I recently moved 1000 miles away and most of my shooting equipment is in storage. This past Wednesday I went to a very nice shooting range however the concrete table and chair were to low for my 6’4” frame. My body was so contorted trying to fit the bench I ended up with my first magnum eyebrow ever. I need to get a adjustable rifle rest and a tall rear owls ear bag. What rifle rest do you guys use for your big bore bench shooting? Are the Sinclair or Protector aluminum models sturdy enough for the big bores or do I need a heavier cast iron front rest? I am needing to site in two new big bore rifles with scopes and need a rock solid foundation. Also would you know the model of the leather Protektor rear owls ear bag with the solid bottom that is tall enough to keep the rifle level with the front rifle rest? Also, anyone with a extra rifle rest or one you are not using that you would sell feel free to PM me.Thanks

I use a Lead Sled. I don't use any weight on the sled, it works fine as is. If still to low, you could always set it on bricks or something similar.

I don't shoot my 500 Jeffery from the bench much. When I do I use a lead sled with 35 lbs of weight. I know it puts the stock and potentially the scope at risk, but I only so it for load development which I'm pretty much done with. I sight in from the bench without it. Then verify offhand, kneeling and sitting.

I use a Lead Sled with 75lbs of shot on it.

MTM shoulder guard

Just sandbags.

Lane, that MTM Shoulder Guard looks like a simple, affordable solution.
4WD, I think this has come up before, but the chaps that test the big doubles for Holland and Holland and such use a shooting stand at shoulder height, so they are essentially shooting braced, offhand.

I have the same problem at my club range. Since I cannot raise the benches I built a short stool to lower my bottom That allows my body to be upright at the bench.

Thanks for the replies. The Lead Sled seems to have had a few instances of cracked stocks.

The range I go to has a solid steel front rest with a screw on top that adjusts for height.I used to use sand bags for the rear rest until one slipped off my shoulder while I was shooting my Lott at full power.The rifle kicked back and nearly broke my clavicle.That was really painfull.It was the last time I used sand bags.I bought a Protector rear bag with a flat solid bottom and it is great and worth the money.
I am now looking at Sinclair for a front rest-something like an all purpose cast iron model.I have not bought one yet because I get by with the ones at the range and because of the idea of lugging that weight in my shooting bag.One day I might just buy one.

This model interest me.I think it is made of stainless steel but I am not sure.
I figure that if I spend the money for one it would be a good one.The one pictured costs around 300.I feel that although expensive your are getting something solid for that money.
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Lead Sled, but only with new gun or testing new loads. Most big bore shooting is off hand.

quote:

Originally posted by 4WD:
Thanks for the replies. The Lead Sled seems to have had a few instances of cracked stocks.

I worked up loads for big doubles and big bore bolt-actions for a while with Lead-Sled without issues. Then a good rifleman friend of mine cracked a stock on one.

I switched to the MTM for this purpose. The MTM does as good of a job at mitigating recoil but due to its construction...is way less rigid...I believe to be completely safe for the purpose. They are sturdy too...been working up loads on mine for big-bores for a decade now...still in good shape.

quote:

Originally posted by 4WD:
Thanks for the replies. The Lead Sled seems to have had a few instances of cracked stocks.

The lead sled works fine if you use it right for the really big guys. I routinely use mine for my 600's. I use 25lbs of shot and 2" of Styrofoam in the recoil pocket. Let the stock move and you're fine. I ruptured the counter-coil hydro stock on my SSK #1 shooting offhand w/o the rest. Using this method with the rest, I've shot hundreds of rounds with it with zero issues.

Thanks for the tip on the Styrofoam!

458 WM and Lott, 470 double.

Just sand bags for load development. A 1/2 filled sand bag over my shoulder.
I have had my loads developed where I want them for years in the guns. Have had little reason to go check them again. They have not moved.
the Lott and 470 are open sighted.
The 458WM wears a 1.5 X 5 Leupold.
Not real sure I require more gun.

