Guys - I'm looking to make my introductory big bore purchase with my eye on an entry level 375. I've looked at the Remingtons, M70s and CZs. I'd rather have a wood stock so the Remington is out. I don't have anything particular in mind that I want to hunt with the rifle but I hope to make it to Africa in the next 2-3 years. But I'm not really making this purchase with that in mind. I might shoot a few hogs with it.

What are everyone's thoughts between the CZ 550 and the M70? Is there something else out there that would provide a better value?

The CZ will be heavier to carry but easier to shoot because of it. Other than that I don't have an opinion because I haven't shot any of the newer Winchesters. Love the CZ, though.

Yeah, I noticed that the CZ is about a pound or so heavier but that's not a huge problem for me right now, especially considering what I'll be doing with it. I'm 29 and in reasonably good shape so a couple of extra pounds isn't a huge issue.

Take a look at the Blaser R 93 Safari in 375.
In Big D they have them at Rays Sporting Goods.
There is also a standard weight 375 and a 19 3/4" Tracker 375 bbl.
I have the 2 latter bbls. They both shoot very good, but the Safari bbl is thicker/heavier and will recoil less.

quote:

Originally posted by Rattlesnaker:
What are everyone's thoughts between the CZ 550 and the M70? Is there something else out there that would provide a better value?

They're both good, serviceable rifles that may require a little work to make them better. I see them both as 'good value'.

Since CZ doesn't make their 550 in left-hand, I only have personal experience with the M-70 (I have six of them), and am very happy with them.

The CZ in .375 will hold more rounds in the magazine than the M-70, which may or may not be important to you.

George

A bit of caution about taking a 375 to Africa.

Depending on what you choose to hunt, there are some places that require .416 or bigger, ruling out the 375.

That said, I just reblued Fjold's Win 70 Safari Express and I was pretty impressed with it.
It was just heavy enough and had alot of nice amenities such as good sights and a second recoil lug, although it is unnecessary.

-Spencer

I'm not necessarily buying this rifle to take to Africa. I just need to get in the game with large bore rifles and this is the logical entry to to so. If this rifle is suitable for my first trip to Africa in a couple of years then great. If not, then I'll figure out what's best for me at that time, depending on what I'll be hunting.

I know that the Dallas/Fort Worth area has some big and excellent gunshows thoughout the year. If I lived in your area and wanted a .375 H&H, I'd go to some of these gunshows and I'd also prowl the used gun racks at some of the many local gunstores, and I'd take my time in doing so until I found the right rifle.

I don't like the current, off-the-shelf, factory-made .375s. I don't like the quality or workmanship of any of them. I'd rather look for an older Model 70 (including a push-feed) built from the 1960s thru the mid-1990s, as well as an older Model 700 that was built between 1962 and about 1987. Any Model 70 or Model 700 from this period is better-built than the current ones. They exhibit better workmanship, they have better barrels, and -- of all things -- you can get them for a better price than the currently-available .375s go for.

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quote:

Originally posted by ShopCartRacing:
Depending on what you choose to hunt, there are some places that require .416 or bigger, ruling out the 375.
-Spencer

Spencer,

This is the first I'm hearing of this.
Which places would those be? Do you know this for a fact, or is it something you heard?

George

It goes without saying that if you buy a used gun and are picky in choosing one, you can always sell it down the road and get your money out of it. Then maybe you can get that 416 or whatever suits your fancy at the time.

the chef

I would purchase a used Mauser in .375 such as a Whitworth or find myself a nice shooter pre 64 M-70 in .375 H&H...

If I was buying a new rifle I would opt for a .416 Remington in a Winchester, A Safari grade Ruger in 416 Rigby or a CZ in 404 Jefferys...

I bought used, unfired, a M70 Safari Express in 375, I sent it to the gunsmith for some cosmetic work and he was suprised by how good the rifle was done (he guessed it was outsourced! ) So don't automatically discount the newer production.

Used is the only way to go, I paid 650 for mine. The guy bought it new and then had some sort of health issue and doctor told him not to shoot it. You also see the Whitworths from time to time and they are good, my friend has one, first 375 I shot, and it shot well and was well put together if I remember it all right.

Red

I'd look for a used Interarms Whitworth or Alaskan 375, alot of gun for the money and a genuine 98 Mauser. CZs are good too (the 550 & ZKK602), so are pre-64 M70s altho they are usually more expensive, and I've heard good things about the newer M70 Classics altho I've never owned one. You'll love the 375, essential to any serious shooter's battery.

I guess we should mention the Charles Daly. I hear mixed reports but one never knows if the negatives are from people who expect pre-64 quality at post '04 prices.
You can get a 375 H&H Supreme for under $600.00 new on Gunbroker or Auction Arms when they come up. I know they're not supposed to be as refined as the old Whitworths but for $560.00 its an option.

Opps...that was a .458 Winchester. I don't think the 375s are here yet.

Thanks for your input guys. Sounds like quite a few of you are advocating the idea of a quality used rifle. I guess I should scour the local gunshops with that in mind.

