The Return of the 400 Jeffery?

05 February 2006, 17:11

Had a nice conversation with Craig Boddington at the Houston Safari Club Convention. While discussing the 450/400 3 double he used to own, he told 400NitroExpress and I that, there were serious talks, about Ruger building a #1 in 400 Jeffery. Hornady would load the ammo.
He thought the caliber would be .408 or .409.

I would be nice to see this 400 Jeffery project come to fruition!

Rusty
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05 February 2006, 20:24

Roger

Rusty,

How does the 400 compare to the 404?

I have a #1 in 458 that might need changing.....

Roger QSL

05 February 2006, 21:26

GeorgeS

quote:
Originally posted by Rusty:
Had a nice conversation with Craig Boddington at the Houston Safari Club Convention. While discussing the 450/400 3 double he used to own, he told 400NitroExpress and I that, there were serious talks, about Ruger building a #1 in 400 Jeffery. Hornady would load the ammo.
He thought the caliber would be .408 or .409.

I would be nice to see this 400 Jeffery project come to fruition!

I wonder if they'll actually make these, or bail out like they did on the .404 Jeffery, .505 Gibbs, .460 G&A, and all the other rumored chamberings.

George

05 February 2006, 22:22

ALF

05 February 2006, 22:32

700 nitro

it would make far more sence to do the 470 nitro if some one wanted 400/450 balistics they have the 458 win and lott.

and the 416 rigby.

if there gonna do a nitro then might as well do it right.

05 February 2006, 22:49

N E 450 No2

I think a 450/400 3" [the 400 Jeffery] in a Ruger No1 would be a good seller.
Factory ammo with .408 diameter bullets would be a good thing too.

05 February 2006, 22:49

Rusty

Roger,
Actually, legend has it that the 404 was supposedly the bolt action version of the 45/400 3 inch. A bit of a stretch, but close enough for me to have one made to go along with my double!

700,
I think that you get better penetration with a lot less recoil in the 450/400 and 416 and .423 calibers.

05 February 2006, 23:02

RIP

quote:
Originally posted by ALF:
George S

My sentiments excatly.

At SCI 2005 CB put out the word that Federal are going to revive the 404 by bringing out cartridges in this caliber, they even had a short statement about this and we have yet to see it realized.

I e-mailed Federal just before SCI 2006 and they reaffirmed it, this time with 2 loads........ So when will this be?

As to modern Rifle offerings by current commercial gunmakers ? Hmmmmm I dont know cause they seem not able to actually produce reliable pieces.

Look at CZ, they offer them for sale but has anyone actually seen one that actually works and feeds without flaw?

For now it would appear that we are see only customs and as such a very limited client base for ammo.

Alf,
The CZ Safari Classic in .404 Jeffery: they got it right. I own one of those and it feeds reliably with any nose shape bullet. The standard CZ 550 Magnum box is well suited to the .404 Jeffery head size. It holds 5 cartridges in the box easily, with smooth and reliable feeding.

The .505 Gibbs by CZ is another matter. The box is too small and all they did was put a thinner follower in it.

06 February 2006, 02:28

ALF

06 February 2006, 23:50

degoins

let us all join in prayer that this will happen and that they will also add the 450/400.....

07 February 2006, 00:44

Hog Killer

Quite possibly, the reason to get a Ruger #1. Just needs an NECG receiver sight for a backup, and a good ammo carrier.

Hog Killer

PS: Now how do I get two of these things SxS

07 February 2006, 00:45

Charles_Helm

quote:
Originally posted by Hog Killer:
PS: Now how do I get two of these things SxS

I believe that duct tape is the classic solution, although you may want to try JB Weld...

07 February 2006, 00:49

Hog Killer

quote:
Originally posted by Charles_Helm:
quote:
Originally posted by Hog Killer:
PS: Now how do I get two of these things SxS

I believe that duct tape is the classic solution, although you may want to try JB Weld...

I think I may need to use 7018 welding rods, to stand up for the long term. lol

Hog Killer

07 February 2006, 01:47

Scrollcutter

Ruger is probably working out the feeding geometry with the 400 Jeffery in their No.1.

07 February 2006, 01:57

octave

Well I own there 404 Jeffery in a No.1. and I am having a devil of a time getting ammo for it.

07 February 2006, 02:36

Paul H

The 470 NE would make way too much sense with factory ammo available, then again, I guess Ruger figures those that can afford 470 NE factory ammo would want a nicer rifle than a #1.

I take firearm announcments with the same grain of salt as my boss saying we have all this work coming. When the guns are on the shelves, I'll believe it, and when I have a job code to charge to I'll believe it.

07 February 2006, 03:30

500grains

quote:
Originally posted by Rusty:
Had a nice conversation with Craig Boddington at the Houston Safari Club Convention. While discussing the 450/400 3 double he used to own, he told 400NitroExpress and I that, there were serious talks, about Ruger building a #1 in 400 Jeffery. Hornady would load the ammo.

He thought the caliber would be .408 or .409

Either he was pulling your leg, or else it is a very bad joke. The .404 Jeffery takes a .423 bullet, and it would be disastrous to make it into a wildcat with a .408" bullet as a few guys would use the .423" ammo in it and start blowing rifles up.

07 February 2006, 04:28

smallfry

I have a spare R#1 stainless in a 45-70... I have been running myself in circles trying to figure if I want to make it into a 9.3X74R or a 450/400 3". I think it would make a hell of a timber rifle.

