The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Need help with 458 Mag rifle buildGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
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I've decided to go ahead and convert my Winchester stainless / synthetic 300 win Mag M70 classic rifle to 458 magnum. Need some help with decision regarding barrel profile length etc. Ultimately i'm looking for a fairly light weight carry rifle suitable for all weather conditions. I'm retaining the standard synthetic stock but will get it bedded & cross bolted, looking at a no 5 or 6 shilen barrel around 22" long topped off with NECG master piece barrel bandfront sight, barrel band sling swivel & Single fixed blade express rear. Scope mounts to be nickel quick release leupold items and will probably top off with either a 2.5 Leupold or 1.5-5 VX3. See any problems with above, any improvements I should look at, is the barrel profile going to be light enough for a carry all day rifle? Just looking at drawing on your experience & wisdom. | ||
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Personally I would go a bit thinner on the barrel and lenghten it to 24". It would give you a bit more velocity, and take the boom further away from your ears. Unless you are very short, it should balance better too. Good luck! Bent Fossdal Reiso 5685 Uggdal Norway | |||
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I have a new rifle just about finished (awaiting blue), it is a Rem 700 in 458 designed to be light. This is to be my SE Alaska brown bear rifle. The #5 Shilen is the lightest they make I believe, I used this same barrel on mine and cut it at 22". The #5 Shilen is a light barrel, it looks a bit like a shotgun barrel with such thin walls when viewed from the muzzle, adding another 2" to barrel length would not increase the weight by anything of notice I'd venture. I get about 2025fps with a non-max load of Varget and Hornady 500 Interlocks. I believe I could get to the apparently magical 2150fps with a different powder and full load in my stubby 22" barrel. I have retained the synthetic Remington stock and plan to test it well for durability over the next few months, no cross bolts in this stock yet but if it breaks I'll reinforce the next one. The rifle as test fired over an Oehler was 7lbs 6oz (no sights, scope or base&rings), the recoil was not frightening or painful. There is no brake or recoil reducer on this rifle. I have a Leupold 1.5x5 Illuminated 30mm for it but I also have a spare 1.5x5 VXIII 1" too. I have no plans for iron sights on this rifle (I can't see up close well enough to use them anyway). Reloading components are a little difficult to get at times, I have managed to get 200 Hornady cases and a proper pile of Hornady 500 Interlocks along with some Barnes 500s and 350s. I plan on using a full length Picatinny type base and heavy Leupold rings (no use to use quick release for me). | |||
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For efficiency and velocity, the 458wm likes longer barrels. But I think 23" or so would work great. If 22" works for you, great. I would want a heavier barrel profile to ensure that the rifle is muzzle heavy, which I prefer for shooting and which seems to help tame recoil. JPK  Free 500grains | |||
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I would go for your original choice of a 22" No 5 barrel. One of my pet hates in dealing with dangerous game is a rifle with poor balance...and that means putting as much of the rifles weight between the hands as much as it does getting it to balance 3.5" in front of the trigger. Many American rifles come factory standard with heavy barrels- the rem 700 in .416 and just about all the Ruger's. - Yes, it does improve "shootability" on the range and particularly off a bench, but does nothing for you in the field. I am a great beliver in making a rifle fit and feel right. One that is nice to carry... You can always shoot reduced loads for range practice! (and oh boy is a .458 easy to download and make into a great deer or pig gun!) Also- I never shoot a rifle over 9,3 from the bench- That's what a tripod is for! | |||
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. DKing . ,,,One good thing about 2 piece bases is they give much more room for reloading ....... A 458 needs a 2nd recoil lug under the barrel ... My little Spruce King 458 has a # 5 Shilen and I get full velocity with it .......It is a perfect fighting rifle but too prefectly centrally balanced for real precise longer range shots , a little too light also ...... I,ve put more than 2,000 rounds of pretty much full house 458 thru it and it just keeps hammerin along ....... It has a cob on it so it isn,t bad on the stock , but its in a Ruger Canoe paddle stock and they are pretty industructable and light ......I shorteded the lop and epoxied a Pacmeyer Decelerator pad on and it works great .......  .....This pic is before I shortened the stock .. I have found it to be about the best summer and early fall rifle I could think up ...........I have killed sevral boat loads of game with it and hid behind it 40 or 50 times .......... Mine has a 19.5" barrel plus the cob =22" .If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined .... | |||