EZ

"The Rock BR" front rest by Caldwell,
and a couple of "Champion" 3-piece sandbags.
One of the Champions is un-bundled and draped over the top of The Rock BR which is adjusted low and locked.
The rear rest is made from the second Champion bundled as shown, with its Velcro fasteners, and a block of wood or a whatever-is-handy,
as a height adjustment under the rear rest.

The high-density foam rubber blocks are used as elbow pads on the concrete bench top.

A sissy pad may be used between the rifle butt and shoulder, anything from a folded up towel to a 25-pound bag of birdshot.

Seat height can be changed,
front rest height adjustment is mechanical from The Rock BR,
and rear rest height is adjustable by what spacer the rear Champion is sitting on.

I have used various benchrest setups over the last 30 years, and I like this one best.
It all goes into a heavy-duty, plastic tote, that can also serve as a low seat, with a boat cushion on top of it.
A custom made, solidly built, wooden box with lid would be the cat's meow for lugging it all around.

That old Bushnell spotting scope has been with me all along.

Rip ...

Bull bag.

Used it this morning shooting the 450 Dakota.

I ended up with the Sinclair light weight rest from Brownell’s and a couple of Protektor bags. They have worked out perfect and the quality is very high.

I use sandbags and what I call a "poor mans lead sled." A 25 lb bag of shot wrapped in duck tape and used as a sissy bag between the butt of the gun and my shoulder.

Almost 50 years ago, in 1971, I paid a visit to the Krieghoff factory in New Ulm, Germany. There I came into contact for the first time with a "Preuß Gerät", which was being used to test newly manufactured weapons and others which had been sent in for repair. I was so taken with the idea that when I came back home I cobbled together a crude device which served the same purpose, a sort of primitive "lead sled". I used it for years to develop loads for and sight in my big bores, until I acquired the more sophisticated Caldwell Lead Sled, which I still use.

I have been using these devices for all that time and have never experienced the slightest damage to a rifle stock. The secret, in my opinion, is to make sure that the butt of the rifle is in firm contact with the vertical part of the rear support, which is in turn in firm contact with the shooter's shoulder, assuring that the rifle and the device recoil as one unit, rather than allowing the butt of the rifle to impact on the rear support.

Pictured below is the "Preuß Gerät", which I first encountered in 1971.

The German text reads" Adjustment and Shooting Device of the Preuss System. Made in the fashion of the former Institute of Shooting Technology. This well known shooting device was improved so that in the pictured version it is well suited for adjusting the sights and shooting groups. Someone who is experienced in sighting in and is a good rifle shot can determine the actual capability of a weapon perfectly. Made by the firm of A. Kind."




This is my crude version of the same device, which I made shortly afterwards, with the help of my life long friend, an experienced welder, who turned a length of channel iron into the rear rest for me.

I've been using the Lead Sled for 10 years or more and had no issues with it. That included several big bore's and even doubles up to 577 NE.

Fast forward to this spring while getting ready for safari. Just wanting to confirm my handloads are still shooting correctly, I fired my CZ 416 Rigby in the sled.

After the third shot, I noticed the stock had fractured vertically about 1/2" in front of the recoil pad. The fracture was all the way through and ran from the bottom about 2/3rds all the way to the top of the stock.

At the time, I had one 25 lb of shot on the sled and always made sure the butt was firm against the recoil pocket.

No more sled for me.

When I was toying with the 12gaFromHell 3.85" with 1400-grain slug at 1800 fps,
I had the bright idea of making a 50-pound set of saddle bags to drape over my right shoulder as a recoil absorber,
one 25-pound bag of shot on each side of the shooting shoulder, for offhand shooting or standing rest use.
It did not go well.

Inertia of that rear bag is like leaning your back against a tree trunk for a shot with a turkey load.
I still have two 25-pound bags of Lawrence Magnum No. 7-1/2 shot wrapped in duct tape.
I will be using it for shot shells or melted into alloy for cast bullets.

Rip ...