07 February 2006, 04:42

400 Nitro Express

Uh, Dan? The .404 Jeffery and the .400 Jeffery are two different cartridges. The .404 is a rimless shell that uses a .423" bullet. The .400 Jeffery (.450/.400 3" Nitro Express) is a flanged shell that has usually been loaded with .408" to .411" bullets.
-----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

07 February 2006, 04:52

GeorgeS

quote:
Originally posted by smallfry:
I have a spare R#1 stainless in a 45-70... I have been running myself in circles trying to figure if I want to make it into a 9.3X74R or a 450/400 3". I think it would make a hell of a timber rifle.

Re-chamber it into a .450 Nitro Express. You won't have to re-barrel.

George

07 February 2006, 05:02

Paul H

Considering the barrel profile and weight(or lack thereof) of the Ruger #1 45-70, I'd be hesitant to re-chamber it to a 450 NE!!!

07 February 2006, 05:08

N E 450 No2

smallfry
I have a Ruger No1 in 45/70.
For North American game I think it is a great timber rifle just as it is. If fact it is just about perfect. For Africa I would prefer the 400 Jeffery for sure.

07 February 2006, 05:39

smallfry

Re-chamber it into a .450 Nitro Express. You won't have to re-barrel. George I thought about it but I shoot a Lott quite a bit already. I had at one time a very light weight 9.3x74R in a R-1 and like a fool traded it. One 45-70 was already turned into a 30-30. Now I have another... do I keep it or does it become a 500 3", 450/400, 9.3X74R, or a 25-35. Ohh the decisions in life

07 February 2006, 05:40

GeorgeS

quote:
Originally posted by Paul H:
Considering the barrel profile and weight(or lack thereof) of the Ruger #1 45-70, I'd be hesitant to re-chamber it to a 450 NE!!!

What's wrong with a 7 1/4lb. stainless steel/laminated .450 NE single-shot? It cannot kick more than a hot-loaded fire-breathing .45-70 Guide Gun can it?

smallfry,

In that case, go with the .450/.400. Brass is more expensive than 9.3x74R, but the .450/.400 has a lot of history behind it.

George

07 February 2006, 05:46

ALF

07 February 2006, 06:30

Omnivorous_Bob

Put me down for one. I thought seriously about having one made last fall in order to have a scoped single to go with my double. Hornady ammo would be mana from heaven. I guess I'll hold off and see how this shakes out.

Does anyone know what land/groove size ruger uses on their 405 win?

Bob

DRSS

"If we're not supposed to eat animals, why are they made out of meat?"

"PS. To add a bit of Pappasonian philosophy: this single barrel stuff is just a passing fad. Bolt actions and single shots will fade away as did disco, the hula hoop, and bell-bottomed pants. Doubles will rule the world!"

07 February 2006, 06:34

RIP

quote:
Originally posted by ALF:
A week ago I visited with Ralph Martini of Martini and Hagn and he had two rifles done up for a client. One was a Henry in 450/400 that needed rebarreling and the other a 405 Winnie in a Ruger #1 that he had reamed out to 450/400.

Apparently the 405 cleans up nicely to the 450/400. This sounds like a very feasable option to me.

Uh-oh, sounds like my kind of project. A 450/400 NE 3" to go along with the .450 NE 3-1/4" Ruger No.1 conversion from .458 Lott.

Nice thought. Just find the .405 Winchester Ruger No.1 and then the reamer, and then the dies, and then the brass, and then the bullets ...

07 February 2006, 07:52

ALF

07 February 2006, 16:40

BwanaBob

quote:
about Ruger building a #1 in 400 Jeffery

I've already started building a .450/400 on a Ruger No "2" myself - so I've got to say that it is a great idea!

07 February 2006, 21:07

500grains

Oops, need to read more carefully.

07 February 2006, 21:27

HunterJim

The .400 H&H is the magazine rifle equivalent for the .450/.400. Woodleigh evens supplies the same bullet to the loaders of the respective ammo.

jim

07 February 2006, 23:33

degoins

quote:
Originally posted by RIP:
quote:
Originally posted by ALF:
A week ago I visited with Ralph Martini of Martini and Hagn and he had two rifles done up for a client. One was a Henry in 450/400 that needed rebarreling and the other a 405 Winnie in a Ruger #1 that he had reamed out to 450/400.

Apparently the 405 cleans up nicely to the 450/400. This sounds like a very feasable option to me.

Uh-oh, sounds like my kind of project. A 450/400 NE 3" to go along with the .450 NE 3-1/4" Ruger No.1 conversion from .458 Lott.

Nice thought. Just find the .405 Winchester Ruger No.1 and then the reamer, and then the dies, and then the brass, and then the bullets ...

i've got a stainless #1 in .405 if you're serious.

08 February 2006, 02:45

RIP

No thanks, Whittaker takes care of my needs.

08 February 2006, 02:51

Dave James

I have one of the Ruger 45-70's converted to 450 NE,,, its a HOOT!!!! with Black Powder Express type loads, and 550 grain hammer head slugs,, but if you move up to the "NE" loads be prepared!!!!!

08 February 2006, 03:24

D Humbarger

quote:
Ruger is probably working out the feeding geometry with the 400 Jeffery in their No.1.

08 February 2006, 03:28

RIP

Doug,
I thought that was funny too, but didn't want to call attention to it, what with Winchester and soon Remington going TU. Go easy on Ruger.

But since you have done it, this is from me for Scrollcutter:

10 February 2006, 13:05

Arctic

Both of those rifles at Martini's went home and now shoot under an inch, so they'll be users! I've just picked up another Alex Henry that'll be going to Ralf as soon as I work out the caliber and mods required.
It doesn't surprise me that Ruger's looking at the 450/400, all they needed was a reamer and the 45-70 ejector to go with the .410 barrels for the .405. I've been pointing that fact out to them for 3 years now, and this year when I started my tirade, they just smiled and agreed.
For anyone contemplating doing their .405, keep Ralf in mind as he's now got the reamer and is experienced in the modification. ~Arctic~