If you were to pick a new (to you) rifle in the .375-.458 range with emphasis on feeding, extraction, and functional reliability generally, in particular the preferred use of flat-nosed solids, which would you pick that you think would require a minimum of gunsmithing. Ideally one would find a "no excuses" rifle that could be ready for use subject to the user getting familiar with it and finding a good load (hopefully with North Fork FPS).

Given the cost of some of these options, this is probably a thought exercise. A full custom is likely the answer but out of reach even for a thought exercise!

You read about problems with almost every type of rifle here and in the hunt reports, and the FN solids seem to bring out the worst.

Is there an answer?

Question:
Which one rifle would you pick as the most likely to be a "no excuses" out of the box, ready to hunt rifle as described above?

Choices:
Model 70 Classic
Pre-64 Model 70
Dakota 76
CZ
CZ with AHR Upgrades
Full AHR DGR
Blaser (You knew someone would suggest it!)
Other (Please Describe)

 

416 Ruger Alaskan !

I would have Duane Wiebe build me a rifle and then know for sure that it would be flawless.

Most cost-effective and reliable - AHR-modified CZ.

This is based on the 585AHR I had them build based on the CZ action - perfect and beautiful!

I picked the 'Full AHR DGR' for the simple reason that no factory rifle is ready to go right out of the box (even the Blaser ).

George

Winchester M70 Classic
Based on 416 Remington, 416 Taylor, 416 B&M, 458 Winchester,458 B&M, 458 Lott, 470 Capstick, 50 B&M Super Short, 50 B&M, 500 MDM. Based on 32 rifles in the above chambering. All which will feed, extract, and function reliably with flat nosed solid bullets of various designs.

Michael

Hello,
Since full custom is not an option, the latest Kimber's are probably good rifles, but for my money I opted to go with Ruger's Safari Magnum in 375H&H and 458Lott. Lots of features that are normally only available on custom rifles, but the latest offerings by Ruger, Alaskan and African, were not available at the time and w/ the 375 and 416Ruger rounds could have saved a sum of money and still ended up with very serviceable hunting rifles. The RSM-375H&H is on the heavy side, but in 458Lott the weight is a definite plus. My RSM's have "showpiece" walnut stocks on them, but for a true field/hunting rifle the synthetics are much more practical in my opinion. Will say that my Ruger's function flawlessly right out of the box and have shot them a fair amount and accuracy is excellent and have no complaints, but wish there was a solid synthetic stock offered for them?? The Ruger African and Alaskan are basic, solid hunting rifles that will serve well wherever you may want to hunt. I realize the calibers are new to the market, but one needs to stock up on them for figure they will be around for a while. Same holds true for Ruger as a mfg. and not that sure about some of the others. I have a pre '64 Win. Mod. 70/375HH, and it is simply another rifle that works fine and been used hard over the years(Alaska,)but I don't believe the FN versions of the Mod. 70 are offered in the the caliber range you are looking for?? Pre'64 Win in your calibers would work fine, but one in excellent condition will be pricey, but definite option. Again, for pure hunting rifle, very reasonable pricing, hard to beat those two latest offerings by Ruger. Good luck.

martin

Ruger RSM 375,416,458
Kimber DGR 89 375

All of these choices under 2k, Rugers under $1200 if you shop around used. I feel that ALL rifles can fail regardless of who builds them. How the rifle fits you is the single most important factor once you establish that the rifle is reliable. It doesn't matter how much it costs if you do not like it or it don't fit its worthless.

Brad

I have to vote RSM as close to perfect for cheap. Mine is excellent right out of the box. I think you can get a custom and still have issues so good luck.

Blaser R93. BLASERS ROCK!

Charles, I have at least one of every rifle on your list, except the Dakota, and the only one that will feed FNs (such as the NF solids) is the Blaser.

Of the others, I prefer CZ 550 Magnums and Winchester Model 70s, either pre-64s or modern CRF classics.

All will need tweaking, except the Blaser, which is good to go right out of the box.

