This photo of the latest "Alaskan" is wrong for the .375 H&H, from Winchester web site, because it should show two cross bolts,
just like for the "Safari Express" version of the .375 H&H M70:



Below Winchester M70 Alaskan .375 H&H rifle weighs 7.625 lbs, which is 2 ounces lighter than the the 7.750-pound Ruger Hawkeye African .375 Ruger. How does South Carolina do it?
Well, they do it like this:

25" barrel that is 0.640" in diameter at the muzzle ...

quote:

which is 2 ounces lighter

RIP

Honest question.

People really care that a gun is 2 oz lighter ?

2 oz ffs.

More than one cup of tea or coffee or
a beer.

Real epoxy spot-bedding at recoil lug and tang of action.
The new trigger does have a spot of hotglue covering an adjustment hole.

My trigger has a crisp 4.0-pound pull weight, and I can live with that.

The one-piece bottom metal is aluminum alloy, though the hinged floor plate and plunger latch are steel.

Walnut stock (with two good and functional cross-bolts) weighs 2.0 lbs.

There is an integral "dognut" on the barrel for the dovetail of the rear sight (fold-down for those of us that like receiver sights).
This integral dognut would be a great place for a secondary recoil lug attachment,
though I do not believe the .375 H&H needs one.

The barreled action weighs 5#-10-oz.

With a "Brown Pounder" Brown Precision stock,
the entire rifle will weigh 6#-10-oz, before the scope and rings, sling and ammo are added.

If I come across the other version of the new South Carolina Winchester M70 .375 H&H rifle ...

Safari Express:




... The weight of that one will be very interesting to me, even if not to 505G.

The Ruger Hawkeye .375 Ruger has an all-steel bottom metal and a 2" shorter barrel, and a shorter action,
but weighs 2 ounces more than this M70 Alaskan .375 H&H.

Interesting to me, if not to 505G.

The Winchester site:
www.winchesterguns.com
says that both versions of this .375 H&H weigh 9.0 pounds, and that ain't so!

There is a stainless-laminate M70 Alaskan that is offered in .30-06 only, not .375 H&H, but it is said to weigh 9.0 pounds also!!!

What diameter is the muzzle?

quote:

Originally posted by FAST996:
What diameter is the muzzle?

.375 H&H M70 Alaskan is 0.640" diameter at the muzzle, 25"-barrel length.

RIP, thanks for that breakdown.

While I couldn't care less what Ruger is doing, this latest Winchester does interest me...Like I need yet another 375! I will probably buy the first one of these I come across.

Finally Winchester builds a 375 H&H with a reasonable barrel contour! Punch it 375 Weatherby and rock on.

BTW, McMillan claims to already have this barrel contour programed and are ready to go.

Ongwe,
Welcome, to a discerning riflecrank.

The "Alaskan" is like a featherweight version of the "Safari Express" M70 .375 H&H.

I think .640" diameter at 25" length is indeed nice.
I go as skinny as .625" diameter at 24" length (No.3 Douglas Sporter Contour) with confidence, for a .375 H&H.
Yep, the Alaskan barrel is very nice.

quote:

If I come across the other version of the new South Carolina Winchester M70 .375 H&H rifle ...

Safari Express:




The Winchester site:
www.winchesterguns.com
says that both versions of this .375 H&H weigh 9.0 pounds, and that ain't so!

There is a stainless-laminate M70 Alaskan that is offered in .30-06 only, not .375 H&H, but it is said to weigh 9.0 pounds also!!!

That is the rifle I bought recently. Haven't had time to take it to the range yet; just got a scope mounted on it.

Without the scope, the rifle is for sure 9 lbs, but I didn't weigh it.

Very solidly built, functional rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by Ongwe:

... BTW, McMillan claims to already have this barrel contour programed and are ready to go.

