Hi,
I am wondering about the shootability and recoil feel of Browning's Auto 5.
Recoil is always subjective, but can anyone give me an indication as to how it feels in comparison to more modern designs such as Beretta or Benelli?
Does the barrel flip up a lot? There seems to be quite a lot of drop at the heel, and the barrel line seems very high.

Do you know if switch barrels are easy to obtain and reasonably priced (in comparison to the price of the gun), and will they likely fit without gunsmithing?

- Lars/Finland

I think they kick harder, but I also have only shot those with hard butt plates. The numbers may not be higher, but the felt recoil is much worse forme.

The A5s felt recoil is substantially more than most other semi-auto guns IMO. Hard to measure "feelings" but I'd put it at at least 30% more than a more modern design, such as the Rem 1100. I shoot mostly doubles these days so can't really compare to the newer Benelli/Berettas. I will say this regarding recoil, I'd much rather shoot a case of shells through my Winchester 101 O/U than through an A5. Great design, functions almost flawlessly, but kicks like the proverbial Missouri Mule.

Gatogordo, Why do you think th A5 has more felt recoil than a 101? I have no experience with the A5 and was planning to get one in the future. I always thought they were the tradtional duck gun.

I don't think it uses the gas to bleed off and cycle the action? And the design is not very conducive to handling the recoiling.

quote:

Originally posted by J_Zola:
Gatogordo, Why do you think th A5 has more felt recoil than a 101? I have no experience with the A5 and was planning to get one in the future. I always thought they were the tradtional duck gun.

I really can't answer that. I think, stress think, it has both something to do with the basic recoil activated design as well as the stock design in relation to the receiver.

My first "real" shotgun was a Sweet 16. I got it when I was about 9. Shot the fire out of if for years including my first whitewing hunt in Mexico when I was about 13.........hell, I thought shotguns were supposed to kick and it lived up to that reputation. Unfortunately (or maybe not), it was stolen when I was off partying......uuhhh, I mean attending college.....and I moved on to 1100s, O/Us, etc. later while hunting, shooting trap competively, and skeet mostly for fun (low gun, way too easy otherwise with a 12). Long story short, along the way 20 years or so after the Sweet 16 was stolen, another one came my way. I promptly took it out to the skeet range, and BAWHAAMMMM, it didn't take me long to realize it had substantially more felt recoil than anything else I shot. That second time around "love" affair was very shortlived. I sold it, and never looked back. BTW, I also shot an A5 on a "pick up" whitewing dove hunt in Mexico one time. I was used to recoil and survived, but damn sure missed my 101.

Don't get me wrong, an A5 is not ridiculous, and wearing heavy clothes, shooting no more than the average duck hunter shoots, it should not be a problem. If you want one, by all means try one out. If you buy it half way right, and they have become quite affordable (for some reason Sweet 16s have not dropped as much, God knows why, the kicking bastards) these days (check gunbroker for a while or local gunshop for a feeling for pricing levels) then you can shoot it for a while and if you don't like it, lose little or nothing when/if you decide to get rid of it.

Use an A5 for my bird gun and while it does have a little more recoil than a gas operated gun it is not bad. Wouldn't want to shoot doves in Argentina all day with one but to me they are about as good as it gets for birds.

The price for a decent Belgium made 12 gauge is running around 1K for a round knob specimen with a ventilated rib. Sixteens are running a bit higher and I am in the market if anyone knows of one for sell. A friend gave me 20 boxes of Peters Victor 16 gauge shells and I can think of no better reason to find a Sweet Sixteen.

quote:

Originally posted by crowrifle:
Use an A5 for my bird gun and while it does have a little more recoil than a gas operated gun it is not bad. Wouldn't want to shoot doves in Argentina all day with one but to me they are about as good as it gets for birds.

The price for a decent Belgium made 12 gauge is running around 1K for a round knob specimen with a ventilated rib. Sixteens are running a bit higher and I am in the market if anyone knows of one for sell. A friend gave me 20 boxes of Peters Victor 16 gauge shells and I can think of no better reason to find a Sweet Sixteen.

You need to find a different gun shop for A5s. They're commonly available for substantially less than a $1000 in my area and on Gunbroker. Again, Sweet 16s are higher.