Lead sled with 50# lead. Sparingly. For load development and sight in only. It isn’t for practice.
No issues with 416 and 375. Yet.
I see no point in it for a double, that from a standing rest with a good shoulder pad.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
When I was toying with the 12gaFromHell 3.85" with 1400-grain slug at 1800 fps,
I had the bright idea of making a 50-pound set of saddle bags to drape over my right shoulder as a recoil absorber,
one 25-pound bag of shot on each side of the shooting shoulder, for offhand shooting or standing rest use.
It did not go well.

Inertia of that rear bag is like leaning your back against a tree trunk for a shot with a turkey load.
I still have two 25-pound bags of Lawrence Magnum No. 7-1/2 shot wrapped in duct tape.
I will be using it for shot shells or melted into alloy for cast bullets.

Rip ...

RIP, so how many shots did it take you to decide it wasn't working? It took me 21 shots from my 500 Jeffery (the last six were 570g at just over 2500 fps) in a T-Shirt from the bench to convince me to get more padding. I was determined to get my load development done. I bought a lead sled the next week. I think you've seen this pic before.

Used to use a lead sled without any extra weight until the guys here started saying the thing was risking my rifle stocks (I haven't had a problem, but...)

Now I am using a fancier Sinclair front rest with sandbags.

The double, I just shoot off sticks like hunting- but I suspect my zero is not that great.

Otherwise, I don't really shoot what most here call big guns. .50 BMG is the biggest, and that has a brake (Barrett M82A1), otherwise .470, .458, .416 is the big stuff for me.

For the hard kickers on my bench I stack up sand bags fairly high so I am sitting up fairly straight rather than crouching over or leaning into the rifle as you do with a short stack of bags.
I find my body rolls with the recoil better.
I also switch off to a light rifle like a .223 in the middle of big bore bench sessions.
Keeps me shooting smaller groups.

Posting for D'Arcy Echols....



When I was still building heavy caliber rifles toward the end of that madness I began using two methods for anything over 40 caliber. One was this standing bench and it works very well. Here a client has flown in to test loads and regulate the sights on his Classic 505 before it was finished. This allows you two roll with the recoil upright and is very steady, it seems the last 50 yard 3 shot group recipe has piqued his interest "How many grains of powder was that” ? 







The other rest is made of an aluminum “Keel “ with the Hart tripod bolted to the keel. It weighs JUST ENOUGH  so as to not allow a wooden stock, if properly bedded to break. At least Ive never broken one to date. Again, very steadying better suited for those that want to shoot sitting down. This client is testing a Trijicon RMR that has just been installed on his Legend 458 Lott. 

Well for initial sight in I still use my lead sled with 25 lbs for my 500 Jeffery. At that weight it rises about 3" off the bench and moves back as much. Knocks my ear protection off with each shot lol I should have my sons take a video. After that I sight it in the old fashioned way with just a rest off of a bench and then practice off hand and kneeling with a sling.

When I was taking Physics in high school, my teacher staged a little demonstration using a six inch square iron plate and an egg. He placed the egg on top of the plate and dropped the plate from shoulder height to the floor. The egg burst from the impact.

He then took the same plate and this time taped an egg to it, so that it remained tightly secured to the plate. He then dropped it from the same height and this time the egg remained intact.

I always think of this demonstration when shooting off my lead sled.

Mistyped meant 3" lol

Lead sled. Use 25 or 50 lbs of shot for heavier recoil rifles.

"RIP, so how many shots did it take you to decide it wasn't working?"

chuck375,

Just one shot with the 12GaFH and the 50-pound saddlebags draped over my shootin' shoulder was all it took.
I ain't stupid.

Rip ...

Ive used the Lead sled for many years and I have split the stock on one of my English double rifles and on a skinny 375X9.3x62..With too much lead I suppose, and they were strapped down...Ive know others who have split their stocks on a Lead sled for whatever reason, but I don't use lead on mine anymore and it works fine, even strapped down....

