I was at one of the local gun shops this weekend and happened to see a new Model 70 in 375 H&H on the rack. It looked good from a distance, but was a complete disaster up close. The safety was so hard to move, I thought it was going to break. There was a bunch of sharp, knobby boogers (wood/finish?) in the bolt handle notch. Most glaring, the barrel band sling mount was loose, as in not attached at all. I could slide it up and down the barrel all the way to/from the front sight and back again. On the up side, the checkering was nice and sharp, and the rifle fit me pretty well.

Now, for a $920 rifle, this was completely unacceptable, IMO. I told this to the guy as I was saying how I wasn't going to be buying that one. If it had come into my store while I was selling guns, it would have gone right back to Winchester as defective, not ever put on the rack! Poor product and poor attitude in the store is going to put this POS into some unsuspecting buyer's hands. After pointing out these problems, all the guy could tell me was 'that's Winchester for you'. He put it right back on display....

Is USRAC really going that far down the crapper? I'd be scared to fire this one without having it checked by a smith first. No new gun should leave the factory looking like this. The CZ in 375 H&H I looked at a couple weeks ago was of so much better quality, I was shocked. I've seen Savages that operate better than this particular Model 70.

I think QC is sorely lacking in most major rifle manufacturers. The best remedy for the consumer is to examine the rifle closely PRIOR to purchase, and avail yourselves of the warranty service if a proble, with materials or workmanship arises.

George

About two weeks ago, in one of the local gunshops, there was a nice new Winchester on the shelf.
The sales twerp offered it to me saying what a great rifle it was. It looked ok from the outside but when the bolt was taken out it looked like the bolt lugs had been finished with a blacksmiths rasp. It was the worst bolt I have ever seen on a new rifle!
It's sad to see a once great company turn out such a badly finished product.

I agree, that's totally unacceptable... And the gunshop owner should never even put that on the shelf.

I had the same experinece with some Win 70's a few weeks back. Went into the shop to look around. picked up 6 Wins in various calibers. (No big bores though). 2 cycled very nicely and appeared to be well made rifles. 3 were very gritty when cycling. Felt like sand and heavy grease mixed on the bolt. The 6th one i opened the action and when i tried to push the bolt handle down I had to literally put the butt on the counter, lean hard on the handle to get it to close. The sales guy laughed and said "no way". He then tried it, had the same problem, quietly placed it on the rack and asked if I would like to see anything else. He appeared greatly embarrased. It appeared they knew of the issue though and will just sell to somebody who doesnt know any better. Maybe Winchester wont let them send them back????

Hiker,

WOW! That's just grossly unacceptable... If enough shop owners refuse to accept shipment on these makers' guns that will get their attention. I wouldn't even put it on the shelf - Winchester should be embarassed to put out something like that and it sounds all too frequent from what you guys are describing. The occasional lemon is naturally going to occur, but this sounds more like it's par for the course from what we're seeing here.

I too am hearing bad things about the M-70 quality.....but more about the crapper Remington is in.

I'm not hearing or seeing this from Howa, Vanguard, savage, Marlin or Browning.....

It saddens me to see this crap.....these are american legends going to pot and It hurts.

I must be very lucky or too dumb to know the difference. I just purchased a new M70 375 h&h. I have about 40 rounds through it using the factory sights. I am very pleased with accuracy and action. No malfunction and a much smoother action than my Ruger 338 win Mag.

I do sincerely hope that these companies will figure out the err in their ways and work harder to maintain better quality control. I imagine they'll have to "bottom out" and loose some profit and market share to the other firearms manufacturers before USRAC and Remington will begin to fix things - I just hope they don't take too big a hit. If you think about it, Savage kinda went through this and ended up changing their rifles slightly and improving their image. Other than the fact they're cheap, I seldom hear anyone bitch about Savages these days. Perhaps a similar situation may hold true for Win and Rem?

quote:

I do sincerely hope that these companies will figure out the err in their ways and work harder to maintain better quality control.

I'm a hard core manufacturing person.....and have seen it and been there and done that.....

This is a fact:.. Quality is a direct reflection on the character of the senior management staff.

I too have seen some really crappy looking stuff latley, I sugjest it will come around in cycles, A few years back mabye 5 I thought winchester was doing a great job on the model 70 classics. I bought 3 and They are all very good rifles, But A while back I had a little money in my pocket and thought i would look around a little, Saw a few featherweight classics lined up in a rack, I asked the guy to show the one with the shorter barrel, I knew the others were wsms, and the guy says its a 6.5 somthin or other, well That sounded like a swede to me and I thought a featherweight classic in the 6.5 would be a great adition.
He hands it too me and the bolt shroud was brown ! closer to the color of the wood than the blue of the barrel the bolt was clunky and stiff, I was sorly dissapointed , And I told the guy I would send it back,with a nasty note.
can't except crappy workmanship, with modern C N C machinery there is no excuse for it.
I must say some of the CDL remingtons I have seen looked really nice ! But I will look on the used racks for Quality workmanship, or try to find another CZ...tj300