The latest iteration in blue steel and walnut. the rear sight is built right, as is the barrel band and front sight. $889.00 USD in 375 H&H, 416 Rem Mag and 458 Win Mag.

People complain about the extra recoil lug set into a slot milled in the barrel. I don't know one way or the other. Maybe bed it, shoot it and see what happens. I picked up one at Boise Gun Company this morning to check fit and finish. It seemed to balance ok, and looked pretty sharp. Maybe send one off with a few hundred bucks to Dennis Olson to have the action/trigger/feeding gone through.

I already have three of the Winchester actions in various stages of undress and redress, but I thought someone of a less tinkerous outlook might be interested in these rifles.

lawndart

http://www.cdnninvestments.com/

Sounds like a great deal, but already have a .375 and .458 so I'm good to go. That sounds like a great price though...

The one I saw this morning had more of a matte finish on the barrel.

lawndart

I just bought one of these a couple of days ago (.375H&H). It looks good and feels good, but I will be pissed if it doesn't work the way it should.

Bought a M 70 like this last year.
Only alternations is bedding and trigger adjustment. Topped with a leupold VXIII 2,5-6 it shoots "clover leaves" on 50 m with Hornady 300 gr RN if I do my part.

With the standard Pachmayr pad, recoil is a maidens kiss

I really like this gun

Used one in Zim 2001.Complete dog-despite fortune spent at 'smiths still unreliable.Not worth having if they are given away free.

quote:

Originally posted by wombat:
Complete dog-despite fortune spent at 'smiths still unreliable.

Remind me to avoid your 'smith.

Best,

JohnTheGreek

Wombat,
Sned it to me, I'll pay shipping. You don't need such an unreliable rifle. I'll send you a bottle of Single Malt for the rifle!

Funny thing about CDNN, though. I stopped in Abilene last week to go by and look over one of the Kongsberg 393s before committing. CDNN would not let me in the door without a signed FFL in my hand, even though I'd bought from them before. Really pissed me off and I doubt I'll be in a hurry to look in theie catalog again soon.

quote:

Originally posted by wombat:
Used one in Zim 2001.Complete dog-despite fortune spent at 'smiths still unreliable.Not worth having if they are given away free.

Can you be more specific?

Remember what happened to Atcheson? His M70 Classic's safety would not push off because the bolt was up or down to it's travel limit.



http://lib1.store.vip.sc5.yahoo.com/lib/cdnn/CDNN2005-2.pdf

Gentlemen,

Any rack grade American made rifle is a crap shoot. When you buy one it is a starting point. They don't cost that much. If it works great out of the chute, well, oh happy day. If not, send it to a good gunsmith with a few Benjamins. If you aren't up for the uncertainy, save up 5-10 times the price and buy a Legend, Heym, Sig Mauser or the like.

CDNN I buy ~ 2 guns a year from them. Everything has been as advertised.

lawndart

Amen lawndart!

If you buy a production rifle and it functions 100% you are in high cotton, especially regarding DG rifles. I can (and have) put up with hiccups in my varmint rifles but with A DG rifle hangups are not acceptable.

My RSM 416 Rigby won't feed NFs all the time, my RSM 458 Lott can hang up with flat points and the floor plate won't even latch after the last varmint shoot. My Win 375 SS/Syn won't cock if I work the action extra fast and my CZ 375 loves Fed 270 sps but won't feed 300 gr SAFs. Do I have bad luck or a bunch of bad rifles? I don't think so. Unfortunately, if you shoot a couple of hundred rounds out of your "factory" DG rifle I think some bugs will surface. Sure, the factory should bed the rifles properly to prevent splitting and should ensure 100% feeding...but that is not the real world in off the shelf $700-1200 rifles.

Buy the rifle that fits you and you like, shoot the heck out of it (if you don't split the stock doing it!) and send it to a good smith to polish off the rough edges. I WISH you could get a completely tuned, good to go DG rifle for the price of a "factory" offering, but I haven't seen it.

This post is in no way meant to dissuade those that want a M70, CZ, RSM or whatever. Just know that buying a certain rifle doesn't mean you are buying the perfect rifle out of the box.

For the record, I love the RSMs for a classic "big bore" and prefer the M70s in 375 H&H.

John

I think the point about polishing the rough edges applies to most factory rifles made anymore. I always thought SAKO was excempt but I saw one of their "lights" not to long ago and it was a disappointment.