A5 barrels will fit without any problem as long as you fit the right barrel to the right gun. A 2 3/4" barrel will not fit on a 3" magnum. A 2 9/16" 16 gauge barrel will not fit on a 2 3/4" 16 gauge.
Find one that fits you. The Belgium guns are all over the place on drop at heel.
Usually if the kick is to hard it is because you don't know how to set the magazine spring.
There is a brass friction ring on the magazine tube that controls recoil.
The way I do it is first put oil on the mag tube on the light setting (see owners manual for the heavy and light settings).
If it kicks to hard wipe off the oil on the tube, and I mean ALL the oil. John Browning designed it to opperate dry.
If it still kicks to hard put it on the heavy setting.
If the kick is OK but it doesn't cycle, leave it on the heavy setting but put a drop of oil on the mag tube.
If you understand what is going on with the friction ring you can play around with it to get your recoil and cycling correct.
All my A5's kick like a pussy cat, hunting I don't even feel it.
If your going to shoot steel you will want to get a Japan barrel with invector chockes.
Don't know about Finland, but barrels are very easy to find in the US. Also the prices are coming down.
I like the plain barrels with no rib. Makes the gun lighter and with the hump back you don't even see the rib.
If you want to spend the next year reading about A5's go to shotgunworld.com under "I love my Browning", real good info there.
Buy one and your great grand children will still be shooting it. Their are 100 year old guns still in service.

quote:

You need to find a different gun shop for A5s. They're commonly available for substantially less than a $1000 in my area and on Gunbroker. Again, Sweet 16s are higher.

Not here, unless you want one with a damn poly-choke and a recoil pad that looks like Bubba's drunk pet monkey installed it.

If you run across a nice little 20 for a song please keep me in mind.

quote:

Buy one and your great grand children will still be shooting it. There are 100 year old guns still in service.

So true.

Is there any real difference in quality from a belgium gun verse one from Japan? I hope to start the hunt for one after the holidays. Crowrifle the 20's seem to have been produced in low numbers from what I have seen on the dealers shelves.

I've heard several gunsmiths state that the Jap guns have better metal than the Belgium guns, whether that's true or not, I can't say. For collector's value, there is no doubt the Belgium guns are much more desirable. For shooting, most of the jap guns have a "squared off" pistol grip, compared to the rounded grip of the older Belgium guns. I haven't shot enough of the new models to have an opinion on the difference that would make as far as shooting goes, if any.

Thanks for the info, I am a sucker for that rounded grip. On a side note great thread on the coin collecting.

Regarding grip angles. I like and use at times, especially on smaller ga guns, the English straight grip but if you look at your hand in a natural position, it is basically at a 90% angle to your natural trigger finger position. Fred Etchen, Rudy Etchen's father, back in the 30s, designed/developed a shotgun pistol grip that more or less duplicated that natural angle of the hand/trigger finger. It was known, not surprisingly as the Etchen grip. He, and then his son, Rudy used it to win many, many shoots. You will still find the Etchen grip on a few older trap guns. Rudy was widely considered to be one of the finest shotgun shots in the world in his heyday. He was still using the Etchen grip on some of his 870s late in life when I knew him, and was still breaking them all with it. The angles on the Etchen grip are a bit severe for field use IMO but, OTOH, I've found that heavy loads with straight grips really will wrack your hand after awhile. This has nothing to do with the Browning rounded vs "squared" pistol grip, just reminded me of a little known bit of shotgunning history.

BTW Rudy would kill 5 quail on a covey rise with some degree of regularity shooting his trademark 870 (he was employed by Remington at one time). He was a good story teller as well as a great shot. Fine friend, incredible shot, gone but not forgotten. Requiescat in pace.

The A 5 in 12 b has worked well for me for many years. I bought it new in the early 1970s and added a slug barrel & a IC vent rib barrel to the F 30" vent rib that came with the shotgun. Have killed ruffed grouse, pheasants, squirrels, rabbits, crows and deer with it. A bit heavy for walking up and sliding down the steep hills in SE Ohio chasing grouse. Changed to a lighter Beretta S X S Model 424 for grouse. My Benelli probably kicks no more, possible less than the A5.Never really compared them. I still use the A5, just not as much. The stock finish glazed many years ago, returned it to Browning. They refinished it and it glazed again. I stripped it and refinished myself. It turned out OK.

Like Gatogordo, the first shotgun I ever fired was a Sweet 16 and it was the only shotgun I used for years and years. In my 20's I started shooting O/Us and didn't pick up the A5 for a long time. To this day, I struggle to keep my head down on an O/U stock because I got so used to shooting with my head up to see over the hump.

Just for old time's sake, I pulled out the Sweet 16 for a dove hunt several years ago. The first time I pulled the trigger I couldn't believe all the mechanical movement going on and I felt like I had to wait forever before I could fire a follow-up shot. The recoil didn't seem too severe (except it was a 16 instead of a 20 or 28) but all the movement and noise really got to me. I'll never part with my old friend, but the Sweet 16 is a safe queen from now on.

