I am in the process of starting a new rifle and the calibers mentioned above are the ones I want to pursue right now. I am not sure this gun will be factory produced, or custom, but all components on a custom gun would be superior products. What is everyone's thoughts on these calibers. Be very critical on your evaluation of each in the aspect of performance in both production guns vs. custom guns, and caliber selection. Feel free to add any other calibers you think would make a big game sledge hammer. When I get some feedback, I will begin making a list of components if the majority of replies point toward a custom rifle. Thanks for your help.

416 Weatherby would be interesting, but brass/dies may be hard to get.

Everyone has a 416 Rigby/416 Remington.

408 Cheytac? Why?

It depends on what you will use the rifle for.

I'm partial to the Remmie as it is a more compact cartridge than any of the others and can make for a more compact rifle. Plus, more in the mag.......

I'm partial to the 416 Ribgy for Nostalgic reasons

I also like the 416 Rigby. I was able to buy a new CZ 550 barrelled action and then a MacMillan stock. For me it was a low cost way to go for a very versatile rifle.



Here's the same rifle with the NECG peep sight.

quote:

Originally posted by Christopher:
I am in the process of starting a new rifle and the calibers mentioned above are the ones I want to pursue right now. I am not sure this gun will be factory produced, or custom, but all components on a custom gun would be superior products. What is everyone's thoughts on these calibers. Be very critical on your evaluation of each in the aspect of performance in both production guns vs. custom guns, and caliber selection. Feel free to add any other calibers you think would make a big game sledge hammer. When I get some feedback, I will begin making a list of components if the majority of replies point toward a custom rifle. Thanks for your help.

Christopher,

I can only comment on the .416 Weatherby since I have one and have used it extensively. Despite what others might say, I like the stock design (my first was a Euromark and now have a Custom Safari), it fits me well and distributes recoil.
As far as the cartridge, plenty of power, reasonable factory bullet selection and good reach. I took an elk in CO a few years back at 384 paces and the 400gr SAF broke the left shoulder, shedded the heart and lungs and would up under the skin of the right hip destroying everything in it's path. The recovered bullet is my avatar here.
There are plenty of Weatherby haters here, so you will read a load of crap based on heresay. You will also read a load of crap based upon a couple of people's "extensive African experience" all of which I absolutely and totally disregard as pre-existing investigator bias (something I see daily in my everyday life). Others with similarly extensive African experience will argue to the contrary.
Whitworth makes a great argument for the 416 Remington (magazine capacity) and jwp475 for the Rigby.
If I had to make my (similar) choice all over again, I would again go with the Weatherby.
Good luck in your decision-making.
Paul

Why not wait and get a 416 Ruger?

quote:

Originally posted by AzGuy:
Why not wait and get a 416 Ruger?

Why?

I have both a Rigby and a Weatherby. They are both fine cartridges.

The Weatherby is one of the flatest shooting large caliber rifles out there. With a proper stock and fit, it is surprisingly easy on the shoulder. I say that comparing it to the 340 Weatherby, which for some reason does not like me personally.

The Weatherby I have is the Dangerous Game version - one of the first ones they made, and at the time those were all coming out of their Custom shop. Just a well designed platform, from the composite stock to the hooded front sight.

The Rigby is on a Mauser M98 Magnum. Because of the stock design and balance, this is a great shooter.

I prefer the Rigby, but that is only because that rifle "feels" better for me. Since I reload, I can keep the ammo costs way down as well.

quote:

Originally posted by Jim Manion:
I have both a Rigby and a Weatherby. They are both fine cartridges.

The Weatherby is one of the flatest shooting large caliber rifles out there. With a proper stock and fit, it is surprisingly easy on the shoulder. I say that comparing it to the 340 Weatherby, which for some reason does not like me personally.

The Weatherby I have is the Dangerous Game version - one of the first ones they made, and at the time those were all coming out of their Custom shop. Just a well designed platform, from the composite stock to the hooded front sight.

The Rigby is on a Mauser M98 Magnum. Because of the stock design and balance, this is a great shooter.

I prefer the Rigby, but that is only because that rifle "feels" better for me. Since I reload, I can keep the ammo costs way down as well.

Got a picture of the Rigby?

Love my .416 Rem. Goin' deer hunting with it tomorrow -- hell, it's sighted in and has handled everything from Cape buffalo to impala with one shot kills -- it'll kill a deer, ya' think?

quote:

Originally posted by lavaca:
Love my .416 Rem. Goin' deer hunting with it tomorrow -- hell, it's sighted in and has handled everything from Cape buffalo to impala with one shot kills -- it'll kill a deer, ya' think?

