Why a 600 grn bullet ?
I would think that the 535 grn solid should penetrate enough.
If you want speed try the Impala bullets they are 370 grn solid.

Cheers,

Andr�

PC, for maximums the 500 Jeffery case with a 600gn bullet would suggest 2600fps or so with good quality brass.



With Bertram, maybe 2350 going off the usual reduction (like for our 585 brass).



By the way they reckon 2400fps with the 440gn BP bullet is a smasher on light stuff.



Karl.

I purchased some 570 gr barnes X bullets, but since I haven't had time to put the second recoil lug on the barrel, and make a new stock, I haven't tested them. I don't see any reason why from a 24-26 inch barrel a 570 or 600 gr bullet couldn't be driven 2400 fps. I did load some 600 gr cast bullets over 100 gr Varget and they clocked 2200 fps from my 25" 500J. I consider 100 gr of Varget or RL 15 as starting loads.

I don't know about optimum bullet weight in the Jeffrey. I really have a hard time believing a properly constructed 535, 570 or 600 gr 50 cal bullet @2200-2400 fps would fail to decisively and effectively kill any game animal with proper shot placement.

That's another one of the beauties of big guns, you can't choose a bad bullet weight, cause all of them make big holes and drive deep, some just go deeper than others. If I was hunting elephants I'd probably go with 600 gr, but any lesser species I wouldn't be concerned with bullet weight.

As I quoted in a recent post on another thread here - I have experienced the 570gr Woodleigh solid at 2200fps from my 23" barrel shooting through broadside on a non trophy elephant bull. The amount of penetration achieved from this load is "sufficient" and with my 23" barrel [built for ease of use in the jess] I would not see any advantage in trying to drive 600 grainers.
APB

Folks,

thanks for the advice thus far....I am having a .404 Jeffrey built and when that was doen I was wondering wether I wanted to begin a .500 Jeffrey to be it's brother....although I would probably choose a magnum action for the .500 J rather than the M98, because some have speculated that the M98 is "not up to task" for the .404 J so maybe the 500 J is stretching the friendship.

I was also thinking that the 400 gr bullet for the 404J and then the 600 gr for the 500 J would make a great medium and heavy pair.

Just my ramblings and all adivice and help is appreciated.

Thanks Karl,

as usual there are more hair brain gun ideas running through my head, something like the .500 J has charisma...all the African histroy etc. power levels approaching our .585's and reduced weight thus more portable. Makes for an attractive package I reckon.

Karl,

Quote:

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2400fps with the 440gn BP bullet is a smasher

---

Oh I just bet they smash real good at that MV! @ 2250 fps Barnes 450 gr Originals grenade (literally explode) on impact with cedar logs, penetration is less than a few inches. I assume the Woodleigh's would perform in a similar manner. Should be a most excellent ground hog load.

Not too sure about 2600 fps and a 600 gr pill even with "good" brass. There are other things working against you to limit the maximum muzzle velocity. Of course I am assuming a Mauser style action. I would think that a more practical limit would be 2530 fps or so. I hope you like buying/making stocks!

ASS_CLOWN

Pc, here's some more input to torture ourselves with.

The 500J main reason would be its pedigree I reckon.As Mitch carters data shows his 500 A-square hit 2600fps with 600gn bullets,more than enough and a lot more practical (and more powerful than the 500J without good brass).



Also the 550 RNS off the weatherby case will have better and cheaper brass than the 500J and more power.



500jeffery is the 'proper' hunting calibre though but for another classic have you thought about the 505 Gibbs if it comes out in the CZ550? Ready to use,just as posh as the 500J with a twist more of "fucking the prom queen" status since it was always more difficult to accomodate.



Power levels with good brass knocking at the 585's door.

Anyone making the 510 bullets generally has 505 as well and I think woodleigh is into the new 600gn too.



Karl.

