I think the endorsements by Phil, Saeed, & Will, all with more collective experience than most of us combined, pretty well sums ut up. jorge

they are so popular because they are cheap. I have overwhelmingly seen more Leupolds fail than any other brand, but then there are a lot of Leupolds out there too. I have had several problems with them myself.

Their customer service system totally sucks. They border on complete incopetence. They will usually get it right in the end, but I have had to pay for up to 3 trips per scope to their "service" department, and who knows how long before they go back? Plus you are without the use of the scope while they screw around with it. This is with scopes from 3 different decades, so it was not a "bad batch."

Talk to serious rifle competitors and they will tell you how many Leupolds have given up the ghost at very bad moments in a match.

But I have more Leupolds than anything else, adn will buy more. Why-because they are cheap (not just inexpensive-cheap!). But for any hunt that matters to me, especially when I am hunting out of the country, I use only Schmidt & Bender or Swarovski scopes. For local hunts I often use a rifle with a Leupold on it.

In their price range, there really isn't anything better than Leupold that I have seen. I do think Burris Signature scopes are tougher, but they have their own set of issues. Leupold may be the best in its price range, but they hardly deserve the praise and out right lies about how great they are heaped on them.

A lot of it is more BS that gets printed in gun magazines every month and readers just repeat whet they read. It is a lot like what happens here on this site-some one will ask how to do something and people who have never done it just regurgitate whet they have read.

Being a po' boy, I currently only have five. Great performance from arctic to tropical conditions, sturdy, they hold zero after substantial abuse, excellent optical clarity on all models, and great customer service on the two I've had to send to Oregon after incidents.

I've used S&B, Zeiss, and Swaro, also, but I prefer Leupold for all the reasons outlined by others.

"In their price range, there really isn't anything better than Leupold that I have seen."

I Think that the above quote sums it up. For many of us, a $1k+ scope is out our reach. Are these scopes better, most likely, but my sub $200 used Leopolds fit my needs 95% of the time.

It's assembled in US of foreign components?

KStephens,
That answer would be subjective based on personal experience. Nikon puts out a better product based on clarity and brightness; although limited in selection, for the similar price range.

One Bushnell product, the Trophy 3-9, is an exceptional product & value for the cheap $99 MSRP. Initially, I think that it was made in Japan, and currently made in Korea. The quick focus eyepiece is copied from more expensive European optics. Our group has used it effectively in several cull shoots mounted on 308 & 30-06 rifles. Each rifle goes thru 800- 1100 rounds in five days. The rifles get dropped, slammed against the steel truck headboard, and just abused. Not one of the 7 Trophies used lost it's zero or failed. We all had extra Leupolds as backup. The Bushnell Trophies were considered "disposable" should failure occur.

On the otherhand, I have seen Swarovski's fail completely during the same cull shooting conditions. The outfitter stated that it was common with Swarovskis.

The cheap Trophy is continuously used at least 11 cull hunting days each year for the last 12 years, during which 150 to 200 rds. of 308 Win. is expended. It has yet to change the zero. I guess that it is a quirk of design and manufacture.

Geoff

1. While running a public shooting range I found Leupolds almost never caused problems. Other scopes American, Asian, and European broke, or caused zeroing problems on a regular basis.
2. When a Leupold does need service their warranty and repair service is unequaled; especially in the shooting and hunting world.

GAHunter,

I think for many years they were ahead of the pack & deservedly so but now I think the pack are catching up. eg. the Bushnell Elites, Grand Slams,Nikons, Zeiss etc.So the following they have they earnt.

In the same price bracket I do now prefer the Zeiss Conquest but Leupold's are still pretty darn good.

Just came back from a sighting in session where I was remounting my Vari X III 2.5 - 8 onto lower Optilock mounts on my Sako .308. The infuriating thing about Leupolds is their turret adjustments. Say you want to go 1 inch to the right at 100. You do the 4 clicks & "hope" it goes an inch to the right. Sometimes it does not move at all, sometimes it moves diagonally, sometimes it moves 3 inches? I usually tap the gun butt on the bench to settle the turrets but to no avail. So to be safe you need to fire a number of shots to be sure it has settled. Its an inconvenience & expensive when Partitions are nearly $1 pop here in Australia. ($45 a box makes you cry doesn't it! But Woodleighs are 1/2 price to what you pay in US )

With the Euro scopes like a Swaro PH (never used the A line scopes) or a Schmidt & Bender you can take the turret adjustments to the bank, with no settling shot required. However, once sighted in I have not had any problems in holding zero with any Leupold scope from Vari X II to Vari XIII.

I wish they'd come up with a better system for the turret adjustments & maybe an extra .25 inch on the tube length on the 2.5 - 8.

Here they used to have a popular fly spray ad and it used to go:

" When you are on a good thing stick to it!"

That's why Leupold are popular.

Regards
JohnT

quote:

Their customer service system totally sucks.

