After much soul searching I have decided to avoid another wildcat round due to the expense of reloading dies and resell value. Being Left Handed my choices are slim. I plan on building a 458 Lott and I have narrowed my choices to two actions. They are either the stainless Montana or I will take my new W 70 375 H&H apart and use the action from that. Montana barreled actions retail for $900 and if I go that route I can use my factory Safari stock. I like the fact I can go completely stainless with the Montana. I heard others complain about the weight of the Montana but on a rifle I expect to weigh 9.5 pounds or so that is a non issue. I am concered it may take a lot more work to inlet the Montana into the factory Safari style stock. Whichever action is chosen feeding is the most important function. Opinions are appreciated.

On a rifle like the Lott the extra weight can be a benefit; it's the short actions I ususally caution people about. I think an MRC would make a great Lott.

I think if you check with Montanna you'll find your Winchester stock is not a drop-in, though. It takes more than a little work to make them fit. Serengeti has some reasonable wood drop-ins but the barrel channel will probably need opening.

If you tell McMillan what you want they can inlet any of their appropriate Winchester stocks to fit the Montana action.

Tigger,
Thanks for the comments. I am trying to keep my costs down thats the reason for using the existing Safari stock. Would you pick either action over the other?

As you know, I am left-handed, too. I think you must ask yourself, "Do I really need a .458 Lott?"

It's a fine round and all, but will you ever have occasion to use it on dangerous game?

If you are never going to hunt elephants, Cape buffalo, rhino, and hippo on a regular basis, I propose to you that a .458 Win. Mag. will do well enough for your occasional needs, as long as it is set up correctly.

On the other hand, if you doexpect to hunt thick-skinned DG regularly, then trying to go 'cheap' will just not do.

George

Caliber selction is a different point all together. If I chose one over the other I still have my action choices narrowed to the two I mentioned. Keeping my costs down doesnt actually mean "cheap". I wouldnt be losing a thing in durability in staying with the factory Winchester stock over a McMillan after I glass bed it. Do I need this rifle? Heavens no. I want it. It is nice we have this many options. But it will perform back up for my wife, son, and other hunting partners against brown bears. And it is just as easy to load it lower if I wanted 458 velocities.
Besides, as much as I buy,build and sell, it will be way easier to convince someone the Lott has more power than they need than try to say the 458 is as good as. But I still value your opinion. Thank you.

quote:

Originally posted by Snowwolfe:
Tigger,
Thanks for the comments. I am trying to keep my costs down thats the reason for using the existing Safari stock. Would you pick either action over the other?

I don't know enough about either to say one or the other is better with the exception that the MRC usually needs less truing if you want to blueprint it. Everyone I know that has a stainless likes it.

OTOH, Winchester is the more recognised name and might hold value better, all else equal. When a good one comes out of their plant it is a good rifle.

If you have an existing Winchester you're willing to strip then the argument would be settled for me. Have it barreled at Pac-Nor to your existing contour if its heavy enough and reinstall the existing sights.

quote:

Originally posted by Snowwolfe:
Caliber selction is a different point all together. If I chose one over the other I still have my action choices narrowed to the two I mentioned.

Agreed, but a LH .300 Win. Mag. donor rifle will be easier to locate than a LH .375H&H. I hate to say it, but you could even find a LH Ruger Mark II (CRF) to use for a .458 Win. Mag.

George

Except that he already has the 375 Winchester. In his first post he indicated stripping that was one of two options.

I'd keep the 375 as is, buy the MRC action and have a blast.

How many people "need" a Lott? ....... Everyone who wants one!

Ah to confuse the issue even further I also have a NIB W70 Left handed in 7mm mag. But that may be for another project. The LH W70 can always be sold as kept as a spare whatever.
For $900 MRC will sell a stainless barrled action in 458 Lott. And now you guys have me thinking Mcmillan. Add $750 for the bedded syn stock and I have $1650 into the project before deciding if it needs blueprinting.
As a general rule does the MRC need to be blueprinted? Would I be sacrificng any quality by using the MRC over the Win? My first choice is to stay with stainless if it equals out.

No, they don't need blueprinting. One of their more popular characteristics is the fact that they come from MRC square and true. Every 'smith that has commented on them here on the forums has bragged about that.

What people sometimes don't like is that some early ones were overpolished and a little "wavy". The other comment made is they seem rough to people used to custom finished actions. It's simply that some surfaces like the bolt raceways are left "as cast" to keep cost down. About an hour with the right stones will smooth them up but so will 200 rounds or so. The castings are made by Ruger so you know they are good.

I have 2 CM short actions and like them just fine.