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The best balanced, IMO, and the most accurate 458 I have owned is my post 64 (yes, push feed!) M-70 with 22" barrel. With open sights I can gut a 3 shot cloverleaf group at 50 yards all day long. It handles well and I can get on target extremely fast. I have a load that will give me just over 2000fps with 500 gr. bullets. That is close enough for me to the 450 Nitro Express, which seemed to be a very good "killer" as cartridges go. I would like to find a gunsmith to convert it to CRF, but for now it is my favorite .458 that I own. | |||
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Congo- Owned and had a couple of those push feed M70's on the station. They are good rifles- more reliable than many "controlled feed" rifles that are not as well made. Would take it over a new Ruger any day. Also - if it works- don't try and fix it! Have ruined several good rifles by trying to "customise" them! | |||
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You can get McGowan to make a lighter (as in thinner) profile. Douglas just wouldn't budge from their 5A. Of course, you could get a smith to turn down anything. A M70 action is lighter than the CZ550 action I used, so your ahead of where I started. Mine has a 22" barrel and weighs in at 7.5 lbs. with a McMillan stock. If your barrel wall thickness at the muzzle is greater than 0.1" it will be difficult to make a lightweight rifle.  ------------------------------- Will Stewart / Once you've been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun. --------------------------------------- and, God Bless John Wayne. NRA Benefactor Member, GOA, N.A.G.R. _________________________ "Elephant and Elephant Guns" $99 shipped “Hunting Africa's Dangerous Game" $20 shipped. red.dirt.elephant@gmail.com _________________________ Hoping to wind up where elephant hunters go. | |||
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Nice rifle Will .. .If it can,t be grown , its gotta be mined .... | |||
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I shoot a lot offhand, so I like a heavy barrel that being the two extremes, a 20" tube or a 26" barrel works best for offhand shooting with the weight out front, at least for me..The 20" in a No. 5 or 6 is fine and its heavy out front.. The weight out front, makes a gun settle faster and anchors down for the shot with me, especially on running shots, or when one has to run a hundred yards then take a fast shot. Some folks like the weight between the hands, I don't, but that's what makes a horse race, dog fight or a chicken plucking...  Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Gunboot, How did you shorten the boatpaddle? There ins't a whole lot of meat there to remove to shorten the lenght of pull. Any pics? I want to do this to mine also. Do you have the pad# that you used? Which epoxy? Thanks. | |||
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I'm probably in the minority, but I like my rifle's balance point to be in the middle of the magazine, particularly with a heavier gun. It seems to make the rifle handle as if it's lighter than it is, and is easier for me to shoot off hand. As far as recovery time from the first shot is concerned I don't see an extra inch or so of barrel rise making a difference. It's got to feel right and natural in your hands, that's the bottom line... Chuck Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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fordnutter, The Shilen #5 should be about perfect from a contour standpoint. I concur wholeheartedly with your choices of barrel length and sights! The 2.5X Leupold is not my first choice for scope however, if you are planning on making shots in excess of say 150 yards (a 458 Winnie is perfectly capable of making 250 yd shots if you are). The Leupold mounts you describe work fine for me (albeit mine are blued) so I like your selection there as well. Regarding balance, I like the balance point for a stopping rifle to be at the trigger, makes for a very lively, quickly pointable rifle, from the shoulder, which is quite advantageous when the proverbial sh!t hits the fan. Balance is however a VERY personal preference kinda thing and can be adjusted so you may want to experiment a bit with it. I would not bother cross bolting a synthetic stock. I am not familiar with the Winchester synthetic stock, but your best option for a synthetic would be one which incorporates an aluminum bedding block. The aluminum block will distribute the recoil over a much larger surface area; therefore, dramatically reducing the stresses imparted to the bedding as opposed to the "standard" receiver recoil lug system. I hope you enjoy your new rifle once completed. | |||
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If you are in the minority then I'm with you in the same minority. I like the balance just forward of the trigger guard (at the magazine). I can hold the rifle in one hand with my thumb between receiver and scope for a good grip. On my CZ 550 the ring mounts are medium high and allow for that.  "Let every created thing give praise to the LORD, for he issued his command, and they came into being" - King David, Psalm 148 (NLT) | |||
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Guys, Was it necessary to have the rails or mag box worked on to make it feed correctly? I have a P-64 M70 in 375 that I'm considering changing to a Lott. I know that's a bit different but if the 300Win - 458 change is easier I might go that way with a different rifle. Brett | |||
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The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Big Bores Need help with 458 Mag rifle build
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