all of the other calibers? I think we're blessed with WIDE choices in all of them as well. There's always room for more...

My Dakota 404 Jeffery is my choice for Africa. I love that rifle too, but its admittedly a larger round and rifle (Safari). However, it weighs only 8.5 lbs., with a 23" barrel, so is close to the Hawkeye African, and I shoot it with no scope, so that is the weight that I carry. I like the history behind the round, and it just feels good to take a Buffalo with that cartridge.

I bought one of the original Ruger Alaskans in 416 and it would not feed. I sent it back to Ruger three times and they never fixed it. I sold it, but I have two cases of unopened Hornady 416 Ruger in the basement; one in solids and the other softs. So, some day, I am going to buy a Ruger African in the cartridge and try again. I am hoping they will drop the muzzle brake in the future, so I am waiting for that day. You can't beat the price for a DG rifle. Nice offering from Ruger.

I own three Ruger Africans in 375 Ruger without the muzzle brake, and I absolutely LOVE those rifles. Fit me to a "T"!!!!!

I'm a big fan of the 416 R. After I built myself a Mauser chambered in 416 R, I sold my CZ 550 in 416 Rigby. The CZ was just too heavy. That weight would have been nice IF I had been the type to handload the cartridge to the Max, but I'm not.

Maybe I'm biased because I built custom rifles on Mauser actions and the Ruger series of cartridges fit nicely into a standard 98 action. But I like both the .375 and .416. And, the Ruger rifles without the Gawd awful brakes were pretty decent looking for a factory rifle, and not expensive either.

In 2008 I was in Chewore North and shared the camp with Steve Hornady and his daughter. He shot a very nice lion that Ian Gibson found lounging in a river bottom. While observing the skinning process, I asked Mr. Hornady what he used on the beast. He held up a cartridge and said I'll bet you never saw one of these. It was the prototype 416 Ruger cartridge. One of the first times it was used on dangerous game. It obviously worked very well.

quote:

Originally posted by z1r:
I'm a big fan of the 416 R. After I built myself a Mauser chambered in 416 R, I sold my CZ 550 in 416 Rigby. The CZ was just too heavy. That weight would have been nice IF I had been the type to handload the cartridge to the Max, but I'm not.

Maybe I'm biased because I built custom rifles on Mauser actions and the Ruger series of cartridges fit nicely into a standard 98 action. But I like both the .375 and .416. And, the Ruger rifles without the Gawd awful brakes were pretty decent looking for a factory rifle, and not expensive either.

Can’t remmeber where I heard it but I remember the ruger rounds being tricky to get feeding well in converted rifles?

Has anyone stuck a 458 in the ruger case yet?

So guys---let loose with some of your loading data! I haven't found very much except for Hornady's manual and that seems a little anemic!

Hip

I hav three 375 Rugers. Love the cartridge design. I wish Ruger would have done an entire family of cartridges based on the full size 375 Ruger case.

The Ruger Hawkeye Alaskan in 416 Ruger is available again! Buds guns $685! Dangerous game rifle for under a $1000, only Ruger! Speer has a good sample of loading data for their 350 gr. I think Nosler has some for their 400 gr partition. When I got my Alaskan, it being light I thought it would stomp, but it does not!

quote:

Originally posted by 416Tanzan:
PS: the .416" diameter puts them a notch ahead of the venerable 375's for dangerous game hunting and shorter follow-up tracking.

This is not entirely on topic so I hope it doesn’t derail your thread, but I think it somewhat relevant.

Will a 416 Ruger clean up a 375 H&H chamber? Could you reborn and recharber without having to set the barrel back?

I am very fond of the Rugers in 375 and 416. The 20" barrels are handy in confined places. I like the 350 grain Barnes TSX in the 416 for my use.

quote:

Originally posted by TrademarkTexan:

quote:

Originally posted by 416Tanzan:
PS: the .416" diameter puts them a notch ahead of the venerable 375's for dangerous game hunting and shorter follow-up tracking.

