CZ advertizes their .404 Jeffery ammo (manufactured by A-Square and way too expensive) at 2125 fps with 400 grain soft and solid.

To be nice to Walnut stocked CZ's AND fine Mausers, , owners might consider this load for right around 2200 fps with 400 grain bullets:

H4831SC 88.0 grains
GM215M Federal primer
Norma brass
Any 380 grain or 400 grain bullet

Of course getting a soft and solid of same weight shooting to same POI is good and may require a little fiddling around this charge, likely +/- 1 grain of powder.

But there is plenty of wiggle room. This is a 100% load density charge, or barely compressed with longer bullets, and you cannot overload the rifle anyway, anyhow, with this powder and any 400 grain or lighter bullet.

It is probably around 40,000 PSI for 2200 fps with 400 grainers (Woodleigh).

Probably the same pressure for 380 grainers (North Fork) at 2227 fps. same charge.

It meters very well, H4831SC, so the loading is easy.

It is very accurate in the two rifles I have tried it in. Clover leafs with thrown charges.

Made in Australia, packaged in the USA.

Buy a, buy a donkey to Oz.

Edit: above, the CZ ammo velocity for 400 grain A-Square Monolithic Solid and Dead Tough soft is advertized at 2125 fps, not 2170 fps.

When I get around to loading for the 404 that is where I will start, and end. The beauty of that load is that it will get the job done, will work safely even in the older rifles and will not hurt you with recoil from a trim rifle built on a Model 70 action.
lawndart

Bro'lawndart,

If you find a good source for Grateful Dead decals suitable for rifle buttstock adornment, let me know, please.

My rifles both have 1 in 10" twist McGowen Magic-Micro-Land rifling of 0.423" groove, and deliver around 2200 fps with this comfie load.

What do y'all think about 1 in 14" twist Lothar Walther barrels that might have wider lands (more friction), and grooves on the tight side of .423" (maybe .4226" according to Mike Brady of North Fork)?

I think such a barrel might get pressures up to 45,000 PSI and velocities up to 2300-ish fps.

What is more desirable?
10" twist McGowen
or
14" twist Lothar Walther?

I dunno, but I do like the Magic McGowens.
The 24" stainless M70 with 340 grain North Forks at 2700 fps and 380 grainers at +2500 fps,
and the 25" chrome-moly CZ with 380 to 400 grainers at 2200 fps.

87 grains of H4350 Extreme is another 100% load that gives 2300 fps with 400 grainers in the McGowen and probably 2400 fps in the Lothar Walther???

81 grains of Varget gives 2400 fps with 400 grain Woodleighs in the 24" McGowen. That is about a 95% density load, and another good one. Maybe 2500 fps in the Lothar Walther???

400 grain Woodleigh Weldcore in 24" long McGowen 1 in 10" twist:

88.0 grains of H4831SC Extreme: 2200 fps
87.0 grains of H4350 Extreme: 2300 fps
81.0 grains of Varget Extreme: 2400 fps

Add 100 fps for Lothar Walther Barrels ... ???

"Extreme"-ly good loads.

RIP,

for my Mauser 1909 .404 I would like 2300 fps and low pressure with the woodleigh 400 gr soft and I will be happy.................

Mine has a LW barrel to.

PC,
I don't know for sure, but my guesses are outlined above, as it seems that the Lothar Walther or other barrels may be "tighter" than the McGowen.

If you have a tight barrel, the H4831SC Extreme (and likely the "Old" H4831 too) will likely be the 100% load to give you 2300 fps with 400 grainers.

If you have a loose barrel, like me, H4350 Extreme, is the 100% load for 2300 fps with 400 grainers.

Just my guess, and I will keep watching for data from other members to confirm this. So let us know how you do when you chronograph a 400 grain Woodleigh Weldcore.

Are you getting the latest production ADI powders that comprise the Hodgdon Extreme line? They seem to be better than the old Hodgdon stuff.

Ron,

Even though the stuff is made here you get the latest before we do.

We must be have been a year or two behind you on Retumbo/2225.

The only area where we are in front of you is the 2206 which is 3031 burn rate as I don't think Hodgdon have that.

Mike

IMGO (in my gun only)

LW barrel
Norma brass
Fed 215
88grs H4831SC
NF 380gr
= 2450fps @ 52,000psi

Mike,
Thanks. And that is a 26" barrel. eh?

Of course your bullet (380 grain NF Soft Point) will probably go 75 fps faster than the Woodleigh 400 grain Weldcore, with the same powder charge, and 25 fps faster for your extra inch of barrel.

So that makes your Lothar Walther barrel about 150 fps faster than a McGowen barrel for same bullet and barrel length.

You are right at the MAX CIP average pressure with that load.

There is a difference between McGowen and Lothar Walther. I have to use Varget to get those velocities in a McGowen.

83 grains of Varget gets me 2528 fps with your 380 grain North Fork soft point in a 24" McGowen barrel, and that is about a 97% load density.

Ignoring possible powder lot variations, either your chronograph reads high (doubtful) or Lothar Walther barrels are "tighter" than McGowen barrels. Thanks for pointing this out.

reddy375 listed the Champlin approved .404 Jeffery load, 400 grainer, in his original Jeffery Type A Mauser:

80 grains of IMR-4320 >>> 2280 fps

IMR-4320 is quite a bit faster than Varget, but with Varget at 81 grains, a 24" McGowen barrel gets the 400 grain Woodleigh up to 2401 fps.

The original Mauser barrels are "looser" than Mcgowen??? Otherwise, something does not compute.

Well, Mike knows his Lothar walther, and I know my McGowen, and ne'er the twain shall meet.

Jeez Rip, I had to drag you kicking and screaming to get you into a .404 and now I have spent almost another year trying to get you into IMR-4831, which is the ONLY powder for the .404 Jefferys in a good bolt action rife..

RIP.

AR 2208 is Varget or 4381 and yes thats the latest ADI I think.

No need to push the limits on an expensive custom mauser .404 ...................can do that to a cute little cz in .416 instead

Ray,
Yes you did drag me kicking and screaming away from the .416 Rigby, to the .404 Jeffery where I have plopped down quite comfortably.

However, I got the CZ .404 hoping it would be made with a 14" twist LW and came to find out it is a 10" twist McGowen, same as The African Sheep Rifle.

I had wanted to try a LW versus McGowen side by side with the same lot of powder ... that will mean a third .404 Jeffery, with a Lothar Walther barrel!