Here is what they said:
[QUOTE]

Dear Mr. Berry,

our big bore rifles in Cal. .470NE was tested with 500 shots in an endurance test by an independent institute for technical tests (DEVA).
Our rifle stands this strain without any problems.
The tests were made under usual test conditions here in Germany.
Best regards,
Elke Weiss, Sales Dept.

[END QUOTE]

I love it when a sales lady named Elke sweet talks me like that. What is DEVA?

[ 06-03-2002, 10:53: Message edited by: DaggaRon ]

Here is what I got for an answer:

Sehr geehrter Herr Wir danken f�r Ihre mail und k�nnen wie folgt Antwort geben:
1. Es gibt derzeit keine Planung, die Doppelb�chsen im Kal. .450/.400 Jeffery herzustellen.

2. Wir verwenden unterschiedliche Munition zum Einschie�en unserer Doppelb�chsen. Sie ist abh�ngig vom Kaliber.
Die gro�kalibrigen Doppelb�chsen werden mit Federal-Munition eingeschossen, f�r die kleineren Kaliber verwenden wir RWS, Norma, aber auch andere Munition.
Im Waffenpa�, der jeder Waffe bei Auslieferung beiliegt, ist die Munition mit der die Waffe geschossen wurde ersichtlich.

3. Sollten Sie spezielle Munition f�r Ihre Doppelb�chse w�nschen, so ist dies bei der Bestellung anzugeben.
Es gibt zwei Optionen:
- Sie stellen die gew�nschte Munition bei.
- Wir kaufen 100 Schu� der gew�nschten Munition und liefern die verbleibende restliche Munition bei Ausllieferung der Waffe an Sie mit.

4. Unsere Anschu�bedingungen f�r Doppelb�chsen bis 9,3x74R sind
Trefferkreis pro Einzellauf 4 cm
Trefferkreis pro Laufgruppe 5 cm

f�r gro�kalibrige Doppelb�chsen
Trefferkreis pro Einzellauf 5 cm
Trefferkreis pro Laufgruppe 8cm
Geschossen werden jeweils 3 Schu� in Intervallen von 7-10 Sekunden.

5. Haltbarkeit des Verschlusses
Unsere Doppelb�chse im Kal. .470NE wurde von der DEVA mit 500 Schu� getestet, ohne Ver�nderungen am Verschlu�system.
Die Doppelb�chsen bis Kal. 9,3x74R unterlagen einem Test von 5.000 Schu� mit gleichem Ergebnis.

Mit freundlichen Gr��en
Elke Wei�, Abt. Verkauf

If somebody needs parts of that translated, tell so.

I told them 5000 rds are o.k, but 500 rounds means nothing for the handloader. ( I don�t dare say at this forum, that perhaps handloaders have more barrels destroyed than were shot out in all wars after �45 ). And to hunt with self rolled ones is part of the hunt.

Hermann

Just for fun I used Babelfish on the Altavista site ( http://babelfish.altavista.com/tr ) which is a language translator. Here is what came out:

"Dear Mr. Wir thank for their mail and can as follows answer give:

1. There is at present no planning, the double cans in the Kal. to manufacture 450/.400 Jeffery.

2. We use different ammunition for shooting our double cans in. It depends on the caliber. The large-caliber double cans are shot in with feather/spring aluminum ammunition, for the smaller calibers use we RWS, Norma, in addition, other ammunition. In the weapon passport, which is attached to each weapon with distribution, the ammunition with that is the weapon was shot evidently.

3. If you should wish special ammunition for your double can, then this is to be indicated for the order. There are two options: - you provide the desired ammunition. - we buy 100 shot of the desired ammunition and provide the remaining remaining ammunition with Ausllieferung of the weapon to you.

4. Our first shot conditions for double cans to 9,3x74R are hit circle per single run 4 cm hit circle per group of runs of 5 cm for large-caliber double cans hit circle per single run 5 cm hit circle per group of runs of 8cm projectiles in each case 3 shot in intervals of 7-10 seconds becomes.

5. Durability of the catch our double can in the Kal. 470NE was tested by the DEVA with 500 shot, without changes in the sealing system. The double cans to Kal. 9,3x74R were subject to a test of 5.000 shot with same result.

Yours sincerely Elke white, abbott sales"

So how close is that to the 'correct' translation?

You see? The bad press on anything is usually only BS presented to further some one ajenda, and this is a good example of that fact.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a Merkel made after the wall fell, or pre WWII, before it went up! We don't have to worry much about the ones made DURING, because they weren't imported into the USA. The price is not because of poor quality, but of very low cost of manufacture in a depressed country, slowly comming back from Comunist rule. Some of the cost reduction is because of machine made engraveing on the cheaper models, which is not a draw back for the opperation of the firearm, but IMO, would be better with none at all, so I could engrave it myself.

A test of 500 rounds of 470 NE is far more than the average double owner will shoot a 470 NE in his life time, after the inetial load work up, for a hanloader. I handload, and I seriously doubt I have put 500 rds through any of my doubles. For a person shooting Factory ammo in a 470NE I doubt more than two hundred rounds will be used, simply because of cost. The one exception to this is a person who shoots double rifle competition, and even then wouldn't shoot over 500 rds, in most cases.

