The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Finally broke down and scoped my .404 Jeffery.Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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The rifle is a Dakota M-76 African in .404 Jeffery. It has shot exquisitely well with iron sights getting very nice 3 to 4" groups at 100 yards from a bench with the factory sights. That's as good as I can do with those sights at 100 yards. I decided last week to throw a low power scope on it in a set of QD's to increase the versatility of the rifle and check it's true accuracy potential. I put a Leupold VX III in 1.75X6 on it mounted as low as possible and took it out to the range yesterday. OMG this thing shoots!! I am pushing a 400 gr Hornandy DGX behind 78 grs of RL 15 and my loads are showing a mean velocity of just under 2300 FPS. My slowest being at 2273 FPS and my fastest at a hair over 2300 FPS. Off of a sand bag rest the rifle is shooting a three hole cluster at 100 yards. Sighted in 2" high @ 100 yards the rifle is dead on at 200 yards and is also shooting sub MOA at that range. Just for fun I took it out to 300 yards and it groups very tight but is really starting to drop at 300 yards being about 14" low. Obviously I wouldn't use this sight in for DG hunting and would most likely sight it dead on for 100 yards as that gives me a 25 yard zero as well, (close enough in any case). This thing shoots so well I am tempted to use it for elk this year. Do any of you guys know of a bullet maker who offers a .423 diameter 350 gr or even a 300 gr bullet in a less round and more spitzer type aerodynamic configuration? I am thinking that if I can get a bullet doing 2500 to 2600 FPS or so I'd have a pretty serious 350 to 400 yard elk rifle here. Just for fun of course, any ideas guys? | ||
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Sounds like you are good to go | |||
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North Fork makes a 340 grain that should work. | |||
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I had forgotten about North Forks thanks. Looking at some 350 gr load data it appears that I should be able to get an honest 2500 to 2600 MV out of them. That ought to do the trick!  Now if I can just past the sticker shock on those things! Holly cow. | |||
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Sounds like you've got a good load developed already, just use that! I'm taking my 500 Jeffery elk hunting, sighted in 3" high at 100 yards it's almost dead on at 25 yards and dead on at 200 yards. It's 12" low at 300 yards still packing over 4000 ft/lbs of energy. Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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GS Custom has a 320gn that you should be able to get 2700fps with. Calibre Bullet Twist Powder Start gr MAX FPS FPS/Inch COL/mm % Fill Burn M/PSI 404 Jeff 423320HV061 H380 88 2700 24 Ramshot Big Game 85 2700 24 Win 760 89 2700 25 ADI AR 2208 79 2600 24 S355 84 2650 22 | |||
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I'm not so sure I'd be going for anything lighter than the 400gr that you are getting such great accuracy with. A 300gr or thereabouts will be short and stubby and not have the best SD or BC for longer range shooting. Your 2" high at a hundred yards should be brought up to 3" high just as chuck375 is doing for his 500 Jeffery and as most smaller calibres are sighted, to give yourself a 250 yard dead on hold using the 400 grainer, then you will find your bullet drop will be less at 300 yards and beyond. A good quicker opening 400 grain soft point at that sort of range on elk is going to have good penetration and knock down. | |||
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You might contact Dan Smitchko, President of Cutting Edge Bullets, regarding the .423 caliber 320gr MTH bullet - that's their match quality hollow point hunting bullet. I just received 300 of them a few weeks ago. I don't exactly recollect but the BC is somewhere in the .450 range so it's good out past 300yds. Jim  "Life's hard; it's harder if you're stupid" John Wayne | |||
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I have to agree with your logic here guys. The 400 gr loads are very accurate why mess with a good thing. I just like to play around with this stuff for the most part. But with those NF's at $100+ a box with shipping I think I'll have to settle for what I've got. The GS's are more! That's a lot of money for a play project. I was just looking through my stuff and found a box of 400 gr Barnes TSX. They'd be a bit more slippery but I'm guessing that it wouldn't really make much difference at the ranges we are talking about. | |||
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Thanks Jim that's one I hadn't heard of before. | |||
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CEB bullets for a 320-grain/.423, would be my choice when my 320-grain/.423 GSC HV stash runs out. I save those for the "404 Rigby Improved Plus" Dakota M76, 23" barrel at 2800-2900 fps. Here is that beauty combo:  For the 404 Jeffery M70 WITH 24" BARREL, I am all set with 340-grain North Forks, and 380-grain North Forks of all types: Varget Extreme loads are similar to RL-15 loads, just not as much lot-to-lot variation and better temperature stability with Varget:   Another couple of information dense targets.  At 200 yards the 340-grain NF soft point is 1/2" high, when it is 3" high at 100 yards, and 7-3/4" low at 300 yards. | |||
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Thanks for the great info guys. I've picked up a couple of great new tid bits of .423 information here. | |||
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Surestrike, I understand that you have a load that is working for you. If you ever wanted to try something different, give the GS Customs a try. I shoot them exclusively out of all of my rifles. They are actually produced down the road here in Port Elizabeth, South Africa. They ahve been proven to lower your pressures, which mean that you can drive them faster than your normal bullets. Might just give your .404 the extra bit of legs, should you need it. Best Regards Marius Goosen Marius Goosen KMG Hunting Safaris Cell, Whats App, Signal + 27 82 8205387 E-mail: info@huntsafaris.co.za Website: www.huntsafaris.co.za Skype: muis19820603 Check us out on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kmghuntingsafaris Instagram: @kmg_hunting_safaris | |||
