My friend has a CZ Safari Classics .375 H&H that he ordered from the CZ's Kansas City custom shop about four years ago. With two different sets of QD rings (Talley and Warne), the scope can't be bore sighted. The bore lines up (and the shots fall) too low on the target, even with the elevation maxed out. There are no problems with the scope, a Swarovski Z6 1.7-10X, so we're assuming the problem lies in the machining of the grooves in the receiver. It's also worth noting that the cross bolts in the stock appear to have been installed as an afterthought, with discoloration and roughness in the finish around them. Also, there's a small gap between the forend cap and the stock on one side. I know the standard CZ American is a little rough, but these problems are surprising on what's supposed to be their high end gun. Does anyone here have any experience with the above-described problem with the scope and integral base? Or are we missing something? Thanks.

He's had it 4 years and these problems are just popping up now?

Also check the barrel is screwed in straight
- as opposed to the "machining of the grooves in the receiver" which of course could also be the problem.

Both are reasonably easy to check at home without having to fire a shot.

Yes. I have a 458 with exact same problem. It shoots 24 inches low at 25 yards, with scope at the center of adjustment. I cannot zero with std rings. I have read here on AR, that if you send the gun to St Louis for service; they will bend the barrel up until it can be zeroed in with your scope!! (if you send a scope, other wise they just guess)

Yes! I kid you not!

There are about 5 or 6 other CZ550 magnums reported with the same problem here on AR. Search carefully for the sad tale. Many been 'fixed' (bent). One AR member a actually got TWO of these lemons. Shooting to low to zero!

OK!! And we have guys asking about the wisdom of buying used CZ to save a 100 bucks over new guns?

My solution, pending a 458Lott offering by Winchester was to mount a weaver rail and use the adjustable Burris rings. Those rings I just read today have a bad reputation for failure under recoil! I cannot win for loosing. I guess less than 100 rounds has been fine for me.

This is the first report of a gun from St Louis with this problem.

My best guess at the problem is the actions are held out of line in a jig and the threads for the barrel are mis aligned. THis being done at the Check republik factory. Always the same - the gun shoots low.

AND HERE IS THE KICKER, NEVER ANY REPORT OF CORRECTIVE ACTION BACK AT THE FACTORY. SO ANY NEW GUN IS STILL A CRAP SHOOT. NO SERIAL NUMBER ABOVE WHICH A USED GUN IS NOT SUSPECT.

quote:

Also check the barrel is screwed in straight .... reasonably easy to check at home without having to fire a shot.

How exactly would I do that?

Chief, he lives overseas and only comes back to the US every few years. We tried it with the Talley rings when he first got it and figured the problem was with the rings. He's now back in town for the first time since then, and we tried it last weekend with the Warne rings. It sounds like it needs to go back to the CZ boys for correction.

Sounds familiar.
Look down about 15 posts and read about my experience with CZ.

Phil

I had the same problem with a 458WM and a 458 Lott. I sent both back and they fixed the problem. The customer service rep knew right away what the problem was. He said the barrel had been "pulled down" and they would put it in a barrel straightener. What ever they did it worked. I have shot both hot to see if the group wandered or strung out when hot but no problem. The groups were consistent hot or cold.

I just purchased a 404 Safari Classic and found with Warne QD Rings I had about 4 minutes elevation left on my Leupold 2-7 VX-2 when the scope was zeroed at 100 yds.

I definitely think CZ should do some reengineering but that said, I love the rifle!

Some of the receivers were threaded crooked. They wound up bending the barrels to make up for it. You need to somehow get it back to CZ.

quote:

quote:
Also check the barrel is screwed in straight .... reasonably easy to check at home without having to fire a shot.



How exactly would I do that?

How is this checked? I am asking because, perhaps this could be check right at the gun shop prior to taking ownership of a gun. That would prevent barrel bending, wasted $100 box ammo, shipping charges, shipping damage and much headache.

EASY! Please tell me how.

I just (today) switched my CZ550 in Lott from a Nikon (I prior tried two Nikons) to a Leupold 1-4x. I was able to get my 458 Lott zeroed with that Leupold. I used over 3/4 more or less of the elevation.