This doesn't apply just to just DG rifles, pretty much anyrifle that is $1000 or under seems to need something, stock, trigger, clean up on the rails, polishing on the bolt, stock work or bedding, pretty much you name it and I guess I have seen it.

But for the price of these Winchesters, a little clean up and tweaking. Although I wsaw the rest of the add and the 338 for $100 less would catch my attention.

I guess I am spoiled shooting mostly custom shop Weatherby rifles...what would it take to clean up a M70 .375H&H..loose the wood stock, and then what? What would it cost and how long would it take?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Savage99:

Remember what happened to Atcheson? His M70 Classic's safety would not push off because the bolt was up or down to it's travel limit. (Quote)

I read on AR of this happening, so tried it on my '76 M70. I believe it can only happen when the safety is in the middle position.
Also read this is the favourite position with the DG shooters.
Seems like it was designed to be used full back, and I unload out the floor plate anyway.

Someone on AR said there was a fair bit wrong with the M70 as a DG rifle, but the safety thing seems to me to be operator error.
But heck, I'm very willing to learn if anyones got the time.
I have now put 86 shots through my new/old 458 W.M. (all target work) and when right side up haven't had any problems . . . Yet.
Cept for my "light" reloads, but that's definetly operator error. :-)
John L.

quote:

I believe it can only happen when the safety is in the middle position.
Also read this is the favourite position with the DG shooters.

Of course that will happen from the half safe position. I did not know that DGR hunters kept the safe on half? I would not.

quote:

guess I am spoiled shooting mostly custom shop Weatherby rifles...what would it take to clean up a M70 .375H&H..loose the wood stock, and then what? What would it cost and how long would it take?

Congratulations on your new M70

How long it will take depends upon who does it. You might start yourself by picking out a stock. Unless you want to take some weight off of the gun a McMillian might be the place to start so look at what they have. You might be able to fit it yourself and if you get stuck take it to a smith.

As to "cleaning up" the 70 be more specific. If it's just slicking the action most wear in fine with lube on them.

Check that the safety goes off from the full safe postion no matter what the bolt postion is per the discussion above. The trigger can be adjusted some. Try that and if it's not to your liking then a smith can work on it or you can ask about how to do more yourself.

I like Weaver style bases on rifles where the irons might be used as they are nice and low. Rings that are detachable might be wanted.

Good luck

Savage99: Thank you for the information..nothing may need to be done with the rifle if it performs adequately as is...if the wooden stock works ok, it will be left on. This is probably the 6th or 7th M70 I have purchased over the years...let's hope it is a good one.

Thank you.

Start off with a pre-64 modle 70 in 375 H&H and know what true bliss is about.

Try it, you might like it. I bought a Model 70 Safari Express .375 H&H that functioned perfectly - feeding, firing, extracting and ejecting - all 100%, right out of the box.

The safety was very positive in all three positions. I tried to push the safety off of full safe with the bolt handle pushed up as far as it would go and it pushed off just fine, all the way to completely off safe. I've tried that with every Model 70 I've seen at the gunstore in the last few months. Only two would not go off safe, the others all worked fine.

Back to my Model 70 .375 - it's only fault was to walk the shots. I'm pretty sure that was due to the forward barrel lug being improperly bedded and causing some barrel stressing as it heated up. I spent $140 on a gunsmith's "accuracy package" - he smoothed the trigger to an even and crisp 3 pounds, recrowned the barrel, and glass bedded the action leaving the forward barrel lug free floating. This turned the rifle from a 3-4" grouper down to at worst a 1 1/2" grouper, with some loads producing better accuracy. Not the "half inch all day" rifle that everybody and his dog owns these days, but that's good enough for anything you'd point a .375 at.

To be honest, regarding the game and ranges a .375 is used for, right out of the box with no modifications any misses out to 250 yards would have been my fault.

Anyway - don't sell them short. You'll always find individual examples that are a POS, most are not. You certainly won't go wrong enriching a big name smith by several hundred dollars - you'll end up with a nice rifle. But you just might find that a tweak here and there costing only a hundred bucks by a knowledgable smith will get you a rifle that will function just as reliably and and shoot just as straight.

Jim: That is what I wanted to hear.. . Believe me, I will let everyone know how this rifle works. It is a good looking rifle though, for what it cost.

quote:

Originally posted by rwj:
I guess I am spoiled shooting mostly custom shop Weatherby rifles...what would it take to clean up a M70 .375H&H..loose the wood stock, and then what? What would it cost and how long would it take?