Ah, yes, very good to know ... McMillan Edge ...
The rifle might be less than 7 pounds with that stock:



We created this ultralight hunting stock using the technology we developed for the very popular EDGE benchrest stock. It is a slim classic style and may be inletted for any right or left hand Remington 700 or Model 7 action in BDL or blind magazine configuration. The slender forend will accept up to a factory magnum barrel contour or custom barrel similar to a #3 Douglas or smaller. This all-graphite stock comes standard with aluminum pillars, a 1/2" Pachmayr Decelerator recoil pad and two sling studs in any of our painted colors. The finished stock will weigh in at 22-24 ounces, depending on the action cutout. It is not available in molded-in camo or marble finishes in order to save weight. Though an ultralight, it is still guaranteed to handle the recoil of all magnum cartridges thru .300 Win Mag recoil level.Click for Details

Hunters Edge® / Winchester/Montana Rifle Company

By popular demand, we now offer the ultralight Hunters EDGE for Winchester 70 and Montana 1999 actions. It can be inletted for long or short, right or left-handed actions in most bottom metal configurations.

Demoniacal,
I believe from the looks of it, the Winchester M70 Safari Express .375 H&H might indeed weigh 9.0 pounds, exactly, bare-naked-empty-dry.
With scope, rings, and ammo it must be over 10 pounds.
The Winchester M70 Alaskan .375 H&H is a lighter version.
That is all I am saying.

Shhhh. Don't tell Rich. He'll seat it is another "model" after all he seems count every cosmetic change a new model. Even if it ain't a geen ewe ein 98

Demonical:

What is the muzzle diameter on the Safari version?

RIP, if you look closely at the pictures here and on the Winchester web site, you can see the difference in barrel contour. The Alaskan is thinner behind the front site and steps down in front of the front site. I have looked at these pictures at least a dozen times and never noticed the difference.

Rip,

Would any modifications have to be made to the Alaskan other than barrel work to go to 375 WBY ?

quote:

There is a stainless-laminate M70 Alaskan that is offered in .30-06 only, not .375 H&H, but it is said to weigh 9.0 pounds also!!!

Interesting. I recall they chambered the Alaskan laminate in 338 awhile back, but I guess they no longer do.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:

quote:

Originally posted by Ongwe:

... BTW, McMillan claims to already have this barrel contour programed and are ready to go.

Ah, yes, very good to know ... McMillan Edge ...
The rifle might be less than 7 pounds with that stock:



We created this ultralight hunting stock using the technology we developed for the very popular EDGE benchrest stock. It is a slim classic style and may be inletted for any right or left hand Remington 700 or Model 7 action in BDL or blind magazine configuration. The slender forend will accept up to a factory magnum barrel contour or custom barrel similar to a #3 Douglas or smaller. This all-graphite stock comes standard with aluminum pillars, a 1/2" Pachmayr Decelerator recoil pad and two sling studs in any of our painted colors. The finished stock will weigh in at 22-24 ounces, depending on the action cutout. It is not available in molded-in camo or marble finishes in order to save weight. Though an ultralight, it is still guaranteed to handle the recoil of all magnum cartridges thru .300 Win Mag recoil level.Click for Details

Hunters Edge® / Winchester/Montana Rifle Company

By popular demand, we now offer the ultralight Hunters EDGE for Winchester 70 and Montana 1999 actions. It can be inletted for long or short, right or left-handed actions in most bottom metal configurations.

This would make quite the packable rifle. Add some metal coating and this would seem to be a great nasty weather rifle. Might have to keep my eyes peeled

IIRC the Safari Express stock weighs about 2.75lbs and the muzzle diameter is .719 at 24 inches. That should be about the difference between the two rifles in weight.

Looks like Winchester still has not learned how to glass bed an action. The recoil lug is touching at the front, sides and bottom whereas any good glass bedding instructions will tell you it should touch at the back.

To quote the Bedrock instructions:

"Figure 10B: Tape all sides of recoil lug except for the
rear."

The trigger, while excellent if you live in Arizona, is also a step backward from the classic, foolproof M 70 trigger.
As with all complex triggers it will pack up in a day or two if exposed to wet salt air or wind driven talcum powder sand.