Dear Schauckis:

The key to reducing the felt recoil on an Auto 5, and to not overcycling the action is to buy one, and immediately replace the friction ring, bronze friction piece, recoil spring and action spring.

You can call Brownells in Montezuma, Iowa, USA at 1-800-741-0015, and they will get you set up for about $70.00US.

I lube up the magazine tube with some G-96 oil, just one wipe with a soaked rag (not too much), and then spray the big recoil spring, friction ring and bronze friction piece with G-96 and let them sit for an hour before assembly. You should grease up the action spring with something like Lubriplate, an outboard motor grease, which you can get from Brownells, too.

Here's the result.

My 1980 Japanese made Auto 5 with the original parts, kicked a bit and the recoil sounded like the proverbial "double shuffle" of the Auto 5 similar to an AR-15. After replacing the parts enumerated above and greasing the barrel extension squared lugs that ride in the grooves in the receiver, I barely feel 12 gauge magnum loads with the original plastic buttplate. But you will have to experiment with the friction and bronze ring set up for different shotshell loads to get the shotgun to cycle properly

So, get ahold of a Browning factory manual for the type of Auto 5 that you purchase. You can contact Browning in Morgan, Utah, USA for a manual for the Auto 5. Their customer service number is 1-801-876-2711.

No more double shuffle, and definitely less recoil than my Browning Superposed with high brass rounds.

Sincerely,

Chris Bemis

Dear ForrestB:

Me, too. My first shotgun, that I borrowed at at 12 to hunt pheasants was a Sweet 16.

It only took me 34 more years to buy another Auto 5, and now I have more than a few. I love them, more John Browning genius.

Sincerely,

Chris Bemis

I was raised on A5s and always loved them...It was a class thing to back in the 60-70s.If you had a Browning A5,it was like having a Cadillac.We didnt have a Cadillac,but we did luv our A5s.Had all the gauges and models,but my 3"/32" was my "ego" gun!...As far as recoil,I personally dont think they kick any more than my Benelli's,heavier though for sure.In a Duck/goose blind,no problem.Recoil may be called heavier by some folks,but it is just different-you have the double shuffle of the barrel coming back several inchs upon firing.You feel it(which is really neat to A5 fans)Reliability is utmost and they are priced very reasonable now on GB and GA...Some are sky high,but many are on the $500 range.Belgium preferred,but Jap is fine for shooting.
Brad Mays post above on maintance of the rings n spings is right on.Many dont have the friction rings set right for the load.
Extra barrels can be had for $150-250..Price a Benelli barrel,$4-600!
I say go for it if you like them,but to each his own...Happy Hunting

PLENTY BROWNINGS ON GB..HERE IS ONE http://www.gunbroker.com/Aucti....aspx?Item=152826714

Imagine me at eleven, my brother a year older and the two kids next farm down the same ages. Four of us riding two by two on our bicycles down farm roads with sock cases across the handlebars. Stop at good rabbit spots on the tracks and out of those soft cases come four A5's. One twelve, one twenty, and my brother and I with Sweet Sixteens. Those cheesy elastic strap shell holders with a box each in the loops. Enough firepower to take half the third world countries at the time.
Those were the days...

I had the perfect afternoon with that 16 the year I was fifteen. Cold blustery sleety midwest December and my grandparents are up to visit. My Grandmother mentions she would love some Quail for dinner that evening. The sixteen and I go out to the cornfield and head up a row. A covey flushed straight up the row and the Browning went Boom-Boom! It was the shot of a lifetime, with them running down the row a few yards and going up in tight formation.
I got fifteen of them with the two shots. Jeex, it rained Quail for about two minutes. Wore the old springer out "fetching". I got a game vest bag full and walked back up to the house. Walk in the back porch and my Grandfather and my Dad are waiting for me. Grandfather says "I only heard two shots. That's hardly enough birds for your Grandmother, let alone me.". I just reached in the back of the game vest and started laying out birds on the old chest freezer. When number fifteen hit the top everybody in the house was standing out there. Just once in my life I touched bird hunting perfection. That Sweet Sixteen made it possible. I still have her, and we hunt a few birds every fall.
If you're lucky you have one of those days every rare now and then.

Rich

Excellent surmise of a Great Hunt and even Greater Memories
Me,I was a po blak chile n uzd a slngshut tu get mi viddles fo al da foks!