Karl,

choices are endless.....I do have one "1980's Billy Ray Cyrus tasteless round with no class or history" in the .585 Nyati, thats why the A2 etc don't hold much appeal to me, I reckon the .585 Nyati has more charm than the .500 A2.

Your right the Gibbs is a cool round just don't want the small rim of metal on the bolt issue that you have with the Nyati.....rather the rebated rim issues and have them worked out.....

Karl
Even with extreme length barrel and similar extreme pressures a 600gr at 2600fps?!- I would not shoot this load and it would not be the recoil I was worried about.
Thing would have to have 35" barrel and be on the verge of coming apart. You are talking performance not that far from BMG [750gr at 2750fps] which uses 2.5 times more powder than 500J?
Apart from that should these results be achieved - for what reason? Seems like a horsepower race to me!
Remember the main reason the .460WM is so disliked in Africa is the velocity [in 2600fps and up] exceeds the best performance envelope for deep penetration whilst maintaining the integrity of the projectiles path within the prey.
These calibers are meant for DG and as such must perform with solids.
let me know if you are ever going to touch one of these loads off so I can be a looooong way away!
APB

PC,
Billy ray cyrus round.

If you go for the 'classic calibre' beware the next evolution can be 'classic ballistics'......

Of course if you have a jeffery or gibbs built you can run it over 2600fps with a 600gn bullet for an occasional shot,and then hunt with the 'real deal'. I think Huntingtons in the US has horneber's brass as a stock item.

Hey what about your own calibre mate? The 408 chey tac with the toughest brass of all is just begging to be necked up. Let me know if you do this and I will buy one too.

Karl.

PC & Karl,



Since you guys are "power hungry" this is real data I got off my 500 AHR. I was "wanting" to get 9000 lb-ft out of it (this was a little low "safety check" load ME ~ 8700 lb-ft).



Bertram brass

CCI250 primer

600 gr Woodleigh PPSP

130.7 grains of IMR4350

Muzzle velocity = 2579 fps



The bolt was stuck and good, I did manage to twist it open by hand though. The case head DID NOT expand, it was the same size after as it was before!!! The Pressure Ring Expansion (PRE) was 0.0019" +/-. < !--color--> The pressure according to the software similation was 58,500 psi. The pressure based upon PRE measurements would is at LEAST 62,000 psi , I BELIEVE THE PRE more than the simulation! < !--color--> The bolt lift was EASY until the extractor engaged the rim, at which time it required MONDO torque to lift the bolt.



The moral of the story . . . PRE of 0.0017" < !--color--> should be considered a SAFE maximum load REGARDLESS OF PRESSURE! The reason is barrel shank stress levels. Running up to the levels that I did routinely will QUICKLY fatigue out the barrel leading to a potential catastrophic failure (read barrel explosion). My rifle is based upon a CZ550. IF you want to go to these levels, GET a BIGGER action with a LARGER BARREL THREAD SIZE!! It is the Wise/ Smart / live long, thing to do anyway. I could run some numbers to make sure, but I would suspect that a barrel thread of 1.25" X 16 TPI should suffice (again I would need to run the stress calculations to be SURE).





I did not go up from there, but to get to 2600 fps +/- (should be a little plus) 132 grains of IMR4350 will get you there (you get about 25 fps per grain of IMR4350) You Aussie powder, which we call H4350 here in the States, seems to be a tad slower so you may need a 0.5 gr or so more.



By the way, that will be approximately a FULL case of powder in the 500 Jeffery.



I would not recommend going to the next faster powder as you will hit MUCH higher pressures for the same muzzle velocity (and 58,500 psi is MIGHTY high already for a Peak Average).



Oh yeah, the recoil was AWESOME (rifle only weighs 10.5 lbs). My shoulder, upper chest, and upper arm went NUMB, and the fingers of my right hand (trigger hand) were tingling for about 2 or 3 minutes after the shot! Of course that level of recoil should not bother you two guys. Afterall shooting those 650 gr bullets at better than 2450 fps in your 585s should have MORE than conditioned you guys!



ASS_CLOWN