For any rifle, especially a DG one, the closer you are to a Mauser military trigger, the less chance for mishaps.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
Demoniacal,
I believe from the looks of it, the Winchester M70 Safari Express .375 H&H might indeed weigh 9.0 pounds, exactly, bare-naked-empty-dry.
With scope, rings, and ammo it must be over 10 pounds.
The Winchester M70 Alaskan .375 H&H is a lighter version.
That is all I am saying.

Yeah, just sayin'.

I'm going to put my rifle on the scale here one of these days.

I was fondling it again last night, while watching some African hunt DVDs.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
Demonical:

What is the muzzle diameter on the Safari version?

RIP, if you look closely at the pictures here and on the Winchester web site, you can see the difference in barrel contour. The Alaskan is thinner behind the front site and steps down in front of the front site. I have looked at these pictures at least a dozen times and never noticed the difference.

Dave, the muzzle is 0.727".

Damn, they went back to that cheesy folding rear sight. They suck.


.

quote:

Originally posted by lrich:
Rip,

Would any modifications have to be made to the Alaskan other than barrel work to go to 375 WBY ?

If you want one that light, it would be a simple re-chamber and maybe nothing else if it fed well.
Definitely some aluminum pillars and improved glass bedding, if walnut is used.
Or get a McMillan stock.
With the two-pound walnut stock, it balances on the front cross bolt.
With an Edge stock and a light scope it would probably keep the same balance and might weigh about 8 pounds.
Sounds like the perfect .375 Wby to me, like "Big Nan" the rifle of Hal Waugh, famous early Alaskan Guide: In book, Oh For the Life of a Guide.

quote:

Originally posted by FAST996:
IIRC the Safari Express stock weighs about 2.75lbs and the muzzle diameter is .719 at 24 inches. That should be about the difference between the two rifles in weight.

Yep, sounds about right on.

Here is the stainless laminate 30-06, which seems to be the only currently offered chambering in that variant of "Alaskan":

I have the Safari Express out of SC. For those that are interested, I just weighed it and it weighs just over 10lbs with Leupold QD mounts and rings and a Zeiss Conquest scope. It shoots sub-MOA with every factory load I put through it. I like the weight as it has very little recoil and is steady on the sticks. I have only put 400 rounds through it but I am very happy with it.

I would need to call a custom gun maker to get a nicer gun and even then it would not shoot any better. I had a pre-64 in .375 and this SC M70 shoots much better and kicks a heck of a lot less.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:
Damn, they went back to that cheesy folding rear sight. They suck.

I like it. Good for non-use by folding down and relying on the receiver sight/peep.

The Safari Express does not have the fold down sight. I think the sight may be an NECG. I would thing the Alaskan model with the laminated stock would be quite heavy compared to the other models.

quote:

Originally posted by SFRanger7GP:
The Safari Express does not have the fold down sight. I think the sight may be an NECG. I would thing the Alaskan model with the laminated stock would be quite heavy compared to the other models.

We don't think they have made the stainless-laminate M70 Alaskan rifle in .375 H&H yet.
But for whatever style M70 stock, it would be about 1/2 pound heavier in laminate than in walnut.

If the walnut Safari Express stock weighs 2.75 lbs and the Alaskan stock weighs 2.00 lbs in walnut,
that would be about 3.25 lbs as a laminate Safari Express stock,
and about 2.5 pounds as an Alaskan laminate stock.

That would make the Alaskan M70 in stainless laminate butt-heavy with the slim barrel, and it would need a heavier barrel to balance it.

Alaskan laminate stock with Safari Express barreled action made of stainless, would make it weigh 9.0 pounds again, and balance well,
like the Safari Express with the chubbier walnut stock as currently.

The fold-down sight is dove-tailed into an integral "dognut" and not just screwed onto the barrel like the NECG.
I like the "dognut and dovetail."
Sight will rarely be used by me anyway.
Both use the same cheesey, screwed-on front sight.
Glad for 1X to 5X scopes.