...

Will a 416 Ruger clean up a 375 H&H chamber? Could you reborn and recharber without having to set the barrel back?

The 375 & 416's are based on a standard length action ('06) as opposed to the magnum length.

I suppose you could just load them long...but...

What I love most about the Rugers is that they put the a great cartridge in reach of the common man. If you could afford an '06, you could afford a .416 Ruger. That was a great move on Ruger's part and I applaud them for it.

Having said that...I own a Montana .375 H&H and my version of a standard length is the 9.3x62 (*in a Merkel Helix).

And having said THAT, I did email Merkel on that exact topic and asked them why they didn't chamber the Helix in the .416 Ruger. (*it's a Belted Mag head with a standard length cartridge on "normal" pressures...so there's no reason that wouldn't work as far as I can tell).

They simply said "other calibers will be offered in the future." So...then there's that.

I digress. I applaud Ruger for the move. I don't think it will last, sadly. But I do applaud the effort...as I did five years ago when it was first offered (*or something like that).

I have both the 375 and 416 Rugers and definitely two of my favorite rifles. I have taken a lot of game with each in South Africa.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
I hav three 375 Rugers. Love the cartridge design. I wish Ruger would have done an entire family of cartridges based on the full size 375 Ruger case.

I couldn't agree more. I'd buy an African in 338 Ruger, full size case. But even more so, I'd buy a couple of 358 Ruger full sizes.

The 358 Norma is such a great, powerful cartridge, but ammo is scare/expensive. If Ruger/Hornady came out with the full size 358 Ruger with Hornady factory ammo, commonly available, Wow! I'd probably switch from a 338 shooter to a 358. I already use my 35 Whelen over my 338-06. Just my preference. Larger diameter. I'm sure at least in NA I'd switch from 338WM to 358R. Africa may be a different story simply due to ammo availability. Oh, hell, I took my 35 Whelen on my last safari, so I guess I'd take a 358R.

All we need now, is for Ruger/Hornady to do the deed. A unique opportunity for these two fine companies to make Surefire7's Christmas.

So where does one get to buy one of these super 375's or 416's ? Good luck actually finding a Ruger in this caliber is Canada and if you do pray the damn thing groups ! Im less then impressed with the guide gun I recently bought in 338 Win. Its a damn "area weapon" ie it shoots in the general vicinity of where its pointed at

My 416 Alaskan is a hoot. Full house loads aren’t punishing thanks to the Hogue stock. Hornady ammo can be found at prices cheap enough that I don’t have to reload yet.

quote:

Originally posted by ALF:
So where does one get to buy one of these super 375's or 416's ? Good luck actually finding a Ruger in this caliber is Canada and if you do pray the damn thing groups ! Im less then impressed with the guide gun I recently bought in 338 Win. Its a damn "area weapon" ie it shoots in the general vicinity of where its pointed at

I bought my first one at Buds in Lexington. My second came from CDNN, and my third from Lipsey’s.

Good luck finding any in Canada at this time, here and there are lefties standing on racks left over from the time when Ruger quit making them ? temporarily. Even the Ruger importer shows them but lists them as out of stock ?

You still see them on the rack at local emporia in KY, gathering dust.
I am saving a couple of the .375 Rugers and .416 Rugers for my old age,
when I cannot handle the .458 Win.Mag. so well.
But to make it more fun, I put a canoe-paddle, old Ruger "Zytel" stock, on a .416 Ruger and it shed a full pound, down to 7.0 lbs exactly, bare/empty.
I do not like those Hogue stocks for some reason.
Must be like a rubber handle on a hunting knife, same aversion for me, just a personal peculiarity.
Stainless and 20-inch barreled, that .416 Ruger is a "Spruce King" or at least an "Alder Queen."