I did the same thing last year, and my choice was a .375 H&H Win M70 Classic Stainless that I bought through the Classified Section hear at AR. Haven't killed anything with it yet, but hope to soon. I've had the trigger adjusted and put a Williams extractor on it, and will soon replace the stock - don't know with what though.

The folks that shoot CZs really like them, but they are about .75 lbs heavier and don't have the 3-position safety. BTW, I have found that the heavier bullets are more comfortable to shoot that really light ones - the recoil is not as sharp.

quote:

Originally posted by ShopCartRacing:
A bit of caution about taking a 375 to Africa.

Depending on what you choose to hunt, there are some places that require .416 or bigger, ruling out the 375.

This sounds kind of strange to me. As far as I know, the legal minimum for dangerous game in most african countrys is 375, but even 9,3mm is actually usually accepted.

I don't have a CZ. But I do have the current production M70 and couldn't be happier with it, after I had the trigger worked on. The CZ will be a bit less expensive assuming you buy new. I think there are a couple of 375's curently in the classified forum

I have a cz and am happy with it, I would go for a cz, m70 or a good m98 .375. I think the Ruger .375 may be a little heavy but that would be worth a look to.

The cz's are great value however hold 5 in the mag and one up the spout and they all seem to shoot good, they don't have any pot metal either.

Rattlesnaker, i too agree with fla3006 and Ray , the Whitworth is a fine rifle if you can find one. The stocks are good euro. strait grained black walnt with just enough drop to let the rifle roll, and it still mounts good with a scope. They all seem to be very well made and accurate and the best part is its a Mauser 98 action. Hope this helps you out. Charlie

Didn't realize there was a classified forum. That should be a good place to look.

I have a M70 Classic stainless, that I have used a LOT in the last three years. I found it new, but without a box at a pre-inventory sale for $627. I did replace the recoil pad and have the stock painted in a black/gray web pattern. I also slicked up the action a bit, but it really was not bad from the get go. It might not be quite as cool as some rifles, but it is a good practical all weather gun. I've seen some blued/walnut guns that have spent a few weeks in Alaska and they looked like they had been dragged along the ocean floor the whole time!

Blue guns that look like that have owners that look the same way, like any lazy ass dummy that too lazy to clean up himself or his gun...I have used blue and wood in Alaska, Canada, in the humid jungles or SA and none of mine look like they been dragged on the ocean floor..Maintenence is a wonderful thing on anything made by man, even works on man himself, I am living proof, I am still hunting at my age...

I think Lb404 has a whitworth for sale, and it may be listed in the classified.

He did have one for sale but I wasn't quick enough once I figured out about the Classifieds forum. If anyone that reads this thread has one for sale, I'd appreciate an email. Thanks.

Here is a couple of places you can look for good used guns. My brother picked up an Interarms Mark X in .375 H&H on one for $540 plus $25 shipping.

http://www.auctionarms.com/

http://www.gunbroker.com/

Another option if this gun might be sold later is a Ruger #1. First .375 I ever fired was a #1. The only drawback to a #1 is using it on dangerous game. From what I hear, not a good idea.

LB404 has an interarms mark x for sale but that's not necesarily the same as a Whitworth, right? What's a good price for a mark x in good condition?

Will was selling a CZ 375. I don't know if he sold it.

quote:

Originally posted by Rattlesnaker:
LB404 has an interarms mark x for sale but that's not necesarily the same as a Whitworth, right? What's a good price for a mark x in good condition?

The Whitworth used the Mark X action but was assembled in England, so unless "Whitworth" is specified it most likely is not the same. On this forum at least the seller would most likely note the distinction.

About not being able to take a 375 to Africa:

This is just word of mouth from some of my customers. I have never been to Africa on a hunt so I wouldn't know for sure.

If I recall correctly, it had something to do with hunting really really big animals, but hey you guys are the experts and you have not heard of such a rule, it certainly may not exist.

-Spencer

Rattlesnaker,

All good comments so far. Try to handle the different rifles you are considering-that will give you valuable info and may narrow your choices some.

The CZ is a very good rifle. Stout, accurate, good price and a large mag capacity. I think they are a bit "big" for the 375 (same action as their 416 Rigby) but due to their weight are one of the softest shooting 375s out there. The Ruger RSM is a beauty but like the CZ it is built around a very large action. I have RSMs in 416 Rigby and 458 Lott and love them (the quarter rib is nice and most have pretty good wood) but I have come to prefer my 375s in a slimmer package.

I have two Win M70 375s. One a pre-64 and the other a Classic SS/Synthetic I picked up from our own AR poster LDHunter. For sheer nostalgia and fireside appeal the wood/blued pre-64 wins out (and I noted you wanted a wood stock) but I am planning on tweaking the SS/syn M70 as my all around NA hunting rifle. I don't mind my wood stocks gaining "hunting character" but after this past years mule deer hunt that really "characterized" my RSM Rigby I am leaning back toward synthetic stocks for my everyday using rifles.

Buy a 375 H&H and start enjoying this great cartridge! Set up whatever rifle you choose to the propper LOP with a good pad and go from there. You will not be dissapointed in this round. If you buy smart you won't get burned too bad on resale if you want to try another rifle. But odds are you will be looking to add_another_375 to your collection.

John