What are the pros and cons of having ejectors on a double rifle? Other than cost, why would you not have them? Can some of you guys with experience shooting doubles in the field share your opinions?

Stu C: I think the main reason beyond cost is a
noise factor. In the old days if you were in the
middle of an elephant herd, the click of the ejectors and the noise of flying brass could
signal your presence, limiting the number of
elephant you might shoot at a single opportunity.
Extractors are "faster" by a small margin.
These days I expect extractors win.

It looks cool to see those empties fly out.

But not cool enough for me to spend the extra thousand bucks.

You'll get the money back when you go to sell the rifle.

Stu C,
Have used both in the field and am probably a fraction faster with ejectors, however
as I have practiced extensively with my extractor guns in working out the best and fastest sequence
for dumping cartridges in and out of the chambers, I am just as comfortable with extractors.
Mickey1 is correct in that it is probably be easier to sell the gun when you want to sell it, however
for the extra money they seem to bring I don't care either way.
You also tend to loose alot more brass with ejectors !!!
500 Nitro

In addition to the cost, noise, and lost brass ejectors give another opportunity for Murphy to get involved in the hunt. Ejectors can and do fail.

With extractors, dropping the butt allows the brass to fall out, making reloading time a non issue.

Jim

For shotguns, I have both ejectors and extractors. I prefer extractors. Ejectors have me chasing empties to be sure I clean up after myself, and the slight reduction in reloading time is not meaningful.

For double rifles, I only have one and it's an ejector. Didn't know how I would like that, and on the range it's kind of a disadvantage. But in the field, I've reloaded only twice on dangerous game, but have been grateful for the slight advantage.

Not a big factor, but if I ever buy another double rifle for dangerous game, it will have ejectors.

When I bought my first double rifle many years ago, I couldn't imagine why any sane person would even consider one without ejectors. I actually found it amusing, and frustrating, that the Brits built many otherwise fine double rifles without them.

I've owned and used both ejector and non-ejector double rifles ever since. The heavy that I have now is a non-ejector. My medium bore double, the rifle that I've used more than any other for the last 12 years, is an ejector and I wish it wasn't (they've always worked perfectly, whatever that's good for). They're worse than nursing equipment on a tomcat. In addition to serving no useful purpose whatever, they're irritating. I'm shopping for another double now, a .350 No. 2 this time and I probably won't turn down a nice rifle just because it has ejectors....but then again, I might!

Not that it makes the slightest bit of difference in the real world, but ejector rifles are actually a nanosecond slower to reload than non-ejectors. There are no free lunches and the ejectors springs must be cocked and that makes the rifle harder to close.
--------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

[ 04-01-2003, 11:13: Message edited by: 400 Nitro Express ]

400 nitro express: You must have perfected some sort of "wrist-flip" to get those shells out of
an extractor rifle. Could you please describe
just how you do it for us extractor owners who
may not be so adept? Many thanks

Actually, the "wrist flip" 400 Nitro Express and I use is extremely simple.

Upon firing, break the action open and if you are shooting right handed let go of the butt stock with your right hand. The rifle still held by the forearm with your left hand, swings dropping the chambers enough to let the empties slide out.
While this is happening your right hand has retrieved two fresh rounds from you cartridge belt.

The pendulum effect returns the butt stock to you. I simply press the butt stock against me with my elbow drop the two round in and close the action, and back into battery.

A simple solution to non ejector rifles. The low pressure Nitro Express rounds are perfect for this. Give it a try, it is easy to master.

Rusty
We band of brothers!

With ejectors:

Upon firing flip opening lever with your right thumb. keep tight grip on stock with right hand, let go of forearm with left hand and allow weight of barrels to open action and eject cartridges. Keeping the but against your shoulder drop two rounds from fingers (you have two rounds between fingers of left hand) of left hand into action and close action. Ready to fire and butt never leaves your shoulder nor does your right hand leave trigger area. You never need to take your eye off of target or fumble for cartridges on your belt with trigger hand. With a properly fitted stock, the rifle comes back into firing position automatically and you can fire at the target that you never looked away from. If your paractised you can fire 4 shots in less than 4 seconds. (two of them aimed)

If I were buying a double that I thought I would be selling in the future, I would buy it with ejectors. Here's the hitch though if I intended useing it for dangerous game I would remove the ejector hammer springs, effectively turning it into an extractor rifle. When the re-sale time comes around replace them. The prmium you will realize on the resale will be more than the cost of buying the new rifle with them to start with. They average $1K when bought new, but the used rifle will sell for $1.5K more than an extractor rifle when you sell.