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Thanks Marius, I'll be in South Africa next summer. I'll be sure and pick some up. My buddy I am going to see lives in Potchefstrum which is a long way from PE. But I'm going to have GS send some bullets to him and I'll pick them up there. | |||
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Surestrike, there is an agent for GS Customs in the USA, so they should be readily available to you. Check out their website here: http://www.gscustom.co.za If you would like to collect them here, just make sure you place your order early. Lead time at the moment is about 5 weeks. Best Regards Marius Marius Goosen KMG Hunting Safaris Cell, Whats App, Signal + 27 82 8205387 E-mail: info@huntsafaris.co.za Website: www.huntsafaris.co.za Skype: muis19820603 Check us out on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kmghuntingsafaris Instagram: @kmg_hunting_safaris | |||
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Marius, AWESOME thanks for the info!! | |||
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The most overlooked powder in the 404, at least on AR is IMR-4831...95 grs. of IMR-4831 will give you 2600 FPS with a 400 gr. in a 27 and some 26 inch barrels, its not that hot and brass lasts forever if you trim about every 4th shot. It is the single most accurate load that I have ever used in my 404s..I got this load from an article in the African Hunter and an article by Hopkins of PH fame..I tested it throughly and that has been my only powder since that time. My hunting load has been 93 grs. for a bit over 2400 FPS with Wooldleihs and GS Cusoms bullets, as recoil is substantially less, accuracy is the same, POI is the same in my gun. I had the specs on the 350 gr. Barnes X but can't find it but I'm thinking I used 95 grs. of same and found it a fine load. The 404 is fine when scoped, and that is advantageous as recoil is mild enough except for the most careless of shooters. I am reluctant to scope the 458 Lott and up as I have seen way too many deep and serious half moon scope cuts over the eye, as a result of the big bores shot in stressful situations, It will happen sooner or later, and they hit much harder than a .270....  Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Is this correct: 2 more grains of powder gives you 200fps increase in velocity? I ask because that seems like a huge gain in velocity of such a small increase in powder. Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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Ray, Is that a compressed load? | |||
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J Brown, I got that but checking my book there was a difference of 3 inches in barrel length between two different 404s, allowing for that, the difference is probably there, also I rounded off those figures so the difference isn't all that great between guns of like barrels. sorry about that. My Jefferys was a 27 inch original gun and my custom was a 24 inch gun. thanks for the heads up. Surestrike The 95 grs. of IMR-4831 is a fluffy one shot case full in in my cases and needs a tapping. My reamer is a std.clymer. Some here have proclaimed trouble getting that much IMR-4831 in there 404 cases..A 50 and 45 gr. drop should work in any 404 I would think..Has in all fo mine. It is my best accuracy combo which I find common, and a little compaction makes for accuracy in most rifles IMO.. Too much compation seems to be a problem in some calibers but I have never had this problem in the 404 or any other caliber for that matter??..The straight walled case of the 458 Win is supposed to be the worst offender of compaction failures??.. I'm not altogether sold on this compaction, caking of powders syndrome in that I have seen most powders cake in cases that have sat for several years, if you pulled the bullets you had to dig the powder out with a screw driver or whatever..They never misfired, so ?????????? I wonder if its a primer problem as opposed to caking. I don't know, just wonder. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Surestrike, I was out in the shop filing in my iron sights on one of my 9.3x62s and while the barrel was cooling I took a "thick" 404 Jefferyts Norma case resized and primed, and it held 108 grs. of modern IMR-4831 to the top..95 grs. came up half way in the neck, perfect! So I started playing with it while the neighbors were at work. A thin tough RWS case held 111 grs. to the top.. So I think we can lay that arguement to rest for those who some time ago advised me that I could not get 95 grs. of IMR-4831 in a 404 case. I don't understand that kind of false reporting. Even a worn out reamer will allow that...BTW, my old army surplus 4831 gets 119 grs in the case and lots of velocity.... Thoughtfull thinking will make one realize the 404 and the 416 Rigby hold simulair amts of powder or water, with the edge going to the Rigby, but a 404 can come within my old Rigby by a 100 FPS with any load that Rigby can cook. The Rigby can be pretty awesome as it is nothing more than a 416 Wby sans the belt. I loaded my to 2700 FPS (some profess 2900??) and tried it on buffalo and it sure worked as did the 404 at 2653 FPS, both had excessive recoil and didn't appear to kill any better or worse than 2400 FPS, thus my 93 gr. load for the 404. I just clocked it thru my chronograph at 2389 FPS for 3 shots averaged, a little short of what I have been getting but this new Rem 30-S, 404 has a short 22 inch barrel. but hey thats close enough for government work.. What a great caliber the 404 when loaded properly..It is not so awesome at 2100 and 2200 FPS as claimed. This became apparant early on in Africa, and after many complaints, RWS gave the Africans a 2300 plus FPS load and all was well.. I can most definately tell the difference as its obvious when buff are hit with the 2400 FPS, they quiver or shudder and they don't make as many tracks. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Thanks for that report Ray. I've got some time off Friday and will be doing some loading. I'll give your recipe a try. | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Finally broke down and scoped my .404 Jeffery.
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