With the 9.3X74R, I would say 5000 rounds with no change in face, would indicate to me, that this little Merkel rifle, starting out fresh, would be just fine to leave to my 3 year old great grandson, who would probably get many years use out of it.

It is funny how people think! For some reason if you back a product, most take that to mean you are putting down it's competition. Nothing could be farther from the truth. I own many makes of double rifles, and if I thought any one of them was not up to snuff, it would be converted to a shotgun,or sold, in a heart beat!

A quality double rifle doesn't have to have a well known name to make it serviceable, as a hunting rifle, as some would have you believe.

I see nothing wrong with any of the Merkel S/S double rifles, except for the chambering of rimless cartridges in them, but that is up to the buyer. If they buy them, then they will be available. It is just that they will not be bought by me! Others may do what they consider is right for them. THAT'S COOL

RAB,

I am not sure how many rounds you have put through that Merkel yet, but was wondering if there are any obvious wear witness marks yet? If there are were exactly are these high wear areas. For the record, all the Merkels 470NEs I have seen (all two of them) have appeared to be well manufactured.

Also, if you don't mind, would you post the size of the radius of the fillet between the standing breech and the action bar, as well as, the hinge pin diameter.

Thanks,
Todd E

[ 06-04-2002, 03:05: Message edited by: Todd E ]

Todd E,

I have a 470 Merkel with about 180 rounds thru it. No real wear marks yet, some visual surface finish change on the front lump ??? but not able to be felt. No measured difference with a micrometer between mine and one with 20 rounds thru it. Action is still very tight. I would measure the hinge pin and radius between the standing breach and action bar if you explained exactly what I am to measure. Not real sure on double rifle terminology.

MacD 37,

I got 180 rounds thru the 470 in my first year and 80 more rounds bought and paid for to shoot. I might just make 500 rounds in 3 or 4 years if lucky or I start reloading.

BigB

BigB, 500 rds is not hard to shoot, in a double rifle, if it is the only double you use, and especially if it is new you. Because this is a new rifle to you, will explain the hyper use on paper. You are not the "AVERAGE" double rifle user. That animal is a person, most times, who buys a double rifle to hunt with, and once he finds a load for his rifle, may not shoot more than ten shots in a year at paper, and five of that will be to show a PH he can hit what he shoots at, the other five on paper before he leaves for his Safari. In the field not more than another ten rounds will be expended on Dangerous game. At 20 rounds per year it would take a long time to make the 500 mark. Most of the used 80 yr old doubles bought, that are in good shape, have nowhere near 500 rds through them, I'd bet!

In any event, let us know when you wear this Merkel out, so we will know how many rounds it takes! DaggaRon will probably wear his out in two years! He shoots his a lot. When I get a new,(to me) double rifle, I will buy 100 new cases, use ten of these cases to work up a perfect load for the rifle, record the load, and load up all the NEW brass,marking the used brass loads for use on paper for the PH, and store it away for hunting. I like to keep at least 100 rds loaded in "NEW" brass for all my double rifles, but most of my shooting will be on game.

Todd E,
Wear marks: Some faint, arc like, curvilinear, scratches on the lateral surfaces of both lumps can be seen if a bright light and close inspection is used. The chopper lumps are in the white and are not quite mirror finished silver. There is not any palpable scratch, just barely visible wear marks that come from a tight fitting action opening and closing.
The Greener cross bolt has a blued/black finish that does show some wear on its top surface, where it passes through the round hole in the barrel extension. This is good as it is getting smoother to operate in opening and closing.

Hinge pin looks like about 0.350" or about 9 mm.

The fillet radius between standing breech and action bars looks like about 0.2" or maybe 0.19", as this is difficlt for me to guesstimate with my calipers.

I only have 100 rounds fired. 40 Federal factory loads and 60 handloads so far.

Fritz,
Thanks for the DEVA translation.

BMG,
Thanks for the babblefish translation.

aHunter,
Thanks for sharing the original German letter.

MacD37,
I haven't been as busy as you think with that Merkel, but I wish I were!

MacD37,

The practice with the 470 paid off last year. The PH made me fire only 2 shots to confirm I could shoot the gun. The 470 gets to go back this year and try it again. For buffalo do you use softs or solids. I was going to take both Federal TBBC & TBSH and use what the PH suggests. For elephant I know it is only solids but for buffalo I thought you use softs in herd situations.

BigB

BigB, I carry my double rifles with a soft in the right barrel, and a solid in the left, on Buffalo. I try to get the initial shot into the lungs if I can, followed closely with as many solids as I can. The exception to this rule is when my bull is mixed in with a tight group of other Buffalo, then it's softs all the way.

I have only fired two shots, out of a Westley Richards 500/450 on an Elephant, both solids into the the heart lung area, of a friend's elephant, by prior arrangement. His head shot didn't drop the ele, so as it turned I fired the two shots, and the PH fired one in the H/L area, and another in the rump as it departed. It made about 100 yds before going down.

[ 06-07-2002, 00:36: Message edited by: MacD37 ]

Mac,

I was hoping for a brain shot on an elephant last year but ended up with the heart/lung. I shot it 5 times with the 470 using solids. The first 2 put it down. The last 3 were insurance.

I like your idea of a soft in the right and a solid in the left for buffalo. I will go with that.

This year I told them the only way I will take another elephant is if it is real big so I am not counting on it. But in hunting you never know.

Thanks

BigB