Everyone has his drill for reloading a double quickly, and all of the ones described above work for those who use them. My method is a little different than the ones described above.

First let me say I prefer extractors! I start with the loaded rifle, fire the two shots, and at the top of recoil, I simply break the rifle, letting the empties slide out of the chambers, as the rifle falls back down I replace the open chambers with two rounds that are between the first, and second, and the second and third fingers of my left hand. These rounds are hanging, bullets down, from my left hand. With this method the right hand, or trigger hand, never leaves the wrist of the rifle, and only the left hand is ever off the rifle. As the rifle is closed it is already on its way back up to slam the target again. In the event another loading is needed, I have on the left side of my ammo belt, al little gagit made by Trader Rick, called a "DOUBLE DUTY". It holds two rounds bullets down,but with the leather latch, fliped open, drops upside down, dropping two rounds into your left hand rims down, so the bullets are in place to drop into the chambers. This is much faster, for me, than trying to pull rounds from an ammo belt loop, or stock ammo carrier!

I know all this is a clear as mud, but computers being what they are, it is a little hard to show you what I mean!

All the descriptions aside, I'd buy "WITH EJECTORS" then disconnect them to use, replace the springs when I sell! One other reason for extractors is that brass is expensive, and ejectors toss that $8, to $10 dollar per round brass into the thorn bushes!

[ 04-01-2003, 21:16: Message edited by: MacD37 ]

Thanks for all the great replies. Actually the rifle I'm looking at is an old non-ejector model, so I don't have much choice if I go ahead with this purchase. I wanted to know if being non-ejector was going to be a functional handicap.
I think I've got my answer

Stu

Okay, what are you looking at? We have plenty advise about that too.

Mickey1,

It's the George Gibbs 470. You posted a reply on my previous thread. I'm going to have a good look at it this weekend to try to decide.

I've spent the past week tracking down all the information I can get and speaking to a few people who know doubles. I now have a better idea what to look for this weekend.

Stu

Congratulations, I hope it works out well for you.

What can I say about doubles, it comes only from shotguns but if I want to "eject" rounds from extractor rifle, it is easy by fast rifle move back and stop and shells will fly of . . . easy and fast

ejectors....
i am too clumbsy to flip and twist....
(making loud anglosaxon noises at droping my 10k rifle at the feet of a duggaboy)
jeffe

If you want a double just to take to the range and chase empties, who cares wheteher it has ejectors or extractors.

Extractor doubles are cheaper and that is why there are so many around.

Extractors are infinitely slower when hunting and when having to reload fast. You can SAY this isn't true, but it is.

Will

It seems to me Will has to be correct that ejector doubles are faster to remove the shells. In both you open the rifle - the ejector rifle throws the empty shells out while on the extractor rifle you need another movement to dump the shells. That other movement takes time however fast you are.

The problem with ejectors is they can fail. I have had two field failures with ejectors on quality double shotguns. I am sure the same can happen on a double rifle.

In my limited hunting experience ( 3 animals)with a double 470 with extractors I can tell you loading is very quick with the dump and load method. I never felt a need for more speed.

Just my 2 cents.

BigB

Mac,

The video sounds great. It'll have to have a section with plenty of pics of pretty doubles though . Sort of like the ACGG custom rifles video.

All these reasons have been floating around since the Lord made dirt, and they had substance in the old Ivory hunting days, but not anymore...

I like the extractors simply because the gun will break open with the weight of the barrels, without any effort what so ever on my part...My gun is a ejector gun, but the ejectors are in my shop not in my gun....