I also have a Ruger No.1, stainless/laminate, .416 Ruger with 24" barrel.
I have resisted the urge to re-chamber that to the original .416 Ruger, presented to Bill Ruger long before the current short version.
It was a .416 Rigby with a different shoulder,
either venturified or like 20 to 30-degree instead of 45-degree.
Great little cartridge, the current .416 Ruger,
no "sensible" reason to re-chamber that one.

Rip ...

I rebarreled a tang safety Ruger 77 to a 416 Ruger. 23" barrel in a McMillan stock weighed 9 lbs scoped but empty. Really nice to shoot. Wished I could have got it down another pound but it balances well and is accurate.
Great round. I still have the reamer... maybe another one will happen someday.

RIP,

Would you post a pic of the 416 in a boat paddle?

RIP
You're thinking along similar lines.

When the 500 feels too much for me, the 416Ruger ought to be just about right. The 338 might feel even better, but it doesn't qualify for a buffalo license. My "dilema" is whether to buy now when a deal comes by, or to wait five years.

quote:

I do not like those Hogue stocks for some reason.

You may remember my trouble with the Hogue stock on the 500AccRelNyati, my trigger finger would bruise. You pointed out that the pistol grip needed to be flattened more horizontally. Well, that worked. It just took some grinding around the bottom of the grip, all the way down to plastic and then some at the base of the grip.

As for the rubber feel, I don't mind at all. But I got a laminated Boyd's stock that I like better and that matches my wife's Ruger Alaskan 375Ruger. Her pepper laminated stock was a factory issue. Apparently Ruger did a run of left-hand models with a pepper laminate stock rather than the Hogue. She likes hers, so I got a matching stock for the 500 from Boyd's.

Now what would be a deal of real interest would be a run of 416Rugers, Ruger Alaskan, with that pepper-laminate stock. Part of the allure of the 416Ruger is easy price point, as long as one plans to use the Hogue stock (which is quite practical). However, if one wants to put on a Boyd's laminate afterwards, the price of the Ruger rifle goes up $250 (the cost of a Boyd's after LOP, checkering, and Limbsaver are added).

In addition, some claim that the hogue stock absorbs and reduces felt recoil. That might make a difference in old age, but I must confess that I can't feel any significant difference between my laminate and the Hogue on my 500.

I bought brass for the 416 Ruger before I actually saw a rifle made in it. I already had 375 Rugers and liked the case design.
Somehow, I got side tracked for a few years before getting a rifle in 416 Ruger. I have M70's 416 Remingtons also.
The 20" Alaskan in a McMillan Classic is one of my favorite rifles. I have not shot it since the recent stock replacement. But, expect it to be as well mannered with the factory Hogue.

To me the stainless 416 Ruger with 20" barrel was truely an Alaskan rifle / cartridge combination for those that like bigger bore rifles. Easily a 200 meter cartridge and a very portable rifle. Very manageable recoil particularly with 350 grain bullets.

quote:

Originally posted by ldmay375:
I bought brass for the 416 Ruger before I actually seen a rifle made in it. I already had 375 Rugers and liked the case design.
Somehow, I got side tracked for a few years before getting a rifle in 416 Ruger. I have M70's 416 Remingtons also.
The 20" Alaskan in a McMillan Classic is one of my favorite rifles. I have not shot it since the recent stock replacement. But, expect it to be as well mannered with the factory Hogue.

To me the stainless 416 Ruger with 20" barrel was truely an Alaskan rifle / cartridge combination for those that like bigger bore rifles. Easily a 200 meter cartridge and a very portable rifle. Very manageable recoil particularly with 350 grain bullets.

You might consider the GSC in 330grains. The GSC website suggests that a 24" barrel should produce 2700fps and that the bandleader can expect to load up H4895 until that velocity is reached, without any pressure signs or problems. That same load would probably produce 2600fps in a 20" barrel.

Why mention these stats?

Because a bullet traveling at 2600 or 2700 fps is good for a lot more than 200 yards. I would rate it a load for 300+ yards.