Here is what I had to do on a M70 SS .375:

- polish the action rails (bolt was binding a bit)

- polish the bolt body (for smoother travel

- polish the feed ramp (for smoother feeding)

- radius the feed ramp edges and action internal edges (sharp corners can screw up feeding)

- pull barrel, radius edges on chamber and on extractor cut, replace barrel

- glass bed

- replace hard recoil pad with Pachmyr decelerator

- replace rear sight with NECG Masterpiece adjustable

- replace front sight with NECG Masterpiece banded ramp with fiber optic bead and window hood

- adjust trigger

- check whether floorplate closes securely (sometimes they don't and need some inletting help to avoid the floorplate coming open)

There was nothing wrong with the safety, but sometimes those need attention.

There was nothing wrong with the scope mounting holes, but sometimes those are off and need to be redrilled 8-40 centered.

So, just a quick go over? :-)

Your not wrong about the floor plate, mine needed a free-up.

Seeing as it's nearly 30 years old I didn't want to rush into anything. I'd prev. said on AR I wouldn't touch the trigger, but now it's a whisker under 3lb & no creep.

And seeing it's a 458 and hadn't yet cracked the stock, and shoots well with full loads, I haven't yet decided to bed the action.

I may have been lucky, buy an old clunker and it's already smoothed it's self out.

The safety is quite hard to get on to the middle position, I'll get it looked at if it gets worse.
All in all I'm quite happy with it. (so far)
John L.

500: That sounds like a lot of work...I hope we do not have to have that done on the rifle..it is a rifle for by brother and he just got it today, so we will see how it works..and I agree...no need to get personal.

Jim,
I agree with you . My Safari Express is just great out of the box. Very happy with the rifle!

quote:

- pull barrel, radius edges on chamber and on extractor cut, replace barrel

Did you replace the barrel or just clean up the original? Did it need to be set back a thread when you did this?

I have shot my 416 rem mag Winchester Safari Express the earlier model around 1600 times.Its very accurate and a fine gun.I got mine about 6 years ago for $600.I want a kevelar or fiberglass stock if I can find one that will hoold up.I think the HS stock is the best bet if they make one.I did have a tiny piece of metal that is a little part on the back of the bolt broke off.This is a well made rifle very accurate and built like a tank.It has always fed any thing I put through it.

quote:

Originally posted by rwj:
500: Why bother with all that stuff? I can loan you a M700 in .375H&H to shoot your next young cow. I am willing to bet it will work as well as one of your shiney las vegas rifles.

Robert,

Why the consistent personal hostility? It seems that you are angry that I think there are design inadequacies in the Mark V action. Just get over it.

On the M700, it is plagued with a myriad of problems. Including quality control. A friend has one in .458 which will not feed any soft point ammo other than factory Rem 510 gr. soft nose.

quote:

Originally posted by schromf:

quote:

- pull barrel, radius edges on chamber and on extractor cut, replace barrel

Did you replace the barrel or just clean up the original? Did it need to be set back a thread when you did this?

By replace barrel I mean reinstall the factory barrel. The chamber edges and extractor cut are sharp and can cause a feeding hangup. No need to set back a thread because headspace will not change. There is no reamer involved.

After compulsory 200 to 300 shots using hunting ammo you should be able to learn all its "little secrets". It's called practical polishing. There is a certain chance you might get a lemon shooter , so there is no point in spending extra cash bore testing.

Hello the campfire:
What is the problem? If you like Winchesters, go for it. If nor don't. I have complete faith in my M70. When I bought it I had it checked out by a gunsmith I trusted, I ran several dummy rounds through it, looked at the bore and finish, applied what I knew from 50 plus years of shooting and decided that I was what I wanted. I would take it to hunt any Dangerous Game I am likely to shoot. I also have confidence in myself. If I were going after up close DG, I would run it through the gunsmith for a check up. The point is, is kinda like your Wife, or your doctor, or your lawyer, either you trust them or you don't and nothing is going to change your mind. If you don't go with what you trust, you are not going to be happy, and any of the above will only live up to your expectations. I will put any of the American built rifles or even pistols up against ones from anywhere else for day to day, throw in the back of the truck, reilability. They might not be as pretty, or as finely finished, but for the money they are hard to beat. Just my humble opinion.
Judge Sharpe.