Ok, I've gotten the big bore bug once again and went out and bought a brand new Douglas .510" barrel 27" long with 1.20" x 3" chamber.

I got a great deal on it, about $95 USD, from a guy here in Canada, who had it for a .50 BMD project but didn't have the opportunity to follow through with it.

Barrels like this are all but impossible to find here, unless of course you fill out the appropriate import/export documents to order one in.

Anyway,I'd like to use my Rem 700 LA and Choate Silly Sniper Stock in my new project to help keep the cost reasonable. My question is, what .510 bore cartridges are practicle and SAFE based on my intended use of a Rem 700 LA?

I want to shoot cheap .50 BMG bullets almost exclusively. The .50 BMD (short) is high in my consideration. However, there may be other cartridges that may be suitable as well that I'm not aware of.

By the way, no flame wars on this thread please. Last time I posted here my thread became a shit storm between several posters.

Thanks, for the help!

Babs,
About the only choice with a rem action would be something based off the ultramag/404, due to case head diameter..

Can I talk you into buying a CZ 550? and building a 500 jeffery or 510wells, or the like?

jeffe

I don't know what is the bolt diameter of your Remington but the smaller case head of a 50 caliber cartridge would be the 500 Jeffery. You could shorten cartridge to make it a wildcat to fit your Rem. Good luck!

The Rem 700 LA I have has a .532" bolt head diameter. Any chance you could turn down the .580" case down to .532" to accomodate the Remington I have? Seems to me I remember JD Jones doing this with his .50 Whisper, correct?

Unless things change in the future, a CZ 550 is out of the question. I'd love to own one, but since this is going to be a big bore "plinker" I'd prefer to not have to go to the added expense of a new action.

It would be possible but it will probably be a single shot affair, as the severly rebated rim would have a hard time feeding from the magazine box. Unless you have a lathe to turn down your own brass, it will cost you to have other people to do it for you. At the end, you will have to spend some money and also put up with the aggravation. Good luck!

Try the 499 Cheyenne! Got a rebated rim to fit the boltface.



Here's an article re; the cartridge
Friday, September 27, 2002 Meade Cty Times Tribune/SD

Not dodging the bullet

When Pete Forass, Leitner-Wise Rifle Company, got a contract to develop a new semi-automatic weapon for the United States Coast Guard and the Homeland Security Agency, he knew finding the right cartridge maker wouldn�t be an easy task.

The Alexandria, Va., gun manufacturer�s newest rifle uses a .50 caliber, 330 grain bullet that travels at 2,220 feet per second. In layman�s terms � it�s one screamer of a round that packs a knock-out.

Forass initially talked to some of the big-name munitions makers about supplying this cartridge. What he found, wasn�t to his liking.

The big boys all told him it would take six to eight months to get this cartridge off the drawing board, and on to the shooting range. So Forass turned to Jamison International, a Sturgis cartridge maker.

The new cartridge fills a void in the military arsenal. The .50 caliber is known for its stopping power, having been the standard round in machine guns for years. But it also has a downside. The collateral damage factor that this shell can cause has, until now, all but precluded it from being the caliber of choice for coventional military issue.

Leitner-Wise�s latest rifle, the .499 LWRC, utilizes a powdered metal (frangible) bullet that breaks up upon impact. The frangible bullet doesn�t ricochet, or cause other damage like the standard .50 caliber bullet. The new cartridge basically gives soldiers a weapon with good ballistics, but still remains safe for close range work.

�The .50 BMG (Browning Machine Gun) bullet is too powerful for close-in, and the .556 mm (NATO aka .223 Remington) is too small,� Forass explained. �So this weapon can fill a very specialized niche in the military community.�

The round comes in three different loads. One is for training. A second is a standard issue load, while the third is armor-piercing.

Forass said initial test trials were convincing enough for his company to offer Jamison a multi-year contract. Over the next four years the Sturgis manufacturer is charged with turning out nearly 8.6 million rounds.

The .499 LWRC looks a lot like the AR-15 rifle. The new weapon fires in single shot, three-round bursts or fires in a semi-automatic mode. Forass says the two federal services are the primary target markets, but the rifle may soon prove attractive to other law enforcement agencies.

The .499 LWRC is nearing full production and expected to start delivery by mid-October. In fact, the weapon will be unveiled at a major shooting competition in New Orleans shortly.

495 A-square.

Canuck

Babs2,
When I first read your post, I thought I was seeing things. Nobody I have seen has a BMD let alone talk about it. The BMD Short is what I have (2 rifles in fact) and I really like this round. I have one made on a military M98 Mauser and the other is on a Sako TRG-S (originally in 30-378).

I think the .499 Cheyenne that Sysephus is talking about fires a .500" pistol bullet like the Speer 325gr HP, the same as a .50 AE & .50 Beuwulf. IF that is the case, forget it. It won't work with your barrel.

There are going to be few choices in the setup you described and I would also suggest selling the Rem 700 LA and buying a CZ 550 Mag in .416 Rigby and using that action & stock (with some bedding work). Here's the reason:
Rem 700 cartridge choices- .50BMD Short, .50 BMD, .495 A-Square (UPPER limit)
CZ 550- .50BMD Short, .50 BMD, .495 A-Square, .500 A-square, .510/505 Gibbs, .500 AHR

What I was looking for was a round/gun that I could feed inexpensive BMG bullets FROM THE MAGAZINE into the chamber. The BMD Short is the ONLY one that will do it. All the others are single shot BMG bullet shooters.

So if you want to shoot BMG bullets from the magazine, get the BMD Short. If you want to shoot BMG bullets as a single shooter, there are the above choices. However, the .500 A-Square (.510 JAB, .510 Wells, etc) is the easiest & cheapest of the mix.