Even if a conservative load of 2550fps were used, and the rifle were zeroed at 2.1" high at 100 yards, then the bullet would only drop -0.7" at 200 yards and -11" at 300, still retaining 2800 ft#. Those are very huntable trajectories in Africa and the energies should help anchor most animals. The nice thing about mono-metal bullets is that they function like heavier lead-core bullets. GSC considers the 330gn .416 a buffalo bullet, and I would concur, but I've only been using 350gn TSX and TTSX so far in mono-metal .416", including several buffalo.

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
I hav three 375 Rugers. Love the cartridge design. I wish Ruger would have done an entire family of cartridges based on the full size 375 Ruger case.

I've seen a .411 done on a .416R but has anyone taken one up to .423 to equal the 404 Jeffery.

quote:

Originally posted by mart:

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:
I hav three 375 Rugers. Love the cartridge design. I wish Ruger would have done an entire family of cartridges based on the full size 375 Ruger case.

I've seen a .411 done on a .416R but has anyone taken one up to .423 to equal the 404 Jeffery.

What a silly question on my part. A quick search turned up a few 423/416 wildcat builds. I should have known by now it would have been wildcatted six ways to Sunday.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
You still see them on the rack at local emporia in KY, gathering dust.
I am saving a couple of the .375 Rugers and .416 Rugers for my old age,
when I cannot handle the .458 Win.Mag. so well.
But to make it more fun, I put a canoe-paddle, old Ruger "Zytel" stock, on a .416 Ruger and it shed a full pound, down to 7.0 lbs exactly, bare/empty.
I do not like those Hogue stocks for some reason.
Must be like a rubber handle on a hunting knife, same aversion for me, just a personal peculiarity.
Stainless and 20-inch barreled, that .416 Ruger is a "Spruce King" or at least an "Alder Queen."

I also have a Ruger No.1, stainless/laminate, .416 Ruger with 24" barrel.
I have resisted the urge to re-chamber that to the original .416 Ruger, presented to Bill Ruger long before the current short version.
It was a .416 Rigby with a different shoulder,
either venturified or like 20 to 30-degree instead of 45-degree.
Great little cartridge, the current .416 Ruger,
no "sensible" reason to re-chamber that one.

Rip ...

Before I ordered my .458WM "jungle carbine" I considered the .416R (not the .375 which is considered a gay-friendly cartridge ).

Long story short...the mightiness of the .458WM, its universality, its history and absolute sheer performance, made the final choice a very easy one.

There is nothing the .416R can do that the .458WM won't do better.

PS: I owned two Zytel stocked M77 and simply love them. One piece, great material, light and durable. The new synth stock is miles behind.

quote:

Originally posted by Haverluk:
RIP,

Would you post a pic of the 416 in a boat paddle?

I'll do it.
Until then, the 1991 version of the .416 Ruger, compared to 2009 version:










Rip ...

quote:

Originally posted by TrademarkTexan:

quote:

Originally posted by 416Tanzan:
PS: the .416" diameter puts them a notch ahead of the venerable 375's for dangerous game hunting and shorter follow-up tracking.

This is not entirely on topic so I hope it doesn’t derail your thread, but I think it somewhat relevant.

Will a 416 Ruger clean up a 375 H&H chamber? Could you rebore and recharber without having to set the barrel back?

Yes, according to AmmoGuide a 416Ruger will clean up 375Ruger. One must first rebore, of course and the chamber needs to be concentric because the case heads are the same.

[Later edit: NOTE--my response was not for the 375 H&H. For that, see below, and the answer is no.]

quote:

BasterB:
Has anyone stuck a 458 in the ruger case yet?

quote:

LHeym500
I wish Ruger would have done an entire family of cartridges based on the full size 375 Ruger case.

Yes, a line of Ruger cartridges would have been nice.

This raises an enigma.

The 416 Ruger was the first development of the 375 Ruger case line. It is the functional equivalent of the 416 Remington in a medium-length action.