I no longer need the Weaver type base and Burris adjustable rings. That was both odd looking and resulted in a higher scope mounting.

I guess I am now in the same camp as ammoloader on this one. I'd rather play games with the scope or mounts than have the barrel bent.

Never had such a problem with mine in .458 WM.

I bought Warne QD rings and mounted a fixed 4X Burris. It shoots consistently where pointed. Just to check things from last year's bear load, recently I fired off two 350 TSX's at 2750 fps into just less than 1/2" at 100. The holes were touching at dead center. Of the seven loads I might use in this rifle, the average MOA is 1.25" with four at MOA or better.

I did have the action glass bedded, though.
The rifle is pleasant to shoot and I like it very much.

Bob

www.bigbores.ca

My CZ 458 Lott Is as smove as it gets. It weghts 10 LBS. I could stand and shoot it all day long. It has 74 Ft LBS of recoil. but it doesn't hurt me at all. The stock is laminated.
it comes that way. I didn't order it that way.
It is a sweet rifle. It holds 8 OR 10 rounds.

Will,

Any idea how many of these crooked threaded receivers receivers made it out the door?

Just wondering as I am in the market for one....

Regards,
Dave

quote:

My CZ 458 Lott Is as smove as it gets. It weghts 10 LBS. I could stand and shoot it all day long. It has 74 Ft LBS of recoil. but it doesn't hurt me at all. The stock is laminated.
it comes that way. I didn't order it that way.
It is a sweet rifle. It holds 8 OR 10 rounds.

I wonder, have you shot it with the iron sights yet? How close is the 100yd one to poi?

Rich

Id also like to know which cz 458 lott holds 8-10 rounds

quote:

Originally posted by DavidC:
Will,

Any idea how many of these crooked threaded receivers receivers made it out the door?

Just wondering as I am in the market for one....

Regards,
Dave

I think it was just a batch at one time a couple years or more ago. I wouldn't think that is of current concern.

quote:

Id also like to know which cz 458 lott holds 8-10 rounds

That would be a mis-statement the number is 5 or 6.

I am still wait to hear this "EASY" way to check for the mis-aligned action barrel threads from home or at a gun shop prior to purchase? More idle keystrokes or was that serious?

Fourbore, I agree with you...mine only holds 5, but it shoots pretty much where I aim it.

quote:

Originally posted by Will:
Some of the receivers were threaded crooked. They wound up bending the barrels to make up for it. You need to somehow get it back to CZ.

Nothing says quality like a bending bar and a barrel. F... CZ!

A real eye opener sometimes is to take the barreled action out of the stock & bore sight it. Are the crosshairs on the same spot on the grid in AND out of the stock??????

Bending barrels to correct crooked threads/poor machining is not an option.

CZ should be eating it on this one not the customer. Very poor business practices....

Nothing to unusual though....I have seen terrible quality from Winchester, Remington and Ruger as well.
They all make dogs from time to time....

I would be wanting a new receiver period.

Best,
Dave

quote:

Originally posted by DavidC:
Bending barrels to correct crooked threads/poor machining is not an option.

CZ should be eating it on this one not the customer. Very poor business practices....

Nothing to unusual though....I have seen terrible quality from Winchester, Remington and Ruger as well.
They all make dogs from time to time....

The fact that CZ has gotten the penetration it has into the American market (and the CZ rifles have had various issues, this being the latest) says more about Winchester, Remington, Kimber, and Ruger, than it does about CZ.


.

Like throwing a bone into a pack of hungry mongrels.

quote:

Like throwing a bone into a pack of hungry mongrels.

I assume what this means is Winchester/Rem/Ruger pretty much have the heads up the arse's and buyer be damned. While CZ will offer what ever the buyer wants. Not playing cartridge games. Who else will ever offer a semi custom 505 gibbs?

I cannot agree completely but I believe some of that.

Case in point: Winchester refuse to offer 458Lott (today under new management and still!), Winchester drops the M92, 86 & 85 all big sellers by Browning prior to the buyout. Today, those Japaneses guns have Winchester name on them.