Here are some Pic's to enjoy:


http://www.serveroptions.com/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=16;t=002196

Mingo, did you remove/privatize the pic?

Also, what is the twist rate?
1:9", 1:10", 1:15", 1:18", 1:20"?

If the barrel was bought as a 50 bmg tube, my guess is a 1-15" twist. In that case, you'll need a 500 a-square, or 500 Jeffrey to get enough fuel to hit the 2200 fps needed to stabalize the bmg pills.

My advice would be to get a big enough action to allow you to feed normal 500 ammo through the mag, and deep throat it to use bmg pills as a single shot, thats how my 500 Jeffrey P-17 is being set up.

BMG, thanks for the pic and the input on the project I'm planning on. Did you buy a reamer? If so, who from? Dies?

By the way, do you go by the nick "Oxen" on another board?

Was there a lot of work necessary to modify a Mauser 98 bolt to accept a .580" based cartridge like the .378/.460 Weatherby? Not having done one before, I was surprised to hear that it could be done.

Loading from the mag is not critical to me. A single shot would be fine with me.

The twist on my barrel is 1 in 15". What is the twist of your barrels?

1-18 for me.... But that's the plan for my jeffe-ry.... spit 535gr for hunting, and 630's for practice.

jeffe

Babs2,
For my Mauser, I had Belden Dampf (TX) do the work and he did a great job. He is also the one who has the reamer. As for dies, I got them from 2 different sources. Fred at Z-Hat made the sizeing die and Hornady custom shop made the seat/crimp die (with a slideing bullet sleeve, very nice). They are both custom jobs (obviously) but Hornady has the material in stock but Fred has about a 2.5-3 month wait (unless he has them in stock now).
I may be a bovine, but shhhhh. It's a secret.
You'll have to talk to Belden as I didn't do any of the work. I don't have a construction/machineist bone in my body. Sometimes I wonder why screws take so much force to be pounded into a 2x4 board with a hammer
The mauser feeds from the mag (2 down & 1 in the tube) very well. In my mauser I don't load them HOT and keep them under 50k psi and usually around 40k. The Mauser sends a 750gr A-Max at over 1550fps and a 535gr Woodleigh at over 2000fps in a 24" barrel. In my Sako I generally run them just below 60k psi and the velocities are the same but with 4" less barrel. It holds 3 in the mag and 1 in the tube. For a single shot, sell the Rem and buy a CZ 550 Mag in .416 Rigby and go with the .510/460Wby Long (.500 A-Square, .510 JAB, .510 Wells, etc). My barrels are 1:9" to stabalize the heavier BMG bullets, but your 1:15" should work just fine - and at a great price. A 1:18 will stabalize the 450-550gr bullets well as these twist barrels were generally found on 50-70's that shot the 515gr cast bullets well.

MacD37,
You are correct on the stabalization. In football terms 'It shoots a great spiral'. I get 1550 with the 750gr A-Max bullets and over 2000 with the 535gr Woodleighs (also 2250fps with the 300gr Barnes ). I wanted a BMG bullet repeater in a 'sporter' sized gun. I already have a .50 BMG that I shoot for fun and in FCSA 1000yd matches and a .500 A-Square is in the works now, but the BMD Short was really calling my name.
Also, last weekend I was shooting the sako and was getting 1" groups with M2 Ball (690gr) and sub-MOA groups with the A-Max bullets at 100m. I'm now going to test some 700gr AP for groups against the M2 Ball. I really enjoy the 'reactive' bullets that a BMG will shoot in a smaller repeater package.

Think of the BMD Short as a *high pressure 50-70 improved on a belted (not rimmed) case*. It's NOT in the same league as the .510/460 Longs, Gibbs, Nitro, AHR, etc JUST LIKE those are NOT in the same league as the .50 BMG, .50 McMurdo, 12.7x108 Russian, etc. For me it is a short range (under 250yd realistically) hunting gun and an explosive/tracer bullet launching repeater platform that I can carry AND shoot at any gun range that costs pennies a shot with inexpensive de-milled BMG bullets.

[ 12-05-2002, 20:52: Message edited by: BMG ]

Babs2- some thoughts for you. 1. Don't waste your time on the M700. You will need to have the bolt opened to .590 to hold any cartridge that will itself hold a .50 anything. This makes it a single shot, requires a sako extractor and is totally marginal in other important aspects. Stay away from cases that headspace on the case mouth in a high pressure rifle cartridge. This is OK in a pistol, but really bad form in a rifle that generates much higher pressures. Severely rebated rimmmed cartridges are another really bad idea. thats why the .500 A2 short versions ( as shown above)all use a belted cartridge.
I suggest you get a good cheap VZ-24 Mauser action and have a .500 Jeffery or .500 AHR built on it. The .500 AHR is simply a .500 Jeffery with a slightly longer case neck( and slightly better performance). The .500 Jeff was designed to feed through a Mauser and although the rim is rebated ( read a recipe for feeding problems) a good gunsmith can make this work for you. Throat the thing for a .50BMG bullet ( no big deal) and your done.
-Rob

Babs,
You can just sell it to me, and I'll take care of it. Rob is right.. don't even try on a remington.. but I think I said that, in my first post

Get a cz550, and do a 500a2, jeffery, ahr, something worth while, and that you can load DOWN if you want/

jeffe

[ 12-06-2002, 01:20: Message edited by: jeffeosso ]

BMG, Sounds like fun, and I guess it's true some folks are real taken by short, fat women!

[ 12-06-2002, 03:47: Message edited by: MacD37 ]