The Accurate Reloading Forums
475 A&M - it has to be said...
05 December 2001, 19:02
Karl475 A&M - it has to be said...
Cartridges of the world has just printed the ridiculously optimistic figures for the 475 A&M yet again.
I notice for some of the old german calibres such as the 7mm vom hoffe, the author has seen fit to include 'optimistic' in brackets after the ballistics.
And then is quite happy to quote the 475 A&M with ballistics approaching 10 000ftlbs!!!
When that cartridge hits even 9000ftlbs I will be getting 6000 from my 375H&H. 
Who do we e-mail about this crap?
Karl.
06 December 2001, 05:04
<Mitch>Karl, I think you would be lucky to get an honest 8000 ft. lbs. out it. I don't know where you would sent an e.mail.
06 December 2001, 05:49
500grainsKarl,
Cartridges of the World is replete with technical errors. Look at the cartridge dimensions and you will find a number of them incorrect.
06 December 2001, 16:59
470 Mbogo[QUOTE]Originally posted by Karl:
Hi Karl,
I know exactly what you mean. You keep reading things and wonder if the guy putting it together is sleeping at the wheel. I think that overly optimistic figure has been publish from the first issue. They finally backed down the 460 Weatherby velocity to 2600 fps but you still hear "that most powerful at 8000 ft lbs." phrase. I can tell you from experience with my 470 which is a bigger case than the A&M that 2650 to 2670 is probably the max. I stay at 2500 for pressure and shootability reasons. 470 Mbogo
06 December 2001, 17:17
<R. A. Berry>Right,
This bad data just got started, or repeated first, in the P.O. Ackley books without verification, and has simply been perpetuated in a "ho hum" manner.
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DaggaRon
RAB
07 December 2001, 10:40
<jagtip>Ever notice how many of them selectively use double standards when exaggerating figures for one cartridge while being a bit too conservative with another???I believe that this is just the writer's prejudice revealing itself through his preferential treatment.Maybe that's just human nature.
11 December 2001, 15:30
KarlAs mentioned above, there are quite some myths and inconsistencies perpetuated in different manuals.
Time to do something about it.
If the 10th edition has made corrections you know who to thank.
Karl.
11 December 2001, 15:41
ACRecurveWhat kind of myth will be next? An undefeated season for the Aggies? I guess it's possible if the A&M can generate 10000 ft-lbs of KE!
Good Hunting and Gig 'em.
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Andy Cooper
12 December 2001, 19:24
<Matt77>my favourite is, in the 4th edition I believe, the author stated something like, the 8mm rem mag is only hurt by the less than desirable bullet selection.. then a paragraph later he stated that there is a good selection of bullets for the reloader!! The opposite page with the 8 X 57, he said that there were a good number of bullets...
he contridicts himself so much. Where's the editor? Other than the picture of himself on the sleave?
12 December 2001, 19:31
470 Mbogo[QUOTE]Originally posted by Matt77:
Hi Matt,
As buyers of these kind of books maybe we should contact the author and suggest that it has to pass the accuratereloading proof reading department before publishing. That would set that book straight.
470 Mbogo
[This message has been edited by 470 Mbogo (edited 12-12-2001).]
14 December 2001, 15:09
AtkinsonHeh Heh!, Did you ever see P.O. at the loading bench, I wouldn't be surprised if he got 10,000 out of anything...He loaded until a primer blew and then cut back .5 grain and called it max.
Try some of Ackleys max loads in any caliber, you will get a wake up call.
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Ray Atkinson
ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com
16 December 2001, 17:54
KarlThe issue is of course 'safe maximums', not 'absolute maximums' or 'destructive testing' as used in Industry.
I think enabling say a 475/460 wby to acheive 10 000ftlbs(which is the same as enabling a 416 rem to acheive 7000ftlbs)
would class as destructive testing.
Unless of course african 'pros' are advising clients to push their 416 Remingtons to 2800fps with a 400gn bullet these days?
I'll leave that wake up call for someone with a lot of money and a remote firing rig
Karl.
16 December 2001, 22:12
<Bill T>They also said, (about the .475 A & M), "It's recoil is the equivilant of going a couple of rounds with the world heavyweight boxing champ", what crap! Bill T.
17 December 2001, 07:58
ScottBquote:
Originally posted by ACRecurve:
What kind of myth will be next? An undefeated season for the Aggies? I guess it's possible if the A&M can generate 10000 ft-lbs of KE!
Good Hunting and Gig 'em.
First they have to learn the art of tortilla throwing
17 December 2001, 13:48
AtkinsonRight on Bill T, I'd much rather go 10 rounds with the worlds boxing champ!!!
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Ray Atkinson
ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com
21 January 2002, 14:23
fla3006How about this for a stupid remark in Cartidges of the World: "The 500 Jeffery is similar to the 505 Gibbs, but it has a shorter case and is loaded to higher velocity and energy. The two are interchangeable."
21 January 2002, 14:27
fla3006I always wondered how the 475 could be so much more powerful than either the 460 or various 500's based on the Weatherby/Rigby case given that it fell in between.
22 January 2002, 07:08
<333-OKH>The url for Cartridges of the World is
www.krause.com the publisher. On the menu bar at the top of the page click on "about us", bottom of that page click on "contact us" and scroll down to publications.
If enough people complain they will take notice, like most corporations, they have to get more than the occasional complaint. If all 7000 plus of us hammered them it should do the trick. Who wants to go throughthe book and do the editing Krause has neglected?
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If Elmer didn't say it, it probably ain't true.