With this I have to totally and strongly disagree. I bought a 1.5-5X off of ebay to put on my 375. When it arrived I could tell it was probably 20 years old and had been "used" extensively. Nevertheless, I mounted it and sure enough,it went south after about 5 shots. Sent it back to the factory and three weeks later received a brand new scope. I can't see how they could have treated me any better. BTW All of my other rifles wear Leupold (some pushing 30 years) except my 375 and that has a Leupold as back-up.

I top my rifles with Leupolds. The LPS on my .375 cost nearly as much as the mod. 70 it sits on. Also, several of my Leupolds sport 30 mm tubes and european reticles. great scopes. I particularly like the compacts. Never had one fail. (And, yes- I have had other scopes fail.)

GA Hunter, I guess should have said Reliability and Durability - as well as Confidence and Customer Satisfaction.

quote:

Originally posted by bigdoggy700:

Nightforce scopes are also great scopes, Are they made in the USA? .

Japan, last I heard.

Blacktailer-

I am glad to hear that your ONE experience with Leupold's customer nonservice department was a positive one. If you shoot tens of thousands of rounds a year and hang out with friends who also do so, then you will get more experience with the nonservice department. When your sample size rises above ONE you will find that it is not always so perfect.

There was (still is?) a guy named Garth Kendig running their nonservice department and he would get all of this glowing praise in the whorish gunrags. You know, the articles right beside the full page color ad for Leuopold which brought a nice little sum to the gun rag in question. I have dealt directly with him and he is nothing like depicted by the gunwriters. There are a few gunwriters who are good today, but it is a small number.

What really sucks now is that Premier Reticle is no longer in operation and you have to go back to the jerk-offs at Leupold for reticle changes. They manage to screw up what seems to be close to a "no-brainer" modification with alarming regularity.

But as I stated in my original post, i will keep buying them. Not for a hunt where I fly across an ocean, but local hunts are OK. I have more Leupolds than anything else, partly because I am on a lightweight kick these days and they make light scopes.

I like Leupolds I think it's a good scope. Yes I can buy used in good shape for a good price
I do think some euro scope are better but as a working man I would have to save too long to buy one . I do own a few but they were lucky used buys.My next buy will be a Nightforce thats
a high dollar but as always I found a good one in like new shape at a good price.

quote:

One Bushnell product, the Trophy 3-9, is an exceptional product & value for the cheap $99 MSRP

WOW! That is the single scope I have seen with the most complete failures- and I have seen quite a few of them. Those things seem to go to pot at the drop of a hat. The fierce recoil of my dad's .243 broke the crosshair in his. I replaced it with a Leupold.

The reason I use them is simple. I once bought a Ruger No. 1 .45/70, and, working up a maximum load for it with 400-grain Barnes Original semispitzers, I arrived at 60 grains of RE 7, which produced a velocity of 2270 FPS @ 10' from the muzzle, and 59 ft/lb of recoil with that 7.5 pound rifle. The first scope I put on it was a Bushnell Scopechief 1.5X-4X, the top of the line Bushnell scope at that time. The gun destroyed it in about five rounds. Next came a steel-tube Weaver K4-same story. Then I put a Leupold M8 2X-7X on it. That scope has lasted over 20 years on that gun.

I have no experience with the NEW Bushnells, present-day Leupolds, or others, which may be as good, for all I know! But I do know that those M8 Leupolds were built to stand pretty severe usage. And I will admit, their OPTICAL QUALITIES are inferior to some others, such as the Kahles Helia 6X I have on my 7mm Magnum......

If you shoot big rifles that are accurate and from the bench with a bag of lead shot, they all fail, at least for giving top accuracy. Heat, such as left in the car knocks them about.

Leupold are a reasonable price, look good and have a good image because they are on so many custom guns and of course bench guns. Personally, I would rather have 2 or 3 Leupolds in different rings than one expensive scope.

Mechanically, Nightforce is the best I have seenm, and that is six of them (I don't own them) but they are not real attractive on a sporting configuration rifle.

I have a 1.5-6 Burris that I like a lot for similar applications.

I had it on a 5 pound 338 Winchester and shot it as much as I could with no problem now it's on my father's 444 Marlin (he keeps ending up with my stuff, bastard).

Anywhoo, I have grown tired of anything with a gold ring. I am kind of a Burris flunky now with the occasional smattering of German and Austrian products as the wallet allows.

I have had far to many Leupolds that just plain weren't adjustable, fogged, or just didn't hold zero.

I will not tell you that Burris is 1000 times better, but I do beleive they are better. And it seems like Leupold is the last company to improve anything.

For a long time Burris has made the Fullfield 2 for around $200.00 in 3-9. The scope Leupold sales for $200.00 isn't even in the same class.