Much of it is just plan cost driven and buyer ignorance. I was enticed in my the $1000 price for a Lott. And man, folks that own these thing were all playing cover up all over the internet. When I registered on three sites. Who was I? What was my secret agenda? Thats what ticks me off the most. Be it Remington Triggers or CZ defects, lets tell the truth, buyer be warned and builder put on notice to fix the crap.

I like CZ products and we should keep their feet to the fire on the quality issue.

Sheeesh. For such a minor glitch I should have kept quiet.

Then I guess, I assumed your meaning wrong. Unfortunatley that often happens on the internet or email. A few keystrokes and later the meaning is misinterpreted.

A Beautyful day! Sunshine and blue sky - but I have to go to the city for an afternoon of shopping and eating. SWMBO strikes again.

Apparently CZ admitted the problem, did make good on those crooked-threaded-action/bent-barrel rejects.
They did not offer barrel bending to fix all of that batch.
I know CZ USA of KC, KS sold two to a local dealer here as parts guns, or gunsmith specials, so stated from CZ, not for retail sale, rejects.
That was about 5 years ago.
I bought a couple of complete rifles, a .416 Rigby and a .458 WinMag, for $350 each. They were the old Euro Lux Hogback, with nice wood, within which lies a re-shapability to a British sporter-style stock.

I doubt the problem has recurred with the CZ Americans.

I sold one to a smith and kept one for "parts" as parts is parts.

quote:

for $350 each

If only they were still that price ...

quote:

Like throwing a bone into a pack of hungry mongrels.

Not the first time my pedigree has been called into question!


Firstly, I love the cz rifles I own and will buy more of them. I have also had the chance to shoot some of their pistols owned by friends and they were pretty damn neat as well.

What I object to is not that they had a problem (receiver threads...) but rather how they tried to "fix" the problem.... Bending barrels???..... No Way!

They can & should do better.

As a couple of the posters above mentioned....the big 3 are no better and we should hold their feet to the fire and get a solid product.

Best,
Dave

quote:

Apparently CZ admitted the problem, did make good on those crooked-threaded-action/bent-barrel rejects.
They did not offer barrel bending to fix all of that batch.
[...deleted...]
That was about 5 years ago.
[... deleted...]
I doubt the problem has recurred with the CZ Americans.

I got my Lott in 2009 about 2 years ago. So; apparently this has been going on for 5 years now?

To best of my knowledge, No one on AR has got a new gun or new action. Only bent barrels. And, no one has got a technical description of the problem. Ie. is the problem in the barrel or the action?

Maybe more than one issue over the years? CZ is not a gun to just buy and put in the safe - for sure.

Have a gunsmith shim up the rear mount and you should be fine

After reading more AR posts closely, I tried swapping out my Nikon with a Leupold and I was able to get it zero'ed. Before that I had used Burris adjustable Z rings on a special weaver base. All in all, quite a lot of time and money, but what the heck, better than bending the barrel in my opinion.

Maybe I missed it, but my American Lott came with a pretty nice factory target from when it was a little .458 Win Mag. Did they stop this practice? I gotta check my bore, maybe it's oblong or off center?

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
I wonder, have you shot it with the iron sights yet? How close is the 100yd one to poi?

Rich

I have a .416. It'd shoot 18 inches high with the express sights. But it grouped well.

I lost the express sights and now use a New England Custom Guns aperture sight. I had to use a dremel tool to open up the aperture. Also, at first it still shot high and it lacked the adjustment range to lower the sight to where I needed it to be. So I ground a little off the bottom of the outside of the aperture so I could crank it down to where it hits where I point it.

I don't know if they still offer it. It's not on their website.

I have a scope for it, but I don't know how it shoots with a scope as I've only ever used irons.

Mine shoots pretty well. Here's a 3 shot group taken at 100 yards off sandbags as it came from the CZ Custom Shop when it was a little 375 H&H shooting 350g Woodleighs at 2430 fps...




Here it is all grown up (I had the CZ Custom shop rebarrel it to 500 Jeffery) shooting 570g TSX's at 2410 fps. This is a 3 shot group taken at 50 yards from a lead sled.

a shim?

quote:

Originally posted by lavaca:
a shim?

????