In terms of case capacity the 375Ruger holds about 5 grains more volume than the 375H&H. It is similar to the 340Weatherby and about ideal for medium bore cartridges (30 to 40 caliber) to bring out maximum hunting efficiency, 0-500 yards, and it does this in a medium-length "standard" action. So people where speculating that Ruger would come out with a 338Ruger and a 300Ruger, basically putting 300Weatherby and 340Weatherby ballistics in standard-length, less-expensive actions and rifles. But instead, Ruger came out with their RCM's (Ruger Compact Magnum). These were 30 and 33 caliber, but the case capacities were close to 30-06, howbeit in a short-action ("308"). The enigma--Why did Ruger take a great niche cartridge and hamstring it? Well, they might have been able to long-load a 338RCM into a 338WinMag, but they didn't exploit that.

Now the 458 raises a couple of questions for a 458 Ruger.
First, can 0.029" serve as enough diameter for a cartridge headspace? The answer is positive, if the 400Whelen can serve as any precedent. That round is based on 0.018" and 0.021" (RIP's version) shoulder headspace widths.
Secondly, what is an ideal case capacity for a 458 round? A 458 Ruger would be about 10+ grains more capacity than a WinMag. That would allow the Ruger to more easily handle 300-yard trajectories. But capacity brings more velocity at the expense of more recoil. Basically, a 458Ruger would put 458Lott ballistics in a medium-length cartridge. If a Winchester or CZ action were used, then there would be an option for some to long-load a 458Ruger, doing the very thing that RIP holds against the current 458Lott.

So is such a Ruger-build ideal? Jeffeoso has already gone one up with the 458AccRel using a 2.55" shortened-RUM case. That also allows for long-loading in a long action for those wanting more punch. Personally, I think that the super-magnum cases (.590" case-head) is the natural match for 40 to 50 caliber. A 2.5" Rigby-case might be the ideal in .458. But that is a wildcat, with all of the extra work involved.

So back to the 416Ruger. Personally, the 416 may be the ideal upper limit for that 95-100 grain capacity case. Larger bore should/could use larger capacities, at least if maintaining easy 300-yard cartridges. So that a 416Ruger becomes a viable contender for the old-age cartridge for DG and all-around plains game.

quote:

Originally posted by Haverluk:
RIP,

Would you post a pic of the 416 in a boat paddle?

Haverluk,
Here you go:





Above rifle was 7.0 lbs in basic Zytel stock.
With the laminated wood grip panels and 1" Decelerator pad replacing factory buttplate and plastic panels,
weight increased to about 7.5# (bare/empty rifle) and LOP increased from about 13.5" to current 14.25".
Those noisy factory sling hangers were repaced with Uncle Mike's kit for that purpose.
The Leupold 1.5-5x20mm scope in Warne QR lever rings weighs 1#3oz.

Here are the weights for factory Hawkeye M77 barreled actions:

.375 Ruger, African 23", 0.675" muzzle diameter: 6.0#

.375 Ruger, Alaskan 20", 0.675" muzzle diameter: 5.75#

.416 Ruger, Alaskan 20", 0.755" muzzle diameter: 5.5#

Some stock weights:
Zytel "Canoe Paddle" unaltered: 1.5#
Factory walnut African stock: 1.75#
Zytel "Canoe Paddle" altered as above: 2.0#
Hogue stock, rubber-coated, with aluminum pillars: 2.5#
HS Precision stock, with full aluminum bedding block: 2.5#

13.5" LOP increases to 14.5" LOP on the unaltered Zytel "Canoe Paddle" stock like so:



I have a .375 Ruger Alaskan stainless 20-incher set up in a basic Zytel stock, and that is a picture of the butt.
It weighs 7.5# bare/empty.
Leave the slip-on pad for hot weather, thin-light-shirt shootin'.
Take it off for cold weather, thick-winter-coat shootin'.
Winter is here.

Rip ...

quote:

Originally posted by TrademarkTexan:

quote:

Originally posted by 416Tanzan:
PS: the .416" diameter puts them a notch ahead of the venerable 375's for dangerous game hunting and shorter follow-up tracking.