Wouldn't take a chance on deer - very sly and dangeous critters. You would need at least a 12GFH or 4-bore

I appreciate all of the responses. Would anyone recommend a good stock to help distribute the recoil. I am shooting a longrange style mcmillan on a 338 caliber and love it.

Christopher,
Even if it is a 22RF, you should have the stock fitted to you. Take whatever stock you have to someone who knows what their doing and have it fitted. Might involve another stock but well worth it.

The .416 Rem. can be built into the most 'trim' rifle of the four cartridges you mention.

Since we carry our rifles more than we shoot them, that could be a significant factor in some people's minds.

George

quote:

Originally posted by GeorgeS:
The .416 Rem. can be built into the most 'trim' rifle of the four cartridges you mention.
George

Your right George
The 416 Rooger should be more "trim" if that's what one is looking for.

Lot's of unanswered questions so it's hard for me to give you a definitive answer to your question. Here are a couple questions of mine.

1. What are you going to hunt with it?
2. What kind of weight do you want the finished rifle to weigh?
3. Are you right handed? If so, then there are some fine factory rifles to choose from and save your money with this economy.

If you want a 416, and your right handed then the Ruger RSM @ approx. 10.5 lbs is a great heavy duty rifle. Next on my list would be the CZ in 416 Rigby with some semi-custom work done on it becomes a great rifle. If you are weight concous then the 416Rem on a lighter frame rifle, or the new 416 Ruger (2009) would be great choices. If you want a low chamber pressure nostalgic caliber hands down the 416 Rigby is your caliber. If you are component cost sensitive then the 416 Remington is going to be a good choice along with the 416 Ruger which will have ammo from Hornady.

Dirk

I would select the .416 Rigby. I like the case design and no belt. More case capacity than the Remington if needed. The Weatherby is too much of a good thing for me. I like the 410 gr @ 2400.

Dirklawyer, This gun will be more of a shooting gun, as I will not be taking many trips to africa to hunt dangerous game or taking many large game here in the states, as I already have rifle to do that with. Weight is not really an issue with me. I am right handed; with that being said I have had some people make comments against the CZ 416 rigby. I am primarily looking for a larger bore to become proficient shooting with for that once in a lifetrip that will arise. Just like my handguns, I am extremely proficient shooting them because I shoot thousands of rounds a months. I enjoy shooting more than anything and I especially like shooting large calibers, well large with respect to what I own. 338EDGE, 10ga, and 500 S&W. I know and understand that these really do not compare, which is the reason that I want to step up to the next league. I have shot a 416 rigby and loved it, but when I go out to buy a gun, I want to do all possible research on it to make sure I am getting the one that I am going to be 100% satisfied with, in addition to on that will last forever and possible keep me alive if the situation arises. Such a situation as an elephant or buff charging, I would feel better prepared with 416 than a 375 with my limited amount of experience. Again, I appreciate your comments, fr I am sure they all will lead me to buying/building that perfect rifle for me.

My vote is for the 416 Rem. I have owned 3 rifles chambered for it. I like the fact that you can easily rebarrel just about any magnum rifle, it holds 1-2 rounds more, the rifles usually weigh less, much cheaper to shoot, and can push a 400 grainer 2400 fps. The other two are great rounds, but IMO just too much of a good thing. I would go with a 416 Taylor next. Lou

Since we are on the top of the most used 416s, are there any other calibers you would recommend that are over the 375 mark, save the 378 wby?

@all

Since two Years I'm owner of a .416 Remington Magnum and I can tell You, it's a wonderful rifle. Here a picture of the Rifle:
Rifle .416 Remington Magnum

Last Year I could take two European Red Stags with this combo. The Cartridge I'm using looks like this:
Cartridge .416 Remington Magnum loaded with Gian-Marchet Bullets

The Bullet is 270 grains and the Load is very accurate. The velocity is 913 m/s which is approx. 2995 fps!
Here the table:



Good shooting and good hunting
Collani

I'd go with the .416 Remington. Factory Ammo is cheaper. Brass is cheaper. Remington Factory Ammo has the 400 gr. Swift A Frame Bullet. Recoil is a little less than the rigby and Weatherby. The down-range performance is close to the others. A properly placed bullet from the Rem will kill a critter just as dead as the others.

Christopher,
With your last response, I believe the Ruger RSM would be a great choice, although you sound like your a bigbore lover. If that's the case I think you might tire of the 416 caliber, if you ever do just rebore and rechamber the Ruger (which is heavy enough) to a 450 Rigby or just buy another RSM in 458 Lott. You also mentioned wanting something to stop a charge, now we're talking 45 caliber and up as your best option. Whatever you choose you cannot make a mistake with the calibers you have mentioned, they'll get the job done.