For the CZ tweaking, I would definitely go with AHR.

I appreciate the input from everyone thus far. "None of the above" seems to be in the lead with AHR in second.

Mjines -- your suggestion falls into the "if I have to ask I cannot afford it" category unless I pick rifles over hunting.

Mrlexma -- between the two, would you pick the AHR-modded CZ or the Blaser? Even 500grains said the Blasers worked out of the box, but I am not sure I can see myself with one.

I picked "other" because the Sauer 202 and Sauer 90 were left off. Both have single-stack magazines and both feed reliably in any position or with any bullet profile you can imagine. The 202 comes in 375, 416 Remingon and 458 Lott. I'm not sure the 90 is still made but they and the Colt Sauer are essentially the same gun and available on the used market.

OTHER!

I have owned the following, all of which had problems requiring return to factory for adjustments:

Winchester Custom Shop Special Build Mdl. 70 .416Rem
Remington Custom Shop Mdl. 700 .416Rem
Remington Mdl. 700 .375RUM

The following have never required any adjustment nor service:
Ruger RSM .458Lott
Browning A-Bolt II .375H&H

My best friend bought a Remington Custom Shop 416 from his brother. The rifle wouldn't feed anything but spitzers. It was sent back to the Custom Shop by the brother, who returned it without any work because it "met specs". My friend was going to send it to a feeding specialist before his trip to Africa but after a few minutes of tinkering and de-burring the feed rails, he fixed it himself. I'm sure the Custom Shop can, on occasion, turn out a decent sporter but they didn't this time, either.

Empire 416 remington or slicked up mod 70 in same caliber

There is no way that you can guarantee that any factory rifle will feed FN solids. You will just have to try it and if it doesn't send it to a good gunsmith to make it feed them. But be warned that it may not then feed RN solids. Any of the ecustom guns you mentioned will feed FN bullets if you tell the gunsmith that is what you want.

465H&H

Ruger RSM. Got all three 375, 416 and 458 all work all the time and accurate too.

Blaser R 93.

They work out of the box, no Drama.

quote:

Originally posted by Charles_Helm:
Mrlexma -- between the two, would you pick the AHR-modded CZ or the Blaser? Even 500grains said the Blasers worked out of the box, but I am not sure I can see myself with one.

The Blaser only comes in two DG flavors, .375 H&H and .416 Rem. Mag. I have one set up as a .375 and it is a great rifle. My son is going to use it this summer in Namibia.

I will probably take my pre-64 Win. M70 custom in .375 as my light rifle.

For anything bigger than .416 Rem., I like the CZs, as worked over full house by AHR. I have a few of them, in .416 Rigby, .458 Lott and .500 A-Square.

They are big, but well-balanced, rifles, and are as good and strong as anything ever derived from Mauser's original design. And with AHR, you get a lot of bang for your buck - pun intended!

If I had to give them all up but one or two, I would have a tough time deciding among them!

Likewise, if I had to choose between the full house AHR CZ or the Blaser, I might have to flip a coin!

I have two Model 70 Winchesters classics a 416 and a 404. The 404 feeds Barnes flat nosed just fine and the 416 feeds NF flat nose fine. The 416 also feeds the TBSH solids fine but I think most rifles do. I also have Model 70 PF in 458 that will feed the new Hornady flat nose fine but again I think most rifles would.

I have a Sako AV 375 that will feed everything including flat nose solids fine.

The Win 404 and Sako AV were gunsmith built and the 416 is a custom shop model.

BigB

I voted full AHR upgrade, but if you just need a utility rifle and aren't worried about a pretty stock or whatever, just have AHR do the upgrades you need/want and go hunting. I love the CZ AHR modified for me.

Ruger M77 RSM chambered .416 Rigby

Absolutely NO feeding problems, Ruger No1 chambered .416 Rigby

quote:

Originally posted by mrlexma:

The Blaser only comes in two DG flavors, .375 H&H and .416 Rem. Mag.