RIP
Beat you to it and it's already been snuggled into a McMillian. It shoots sub moa and is probably going to spend a lot of time in the field with me from now on.

surestrike:
A keeper, eh?
I better quit the 'cattin' aroun' and get one like yours.
I'll leave her as a .375 H&H and call her "Nancy."
McMillan Edge and choice of metal coating.

Some thoughts on my new Winchester.
I purchased a new Win in .375H&H and re-barreled it to .400H&H, lengthened the stock, put in an extra recoil lug and had some magazine work done so it will hold 1 up and 4 down. While I was working on the stock I removed the cheek piece, (I shoot right handed guns left handed) and put in different cross pins and covered them with ebony. In working up loads and practicing for my trip to Zim I've put over 300 rounds through the gun. In that time I had the firing pin spring go soft I replaced it with a 30lb WOLFF - BLITZSCHNELL STRIKER SPRING from Brownells. They come stock with a 24lb spring.
Bye the bye the new Win no longer has the collet that holds the firing pin spring to the firing pin it is now a C clip and is about 7 coils shorter. I also had some issue with the new MOA trigger, first let me say that this is a very crisp trigger with no creep or over travel my only complaint was the lowest poundage I could get my gun adjusted to was 4 1/2 lbs. Timney now makes a replacement trigger but a good gunsmith can get into the box and adjust the sear.
Would I buy another Winchester in a heart beat, thinking of a 458 win mag re-chambered to 458 lott.... I'm just one of those end users that can't leave well enough alone.

Zephyr,
Good points I shall take under advisement:
30-pound Wolf spring... I need one for a Ruger Hawkeye too. Brownell's here I come.
My trigger is 4-lbs. out of the box, will see if Rusty can reduce it to 3.5#, if not I will leave it alone.
C-clip on the firing pin!!!
I'll have to look into that, haven't yet.
Shame on Winchester!!!

I hope the extractor is good spring steel not needing a replacement, like a Williams was needed for the old Classics from Connecticut.

Ruger or Winchester, tomato, tomahto ...
At least I never had to replace a Ruger extractor.
Rabid Winchester fans:

When I get all the bugs worked out of the Winchester, I will try this in it,
a funny-shaped, light bullet that kills all out of proportion to its weight,
it might require the short throat of the .375 H&H for best accuracy:

RIP

I used 235gn Woodleigh Hydro's out of a 375H&H
and they
1. Flattened Buffalo as is killed it well
2. Penetrated like a 270 or 300 grain RN SN bullet
3. Created a wound channel that was as though
it was a RN SN.

I like these light bullets in the 375H&H.

quote:

Originally posted by 505G:
RIP

I used 235gn Woodleigh Hydro's out of a 375H&H
and they
1. Flattened Buffalo as is killed it well
2. Penetrated like a 270 or 300 grain RN SN bullet
3. Created a wound channel that was as though
it was a RN SN.

I like these light bullets in the 375H&H.

Another "funny-shaped, light bullet that kills all out of proportion to its weight."

Maybe the CEB has a better BC with tip installed?
(237 grains)
With no tip, it can be reversed and fired as an FN brass solid with "Bastard(file) Bullet Works" #13 nose profile (230 grains).
The hollow-tailed-FN solid would be stabilized out the wazoo:
Dart stabilized.
Shoulder stabilized.
Spin stabilized by 1:12" twist at 2800 fps.
I have high hopes for accuracy in both modes, and same practical POI.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
Zephyr,
Good points I shall take under advisement:
30-pound Wolf spring... I need one for a Ruger Hawkeye too. Brownell's here I come.
My trigger is 4-lbs. out of the box, will see if Rusty can reduce it to 3.5#, if not I will leave it alone.
C-clip on the firing pin!!!

I'll have to look into that, haven't yet.
Shame on Winchester!!!

I hope the extractor is good spring steel not needing a replacement, like a Williams was needed for the old Classics from Connecticut.