I put together a CM Left Handed 416 Rem Mag with a Kreiger barrel and Mcmillan stock. The gun ended up weighing 9 1/2 lb. with a Leupold 1.75X6 in Talley mounts. The gunsmith checked out the action, did a small amount of blueprinting but only because he wanted too. According to him the Montana actions he has fooled with have been close to perfect out of the box.

Thanks folks. I am leaning towards buying the Montanna. Should I purchase the barrel they offer or chose another brand? Keep the comments coming.

I haven't bought one of their barrels but that is their core business. People who have bought them seem to regard them highly. Very reasonably priced and lapped, IIRC.

quote:

Originally posted by Snowwolfe:
Caliber selction is a different point all together. If I chose one over the other I still have my action choices narrowed to the two I mentioned.

Butch Searcy was selling some left-handed double square bridge Mauser actions suitable for big cartridges a while back. Not cheap. Dakota does too. About $2000 for 375 length and $2500 for up to 505 Gibbs sized. The ones Searcy had were in that ballpark pricewise if I remember correctly.

H. C.

I am sure they are nice but I can put together a nice rifle for less than that. This will be a hunting rifle in wet conditions. Not a safe queen.

I had my left-handed 375HH Model 70 rebarreled to 416 Remington by Mark Penrod. Outstanding job. I used it to "clap" a buffalo in Zimbabwe in May 05. I went through the whole "Montana" action decision as well. I made the right choice for me. It has a Krieger barrel and shoots 400g Barnes solids and 400g Triple shocks both under an inch at 100. I had to fiddle with powder charges (2.2 less grains for the solids) to get them to shoot to the same impact point, but am happy as can be.

A lot of the left-handed Model 70 actions need "work" to make them function well as a DG rifle. Mark and Talley machined a custom rear scope base in order to have it align with the front base, because the receiver was "off" from the factory.

I also considered a 458 Lott as well. I decided on the 416 because it shoots a lot flatter and can be used for plains game as well. You are a lot more limited with a 458 Lott, but if that is what blows up your skirt, go for it. My buddy Richard had a left handed 458 Lott built on the Montana action, and absolutely flattened a buffalo cow, a giraffe, and a zebra with it. He also shot a female tuskless elephant with it.

Jeff

The 416 is a VERY close second choice. I already have a Remington 700 .416 in LH from there custom shop in stainless which I never shot. But this time I want the W70 fail proof trigger design so I wont have any potential problems with ice in our cold contitions.
BTW, the Rem is for sale is anyone is interested.

For a 'one-gun' safari, a .404 or .416 is a fine choice.

I always bring two guns; either a .30-06 and a .375H&H, or a .375H&H and a .470 Capstick.

George

Ok, I am down to pinch time. I plan on going with the stainless Montana action. Should I stay with the stainless barrel they offer for the additional $380? Or would I be better off with Pac Nor? Montana also offers to lap the lugs for $25 and to true the action for ( I think ) $45? Are these services worth it? Or is the action good enough as is?

Snowwolfe,
I would give Larry a call at Serengetti Rifles. He works a lot with the MRC action and his prices are similar to the factory. I think the quality of his work is much better.


R

Snowwolfe,

Good choice! I think you'll get a lot more versatility with a .416 than a .458. The rifle can be built a bit lighter, so humping it around the boonies will be easier.

Before you get the bolt lugs lapped and the action trued, find out if the action they are going to use requires that work.

As for using an MRC barrel versus a Pac-Nor, the costs are probably similar, but Pac-Nor may have a different lead time than MRC. In other words, using the MRC barrel may shorten the barreled action's delivery time.
Ask MRC if the bores of their .416 barrels are lapped.

George

quote:

Originally posted by Snowwolfe:
Ok, I am down to pinch time. I changed my mind and decided to go with the 416 Rem Mag. I plan on going with the stainless Montana action. Should I stay with the stainless barrel they offer for the additional $380? Or would I be better off with Pac Nor? Montana also offers to lap the lugs for $25 and to true the action for ( I think ) $45? Are these services worth it? Or is the action good enough as is?

I think in a general hunting rifle they are ready-to-go without spending another $70 to gain 2%-5% more accuracy that will be invisible in the field. We've already established that they are very good in this regard as they come out the door.

I placed the order today for a stainless 416 Rem mag left handed with 22 in tube. Barrel contour #5. Going to send it to McMillan after I receive it and have them do the bedding and stock work. Since my conversion to Winchesters I have to trust others on larger projects till I gain more confidence working on them. For under 2k (by the time I add sights )I should have a reliable weather proof bear stopper and an all around big bore toy. Thanks for those who contributed some good advice.