The first 2 generations of Ruger RSM in .416 Rigby had heavy barrels (24" and .820" muzzle diameter) and weighed 10.75 pounds dry.

The latest "Third Generation" Ruger RSM in .416 Rigby has a 23" barrel with .750" muzzle diameter.
9.5 pounds is the dry weight of this rifle and it is about perfect.

Winchester M70 Classic rifles in .416 Remington weigh 9.1 pounds, I have 2 of them and have weighed them on precision, commercial scales.

RSM .416 Rigby vs. M70 Classic .416 Remington
factory rifles:

Both have same magazine capacity (3 in box + 1 in chamber).

The Ruger is 0.4 pound heavier.

The Winchester with shorter action and longer barrel, is longer overall by about 3/4", assuming same LOP.

Sounds like a wash to me.
Whichever one extends or flexes your pinky finger to satisfaction is the correct choice.

I have both a .416 Rigby and a .416 Rem. Mag.

My Rigby is an AHR custom rifle built on the CZ 550 Magnum action.

My Remington is a custom shop Model 70 Winchester classic.

I like the Winchester better. It's lighter and handier, and just as powerful. The Rigby is too much case for caliber, IMHO.

Still, I do like the Rigby and have no plans to sell it. As has been said above, the Rigby has nostalgia on its side, that's for sure. I will hunt with it again, God willing.

But the Remington is more practical, I think.

For reasons noted below, I see no need and so have no use for the Weatherby or Chey-Tac rounds.

I believe that, in any given caliber of dangerous game rifle, once one has achieved a muzzle velocity with a high sectional density bullet of around 2,400-2,500 fps, performance has been optimized.

To get appreciably more power, I believe that one needs to increase bullet diameter, i.e., go to a larger caliber round, rather than increase the velocity in the lesser caliber round.

I have both the Rigby (Ruger # 1) and the Remington (Winchester Model 70 Classic Safari), and really like both. I thought they were virtually the same and took the Remmy to the Selous and it served me extremely well on the Buff. I continued to think they were the same until I played with the Rigby enough to shoot a 370 grain North Fork 2700 fps, then suddenly I realized what all the fuss was about, WOW that sucker can be a hottie. They both do their heavy rifle job, but the Rigby can be something else, with the proper loading. I kinda have in my mind taking it to Colorado on my annual Elk hunt and seeing what it will do. Good shooting.

I had Bill Wisemann in College Station, Tx build a .416 Rem., synthetic stock, working rifle for me. It's ugly, it's "a bit clunky" according to an excellent PH who saw everything shot with it die with one shot, almost everything, including a buff within sight. But, if I had to pick a rifle to shoot anything within 200 yards, this is it. It will put bullets in the same hole at 100 (from the bench of course) -- you can switch from solids to softs, Swift A-frames to Noslers -- it doesn't care. Shot two does and a turkey last weekend with it. No tracking necessary. No damage if you place your shot right.

I appreciate the wealth of knowledge passes on to me. Since I do not currently own a "big bore" I am not as up to speed on manufactured rifles v. custom rifles. I have shot the CZ in 416 Rigby, but the owner did have some trouble with the rifle and had to send it back, but the problem was quickly resolved. Is there a hands-down better option to go with when taking into account craftsmanship? I know and have held some of the big name guns such as H&H, Merkel, and Weatherby but right now I do not really have 10 grand to drop on either of the first two. That leaves Weatherby, what are some thoughts on their craftsmanship and quality of product. I do own an Accumark and have been well pleased with it, but that rifle was bought almost 10 years ago; with this economy, I am sure a lot has changed in the manufacturing end of things. Thanks again for all of the invaluable information you all have provided.

I've owned and carried two .416Rem on multiple safaris One was a Remington from their Custom Shop and was an absolutely sweet rifle with a Blue finish and a gray McMillan syntetic. When I found my self with 6 big bore rifles, I sold it and kept the other .416Rem. It was a Winchester Special Build customized to my specs. SS with a black synthetic McMillan stock and is also a sweetheart.

The Remington factory ammo is loaded with the Swift A-Frame, my preferred bullet. Remington has periodically also loaded solids in commercial ammo. I still have a number of boxes of that in my bunker.

These rifles have accounted for 5 Cape Buffalo, 1 Hippo, a Cape Eland and assorted other species.

Edit: Not an issue in this thread, but FWIW, the African hunters in my circle have a pretty unified opinion that a .416Rem is a far better choice for Africa than a .375 and will out perform the .375 in all situations. Some rather famous African writers will agree to this, but not in a publication.