Ruger or Winchester, tomato, tomahto ...
At least I never had to replace a Ruger extractor.
Rabid Winchester fans:

No problems yet with the extractor. If you replace the firing pin spring find or fabricate a small washer to sit between the coils and the C clip got this tip from a well known custom gun maker who uses the new 70's

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:

quote:

Originally posted by lrich:
Rip,

Would any modifications have to be made to the Alaskan other than barrel work to go to 375 WBY ?

If you want one that light, it would be a simple re-chamber and maybe nothing else if it fed well.
Definitely some aluminum pillars and improved glass bedding, if walnut is used.
Or get a McMillan stock.
With the two-pound walnut stock, it balances on the front cross bolt.
With an Edge stock and a light scope it would probably keep the same balance and might weigh about 8 pounds.
Sounds like the perfect .375 Wby to me, like "Big Nan" the rifle of Hal Waugh, famous early Alaskan Guide: In book, Oh For the Life of a Guide.

Though not an M70, my XCR II rechambered to 375 Weatherby with a Leupold 1.5-5x scope and a 24" barrel weighs 7.5 lbs (about 12 oz lighter than the Remington specs). The recoil is mild shooting 375 H&H factory, a little snappy with 375 Weatherby rounds (300g at 2700 fps)

Would a McMillan Edge stock be suitable for a 375 H&H? They quote 300 Win Mag and lower but...??

Chuck375 has a very light .375 Wby and he has lived to tell of it.

Dead Eye,
McMillan is saying they "guarantee" the stock for applications to .300 magnums.
We don't pay any attention to things like that.
100% carbon fiber construction and aluminum pillars: Sounds .375 Magnum-Ready to me.
I have a Brown Precision "Brown Pounder" 1-pound stock that worked very well on a .375 H&H, for 2 decades from Alaska to Botswana and back.
That stock is still on the same rifle that is now a switch-barrel with .375 H&H and .395 H&H barrels.

Here is the South Carolina Winchester M70, C-Clip and cast-metal extractor:





The closed side of the C-Clip:


Asked Rusty what he thought about this:

Winchester has always done it this way.
There is a very positive stop of thick C-Clip in a groove on the firing pin.
Inside the bolt body, there is no place for the clip to go, it cannot unseat.
No need to change the firing pin spring for a Wolf 30-pounder unless there is a "soft" factory spring problem.
The extractor could be changed to a Williams, machined, spring-steel extractor easily enough, though the cast metal factory extractor rarely causes problems.
Standard Mauser M98 firing pin spring is a 19-pounder.
Ruger M77 Mark II/Hawkeye: 21-pounder.
Winchester M70: 23-pounder
Using stronger firing-pin springs will make the actions stiffer in cocking.

My thoughts:
The Winchester C-Clip is light years ahead of the pubic-hair-sized, wire-like C-Clip and single nut that CZ tried to use for a little while
(now replaced with the double-nut) and there is no need to monkey with that aspect of the M70.

It would not hurt to change out the extractor for a better one, sooner than later.

The firing pin spring should be changed only if it starts failing to ignite primers.
And if the change is to be made, why not go 30-pounder, and maybe sooner than later would also be better here also?

Just a thought, but, blue steel and a wood stock. What the heck about that makes it an "Alaskan"? If it was stainless steel or a hard coated barrel/action with a synthetic stock I would understand, but plain old blue and wood?

quote:

Originally posted by JCS271:
Just a thought, but, blue steel and a wood stock. What the hell about that makes it an "Alaskan"? If it was stainless steel or a hard coated barrel/action with a synthetic stock I would understand, but plain old blue and wood, NOT!

When the pre-64 magnums came out

the 264 WM was the Westerner

the 338 WM was the Alaskan and

of Course the 458 WM was the African-

I have my Granddads 338 WM marked "Alaskan" on the barrel. its a super rifle.

Thats the "Alaskan " connection for medium-large bore Winchesters.