Best wishes for your new project! Keep us posted.

yeah-- you made the right move. As hard as it is to find a LH Mod. 70 in .375 H&H, I'd say leave that one alone. I used a .30-06 to make my LH Lott. No guilt over that conversion.

What did it cost to have the conversion done?

I like your choices Snowwolfe.I too am currently having the exact rifle made. LH .416 Rem. MR Stainless action and bbl, mcbros stock, NECG sights and bbl band stud, Talley rings and mounts. But I think I'm going with a 20"bbl.(comments on the bbl length, any one?)
P.S. I sent you a message about not buying your LH Remington, but I guess you didnt get it, I talked to my buddy, and it would be over a year before I received it.

I would think twice before settling on a 20 inch barrel on a .416 of any type. I think muzzle blast and barrel whip will be at least "unpleasant". A 22 or 23 inch barrel still makes for a handy, well ballanced weapon without as much of the unpleasant effects.

Geronimo

Its ok Cfm, the 416 LH Rem sold on Gunbrokers.

I was going to suggest you sent the rifle directly to Serengeti as they are in the same town so no shipping cost. Get their Serengeti treatment (Action smoothing,trigger adjustment, drill and tap the scope bases for 8-40 screws. They can install New England sites. They sell quick release Tally rings and bases and you can have it Serecoted if you want. My barrel in my 376 Steyr on the short action is a #4 at 23 inches. I think you will be happy with the Montana barrel. Your long action weight 44 ozs I think but that #5 barrel is advertised at 5# mabe a little less at 22 inches thats why I went with the #4. I think you rifle may weigh over 10 lbs.

Montana will not do a 416 Rem on anything smaller than a number 5 contour. What does Serengeti charge for that package?

I have built a .458 Lott and a .375 H&H on Montana Stainless actions, I had I.T.& D barrel then with douglas barrels and am very satisfied with them. The Lott has a muzzle brake on it, removeable with a muzzle cap. The Lott has a Mcmillin stock CNC inletted which I then bedded with J.B. Weld. I like J.B. and have bedded a number of rifles with it. The .458 has a lot going for it , it is reasonable to reload for a truly big bore, and provides some serious practice with the 400 gr. Remington bulk bullets. Practice is everything with the big boomers.

What is everyones opinion of the Montana barrels? I have heard that is their main business, but I would like to know about the accuracy and quality.

quote:

Originally posted by George Wood:
I have built a .458 Lott and a .375 H&H on Montana Stainless actions, I had I.T.& D barrel then with douglas barrels and am very satisfied with them. The Lott has a muzzle brake on it, removeable with a muzzle cap. The Lott has a Mcmillin stock CNC inletted which I then bedded with J.B. Weld. I like J.B. and have bedded a number of rifles with it. The .458 has a lot going for it , it is reasonable to reload for a truly big bore, and provides some serious practice with the 400 gr. Remington bulk bullets. Practice is everything with the big boomers.

George,
I changed my order to a 458 Lott since they can build both on the same barrel contour (#5). Did you have to have an extra lug installed on your barrel? I plan on purchasing a McMillan for this and was wondering how yours is holding up?

Which McMillan are you planning to use, Snowwolfe? It looks like only certain ones are available in left hand.

This Montana/McMillan does seem like good combination, particularly for lefties.

I have a 1999 in 375 H&H. Their barrel may be the best I have, It is 1/2 MOA rifle little or no fouling. I paid for the lapping and squaring. I built a 416 on a mark X action at same time Shelin barrel 1/2 moa also but it does foul and takes much longer to clean. Both barrel got the same break in. The 1999 is in a accuracy inovarions stock,I like the alu bedding block, I still bed with devcon for a finial fit. The have some good deals if you can finish your own stock. I would go with a lamanatied stock with a bedding block for a hard kicker.

JD

JJ,
Right now I am planning on using the Winchester Supergrade stock they offer. But I am always open to suggestions

Snowwolfe,

I've got a 416 Rigby that I am quite fond of, it is a hellacious rifle. However, it does my heart good to see you go ahead with the 458 Lott as you originally planned, especially since you already have the 375H&H --- that makes for good cartridge spacing on your part --- you can always go back and fill in the 416 spot later if you feel something is sufficiently lacking.

If it is all around versatility you want, then you already have the 375H&H, if it is "thump" you want, then the Lott will provide about as much of that as you could normally want.

Last summer, I sighted my Lott in at 200 yards for 2005's elk hunting, 450gr TSX @ ~2500 fps. Those who classify the Lott as being only 50 to 100 yard guns are sorely mistaken. It is very versatile and IMHO any rumors of its pending demise are much exaggerated.

With a 458 Lott, you'll have a seat square at the middle of the Big Bore table.