This is not entirely on topic so I hope it doesn’t derail your thread, but I think it somewhat relevant.

Will a 416 Ruger clean up a 375 H&H chamber? Could you rebore and recharber without having to set the barrel back?

No, not quite.
The .375 H&H shoulder diameter is 0.4478" at 2.4122" length from breech bolt face.
Neck-1 diameter of the .416 Ruger is 0.4440 at 2.2412" and tapers by 0.001" to 0.4430" diameter at 2.580" length, neck-2.
So a few thou of .375 H&H shoulder diameter would intrude on the .416 Ruger neck.
You would have to set it back about 0.2" to clean it up.
Cut off about a 1/4" of the threads, re-thread, re-bore, re-chamber.
Voila! A .416 Ruger with a +3.6" box length.

Rip ...

RIP,

Wow, really cool pictures. Really cool text writing (how is that done?!). Really cool rifle!

I owned one of these once but it would not feed. Sent it back to Ruger three times and it never did feed. Sold it. In spite of that experience, I am a huge Ruger fan. Own many Ruger rifles.

I want to buy another one, and I want to change the stock. You've given me some great ideas. I didn't know about the after market sling studs, but that will be done on mine as well.

Thanks for all of the technical info on weights as well.

THAT was a high value post for me. Merry Chritmas RIP!!

surefire7,
Welcome, my pleasure.
The text writing on the pictures is just part of the "advanced" editing function at imgur.com which is free and fun.
Arrows come from the "stickers" button there.
You'll figure it out if you sign up and play with it.

Merry Christmas to you, and to all.
Now I gotta go check on that turkey in the oven ...

Rip ...

Tanzan416,

Thanks for starting this thread. I've learned a lot from you, RIP, and the others on this post.

Because of your thread, I've finally decided to order another Ruger Alaskan 416, and customize it to my desires.

Merry Christmas Tanzan!!!

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
surefire7,
Welcome, my pleasure.
The text writing on the pictures is just part of the "advanced" editing function at imgur.com which is free and fun.
Arrows come from the "stickers" button there.
You'll figure it out if you sign up and play with it.

Merry Christmas to you, and to all.
Now I gotta go check on that turkey in the oven ...

Rip ...

Thanks for the explanation RIP. I've always wondered how that was done on AR.

Some day I'd like to learn how to post pictures. Glad I didn't waste brain power on Photobucket.

I'd like to be able to post pictures of some of my rifles and animals. Sounds like this imgur is the 'way of the day' for now. I'm not smart enough to figure this stuff out on my own, but I have some 'techie' friends that I may be able to persuade to help me. Once I know how, I'm sure it would then be easy.

Anyway, thanks for your help and kindness.

This is just a test post to see if my new picture account works.

This is the 100-yard test group shot 3 weeks ago before ferrying the 500 over the pond.



Let's see.

Since one of the sub-topics in this thread is finding an easy-shooting effective DG rifle I thought a brief comment on recoil reduction may be in place.

Many have shared about the need to face a little more directly than with small bores, to hold on tightly to the forearm, to keep the head a little more erect, and to keep the butt inside the shoulder knuckle.

In addition, the most important might be called a sensory deadening 'target fixation'.

It is very important to develop a mental mindset that is fixed on the target without concern about recoil. That may be the primary reason that shooting at a game animal always seems to 'reduce' felt recoil. It may not be adrenalin as much as a mental fixation on the target, excluding extraneous thoughts. Of course, this must be practiced at the range and the bench so that there is no unconscious yank or eye-closure, etc., just before firing.

Once a person discovers that the big bore is not going to damage them, it is important to develop a sensory-deadened, 'target fixation' mental attitude. That mental attitude provides good groups and avoids a flinch.

My two cents, and applied to the group just above.

PS: of course, the other way around, it may also be adrenalin in a game situation that facilitates a 'target fixation'. Even so, that attitude must be attained "whenever".