Over the years Ive used many rests for big bores, Our range today has Tel. post uprights and I nail a 2x4 wit a brace cover the 2x4 with a saddle blanket and shoot off hand with the 2x4 as the forend rest, it sure works best so far..at any rate the big bores are not easy to shoot by any means..Most folks would be much better off with a 9.3x62, or 64 or a .375 H&H all of which are good buffalo and all DG medicine. but they require proper bullet placement, which brings to mind the first double in 700 N.E. wounded and lost the first elephant shot with it..Additionally this is a stand on your hind legs and shoot, you then roll with the punch and it makes a hell of a difference, something the English learned a 100 years of so ago..

My range has 2x12s that can be stacked for height.

I don’t generally need to do that - I’m six feet tall - so I just adjust my Lyman front rest high enough to get me upright. The rear rest is what I find needs some help with elevation.


I just stick a jointed, two thickness cheater pad under it and use the thin pad for “recoil control.”

quote:

Originally posted by xausa:
Almost 50 years ago, in 1971, I paid a visit to the Krieghoff factory in New Ulm, Germany. There I came into contact for the first time with a "Preuß Gerät", which was being used to test newly manufactured weapons and others which had been sent in for repair. I was so taken with the idea that when I came back home I cobbled together a crude device which served the same purpose, a sort of primitive "lead sled". I used it for years to develop loads for and sight in my big bores, until I acquired the more sophisticated Caldwell Lead Sled, which I still use.

I have been using these devices for all that time and have never experienced the slightest damage to a rifle stock. The secret, in my opinion, is to make sure that the butt of the rifle is in firm contact with the vertical part of the rear support, which is in turn in firm contact with the shooter's shoulder, assuring that the rifle and the device recoil as one unit, rather than allowing the butt of the rifle to impact on the rear support.

Pictured below is the "Preuß Gerät", which I first encountered in 1971.

The German text reads" Adjustment and Shooting Device of the Preuss System. Made in the fashion of the former Institute of Shooting Technology. This well known shooting device was improved so that in the pictured version it is well suited for adjusting the sights and shooting groups. Someone who is experienced in sighting in and is a good rifle shot can determine the actual capability of a weapon perfectly. Made by the firm of A. Kind."




This is my crude version of the same device, which I made shortly afterwards, with the help of my life long friend, an experienced welder, who turned a length of channel iron into the rear rest for me.

That's interesting, xausa, as I see no provision for absorbing energy other than the butt padding.

I made a Lead Sled substitute, which is also one of a kind . It looks like a heavy, steel skate board with a large bracket at the back, on which I attached a slip-on recoil pad. I made additional recoil mitigation such as a spring-loaded weight on a rope running over a pulley roller but never even got around to adding any lead. The bare skateboard worked for a start but, with a wind-up rest on the front, was heavy enough to split the cheesy stock on a Zastava 300 Win mag, so I haven't used it since.

So, something has to give and the safest thing for the rifle is the shooter's shoulder.

I would say a front rest with owl-ear sandbag makes sense, to save big rifles jumping off flat bags if you don't hold the fore end.

A sandbag does under the butt and I am very happy with a thin gel bag taped to some white, grainy closed-cell packaging foam behind the recoil pad. With this arrangement, turned sideways so it curls around the recoil pad, the 338WM has become a pussy, as long as I keep my eye back from the scope.

For elephant guns, resting my fore-arms or elbows on a standing rest is the go. Not only because it helps a double rifle to shoot as regulated but a standing body absorbs recoil more pleasantly than a sitting one. If you can't be bothered making a standing rest, a heavy box (even cardboard) upturned on a benchrest can be a good place to start.

quote:

Originally posted by sambarman338:
Pictured below is the "Preuß Gerät", which I first encountered in 1971.




This is my crude version of the same device, which I made shortly afterwards, with the help of my life long friend, an experienced welder, who turned a length of channel iron into the rear rest for me.

quote:

I made a Lead Sled substitute, which is also one of a kind . It looks like a heavy, steel skate board with a large bracket at the back, on which I attached a slip-on recoil pad. I made additional recoil mitigation such as a spring-loaded weight on a rope running over a pulley roller but never even got around to adding any lead. The bare skateboard worked for a start but, with a wind-up rest on the front, was heavy enough to split the cheesy stock on a Zastava 300 Win mag, so I haven't used it since.