MR, what about the 9.3X62? With a 286, 300, or 320 grain bullet I think it hangs right in there with the .375.

quote:

The Blaser only comes in two DG flavors, .375 H&H and .416 Rem. Mag.

Three flavors now with the .375 Blaser and probably more to come based on that case...

Yes, you guys are right.

9.3 is light for my tastes, although I would have no hesitation using it for the big cats.

I don't know much about the .375 Blaser round.

When it comes to .375s, I have tunnel vision and can only see or consider the H&H version!

quote:

I don't know much about the .375 Blaser round

Neither does anyone else ... it's an enigma at this point ...

I heard from one of my sources at the plant it's a rimless 700 nitro with a 45 degree shoulder necked to .375 ...

I don't know how they would feed FN's but I would consider the Sako 85 Kodiak in .375 H&H...


http://www.sako.fi/sako85models.php?kodiak

Ruger RSM

quote:

Originally posted by Macifej:
I heard from one of my sources at the plant it's a rimless 700 nitro with a 45 degree shoulder necked to .375 ...

Was that info conveyed over the phone? Or up close and personal where you could smell the Jaëgermeister on his breath . . .

Walter conspired with Blaser and Norma to steal Saeed's top secret .375/404 UAE brass and chamber specs.
Walter is the "genius" behind the .375 Blaser Magnum.
If I ever see one, I will have to have one, and it will be the first time I have stooped so low as a Blaser!

The Mauser (SIG) 450 Dakota that I have feeds the FN solids, believe it or not.
It works swell until I stuff 4 of the 500 Mbogos into the box.
Gets a little tight then, so I guess I will not rebarrel it to 500 Mbogo.

I would pick a Johannsen Magnum Mauser, with German Claw mounts, and an M-70-style safety, as "a best", in anything from .375 to .458.

It would be hard to beat a pre-64 Model 70. But the Ruger No. 1 Tropical or their custom Model 77 is right up there near the top as well.

Your poll is obviously oriented toward bolt guns but given that those specified imply a price ceiling something shy of $10K USD it seems to me the simplest way to get what you're asking for is to buy a Merkel double rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by nordrseta:
Your poll is obviously oriented toward bolt guns but given that those specified imply a price ceiling something shy of $10K USD it seems to me the simplest way to get what you're asking for is to buy a Merkel double rifle.

Just to be technical: Because the only good&cheap Merkel DRs are 470NE and 500NE, and that is not in the .375-.458 bracket.

I admit the Johannsen I have described might be $10,000.
But I did not see a dollar limit in the poll.
Most likely to be trouble free, fully functional, best fit and finish,
as reliable as it gets, "right out of the box":
You must pay for what you get,
one way or another.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:

MR, what about the 9.3X62? With a 286, 300, or 320 grain bullet I think it hangs right in there with the .375.[/QUOTE]..

From a velocity stand point and paper numbers the 62 is slow , but the 64 roars along as fast as the H&H can .. 285 gr bullets @ 2700 fps plus ...

[QUOTE]Or
Is there an answer?[/QUOTE)



Heym Express.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:

quote:

Originally posted by nordrseta:
seems to me the simplest way to get what you're asking for is to buy a Merkel double rifle.

Just to be technical: Because the only good & cheap Merkel DRs are 470NE and 500NE, and that is not in the .375-.458 bracket.

True enough, but a case can be made for a 470 being in the 458 "class" if not the precise caliber bracket. Likewise the 9.3x74R nips at the low end of 375 H&H performance.

quote:

Originally posted by mrlexma:

quote:

Originally posted by Macifej:
I heard from one of my sources at the plant it's a rimless 700 nitro with a 45 degree shoulder necked to .375 ...

Was that info conveyed over the phone? Or up close and personal where you could smell the Jaëgermeister Doornkaat on his breath . . .

I could smell it from here ...

If it's what it should be then a lot of us will buy one I'm sure ...

My Blaser R93 375 is the best gun i can think of. it is durable synthetic. the open sights is practical. the straight action is so fast that someone hearing it would think it is a semi automatic and the easy scope mount is perfect

Enough said!