John T
I would send that Vari X III 2.5 – 8 back and have it fixed.
I have a Vari X III 6.5X20 and I can shoot a composite target I start by going up 10 clicks right 10 shoot 1 down 20 shoot 1 left 20 and shoot 1 up 20 shoot 1 now go around the block 4 more times. When I do my part the groups will be ¾ or less at 50 yards with my 22 and have had similar luck with a couple of other Vari X IIIs on center firer rifles.
Bill

I guess everyone has a Leupold story so here is mine. I called Leupold and said I had tried to find a Vari X III with a #4 reticle and couldn't find one and could I buy one factory direct even at full retail. I was told "no I couldn't" but they would do a fast reticle change if I could find the the basic scope I wanted. I was going to Botswana to hunt elephant with a .416 Rigby so I wanted a 1.5-5X as a backup that was identical to the scope on the rifle. I wanted both scopes to have a #4 reticle. This was Thursday about 4:00pm. I called a dealer and bought a 1.5-5X with a duplex reticle and told him to send it overnight to Leupold. He did it and Monday I had my scope back from Leupold with a #4 reticle. I really think this is excellent service from someone who is not some big shot that Leupold really needs to care about. Both scopes worked perfectly and I got my elephant.

I think many people miss the point (pun intended) of a hunting scope. Fundamentally it is a device to aid the placement of bullets. It does this by providing a consistant point of impact from point of aim.

To achieve this, the scope has to hold it's zero, the reticle needs to be large enough to be seen in less than steller lighting while not obscuring the target, the eye relief needs to be sufficient, the placement of the eye in relation to the scope should have some latitude, the optics should be reasonably clear, and the scope should be as light as possible.

When you add up all those criteria, Leupold more than not comes to the top of the heap, and other scopes are a compromise of those criteria in one or more areas. Yes, I think Leupolds have become more expensive than they should be, and they offer too many models vs concentrating on a reasonable selection of solid optics.

I like Leup vari XIII for several reasons.

1. The duplex acts as a range finder.

2. The scopes are reasonably clear, although not as good as a high end German scope

3. The click adjustments track well

4. The gold ring looks nice.

5. The scope looks good quality, not cheap, but not flashy.

6. The scopes do not tend to be overly large and bulky.

7. The warranty is impeccable.

500 grains
Those are all good reasons. Do you downplay the value of high optical quality? To me clear enough to see the target is all I want as your other factors seem more important to me.

Mike, I do not intend to denigrate high end German optics, not at all. I own several high end German scopes myself and I like them quite well. However, in general I cannot justify an additional $1000 or $1200 per scope when the optics of a Leup vari XIII seem fine and dandy to me.

I use Leupold mainly because of the warrenty and their willingness to upgrade and recalibrate them for free. I've sent several Leupolds back for factory upgrades and it's always free of charge. I think for the price this is a service that is invaluable, especially on a hard used scope. In my humble opinion I think the German optics are best mainly because of the coatings they use. Then second is the Japanese coatings and then it is the American coatings. I think this is due to the restrictions on chemicals and their restrictive uses regulated by the EPA. The scope I've decided to buy next is the Zeiss Conquest because I can really see well through it. It is around $400.00 which is really reasonable. I just wonder about their warrenty and how fast the service is.

So you do believe that the highest possible optical quality is not the most important quality in a scope. Many posters seem hung up on the excellent optics on high end scopes and don't seem to care about anything else. btw i sort of like Swarovski scopes I just can't afford them, never tried Kahle or S&B.

Pegleg,

one thing you forgot, you can drive over to Leupold's factory from your place in a couple hours can't you? I got a feeling you are talking airplanes and months to have a scope returned to Zeiss.
Leupold is one of two companies with a serious warranty, Dillon is the other. It breaks, we fix it for free...for the life of the product. That's the fine print...

Rich
DRSS

PS: did you shoot Hunter Class in the early and mid nineties?

quote:

Originally posted by Mikelravy:
So you do believe that the highest possible optical quality is not the most important quality in a scope.

I think that good optics are important, but having the "best" optics possible is not at the top of my list. If best optics were my objective, then I would probably have something like an 8x56 x 30mm tube, but I really do not like those giant, cumbersome scopes.

But of course everyone's needs are different. ErikD who used to post here uses a top of the line Zeiss with an illuminated red reticle for the hunting he does in very dark forest conditions in Norway. For his application, that is probably a much better choice than my standard Leup 2.5-8 duplex.

500grains
I agree, also though it seems that I can easily find a Leupold that fits but it is harder with the Euros. I need to see how it fits before shelling out and there isn't anywhere around to try out all the Euros. I can find just about every Leupold in stock locally.

quote:

PS: did you shoot Hunter Class in the early and mid nineties?

No hunter Class stuff, just the Varmint classes.
Hell those Hunter guns in the 308 class kick when shooting free recoil!
Another point is I can give a scope to Allen Tucker at just about any match and be given super service as he is the one who will drive it to Portland and make sure that the scope is looked after.
No shipping involved and I hate that drive to Portland any more. Way too much traffic. I'd much rather drive to Boise. It's a beautiful drive! You are lucky to live in that area.