So, something has to give and the safest thing for the rifle is the shooter's shoulder.

I would say a front rest with owl-ear sandbag makes sense, to save big rifles jumping off flat bags if you don't hold the fore end.

A sandbag does under the butt and I am very happy with a thin gel bag taped to some white, grainy closed-cell packaging foam behind the recoil pad. With this arrangement, turned sideways so it curls around the recoil pad, the 338WM has become a pussy, as long as I keep my eye back from the scope.
For elephant guns, resting my fore-arms or elbows on a standing rest is the go. Not only because it helps a double rifle to shoot as regulated but a standing body absorbs recoil more pleasantly than a sitting one. If you can't be bothered making a standing rest, a heavy box (even cardboard) upturned on a benchrest can be a good place to start.

I noticed that the firearm in that factory picture is a drilling, and that means the recoil of that rifle barrel will work fine because it recoils like a single barrel rifle of any type. That means the drilling recoils UP, and to the rear. So that would work quite well with any single barrel firearm. Still, I would like to hold the forearm in my hand with my hand resting on a cushion so the rifle would recoil like it would with the rifle being fired from the shoulder so the recoil would be same as when shooting off hand.


I notice the rig you fashioned is, IMO, far better than the factory rig for working with a double rifle. Still I would hold the forefend in my hand so the rifle could recoil naturally.
A double rifle fires causing the barrel being fired to recoil UP, and away from the other barrel, no matter which barrel is being fired. This UP, and AWAY from the other barrel must not be hindered or regulation will suffer less natural movement to cause the BARREL TIME to be retarded more than when the same rifle being fired from the shooter's hands.

Your rig allows you to hold the rifle fore stock in your hand, while being rested on a sand bag, with the bag behind the butt plate retarding the felt recoil. This works fine for a double rifle.

In the case of using your rest will work better for a double rifle than the one used by the factory unless when he is sighting a double rifle he holds the for-end in his hand resting on a pad, so the double rifle can recoil naturally to not interfere with regulation.

Just my opinion not an order to anyone to take it seriously. However I will not shoot one of my doubles in a lead sled! I do own one of the fixtures shown in Ledvm,s post (MTM) but I still rest the for-end on my hand to shoot my doubles!
…………………………………..OPINION! everybody has one, the above is mine! MAC

I agree, don't shoot a double or a big bore on a lead sled, I ruined a stock on my 450-400, fortunately I carefully rebuilt the inside with glass and its held for the last 15 years until I finally restocked it and sold it recently..I have added sponge to the rear of the lead sled, I use no lead and strap the forend in just enough to keep it from bouncing out and the 338, 9.3x62 and a couple of session with the 375 H&H is about its limit IMO..

M

quote:

Originally posted by BuffHunter63:
Just sandbags.

quote:

Originally posted by gbs:
I have the same problem at my club range. Since I cannot raise the benches I built a short stool to lower my bottom That allows my body to be upright at the bench.

Put two seats atop the bench, place usual rests on that and shoot standing up. PAST bag, double ear protection -- I flinch more for sound than "the hit". Nothing above a .416 Rigby for me now, though...

My opinion:

For medium bore rifles with rifle scopes, it is nice to have good rifle shooting rest to precisely sight in the rifle.

But I remember how I did with my 375 H&H: from the roof of car with just some quilt or winter coats over that and laying on the ground with the same stuff under the rifle. At 100 m the hits touched each other.

This is "target shooting" with .585 Hubel Express with all that necessary fancy stuff without shooting big bores is not even possible (Yeti cooler and jacket):

(my friends are NOT experienced big bore shooters)

Friend #1
Friend #2

But it was just mild load - 650gr bullet at 1900 fps. You can sight in the rifle with reasonable load and verify that standing offhand or from the roof of the car or whatever "tall rest". Yes, it is that easy.

Jiri