It's not everyday I find I can smoke 'um. Sometimes it's just off. Or the first round's OK, then you start slipping and for no apparent reason. What do you do about it? Go back over your fundamentals? Or try something different? I know I'm not the first to wonder how this works.

A good friend of mine, Ben Hudson (now gone on to his reward), who was the first senior shooter to win the Grand American singles Championship, had a theory to not practice your mistakes. If you're a good shot and are having a bad day, go shoot some skeet, clays, or just go have a beer or three and call it a day.

OTOH, if you shoot one round good and have a bad next round, you should try to find out why before it happens in competition. Most good shooters can tell what they are doing. I'm not trying to preach to the choir, but, unless you're using voice activated traps, the most common mistake is "peeking", coming off your stock weld, often due to a very slightly slow pull (your mind expects the target to be there, it isn't and it is a natural reaction to raise your head and look for it, however slightly, it not only makes you shoot over, but even if you get your head back down, it screws up your shooting rhythmn). I used to coach a lot of shooters and am fairly good at it if I do say so myself, but sitting at a computer doesn't lend itself to really helping with a problem.

Thx for the response. We do have the voice activated. So you know exactly when it will go. Unless it malfunctions, which is not infrequent. You just have to remember to really speak up.

When the shooting goes south usually I have no idea why, but I can think of a few possible causes. Either strictly mental or something about my changing vision or the conditions, like the wind.

I used to shoot regularly with a past grand national champion. But it was a long time ago that he did that. He passed away recently in his 90s. The name was Jack Wright. Grand old school Southern gentleman. He was one of the guys I referred to in the Bo-Whoop thread who used to hunt with Mr. Buck. The first time I ever ran them, it was the two of us. I didn't even know it until he told me. I wasn't thinking about anything but the two of us getting to shoot together.

Anyway, building consistency I've found to be the challenge.

If I remember rightly, I hardly ever broke 25 straight in practice.

In competition I hardly missed

Well, I would have mentioned shooting with Saeed, but I hate to drop names.......

Saeed was the exception that proves the rule, he did almost everything wrong from a stance point of view, but he just kept breaking those targets......frankly it was amazing. He shoots or did shoot trap standing on one foot with his back foot on tippy toe, more or less, not to mention using his middle finger for his trigger finger.......but damn could he break 'em and he only shot trap for a couple of years but he was serious about it when he started.

I've told this story before, but it doesn't take long to repeat, Saeed tied with Dan Bonillas at the Grand American, then in Vandalia, Ohio for the Doubles Championship, both with 100s (I think, been a while). Bonillas was and is a well known very high quality shooter from Cal, getting a bit long in the tooth now, but at the time in his prime.
They're going to the shootoff and Bonillas is talking with Leo Harrison, looking out at this skinny Arab going to the line, who no one outside of our area of Louisiana and Texas had ever heard of, I'm next to them, mostly by accident, and Bonillas says, "I'll see you later, this won't take long." It didn't, first round Bonillas misses and Saeed doesn't, Saeed won the Doubles Championship of America. Saeed went home and quit shortly after that, he would have been the Tiger Woods of trap if he had kept it up, and that's no BS.

Shack:

While widely known and respected as a great shooter and gentleman, Mr. Wright didn't win a Grand American National Championship as far as I know.

Here is a nice article on him.

Jack Wright

Well, I'm sure you're correct. I thought I heard someone say that about him, but if it were true it would have been in that article. I did know he had been there and there is so much memorbilia of him in the clubhouse with the word "champion" attached that it's an easy assumption to make.

The part about him hunting with Nash Buckingham I know however is factual. He used to tell me stories about it.

He was still going out there nearly every day to shoot until not long before passing away. When I knew him, he was doing singles. One thing I found interesting was his choice of guns. He always used when I was around a Model 12. I've been fond of those myself, and he inspired me to try using my M-12 heavy duck gun at trap. Nearly everyone else uses single shot trap shotguns, many that Browning model, others more expensive pieces. Some much more expensive.

Jack gave some thought to trying an 1100 trap model and may have actually tested out one, just before the close of his career. I believe the recoil of the big Winchester had finally started to become an issue. I remember him saying his only reluctance with an autoloader was that when fired as much as need be in trap, that mechanical problems would eventually crop up.

Btw, one of the more remarkable and I guess instructive things I remember seeing lately was a young kid who had just taken up trap, who couldn't have been more than 13 if that, break in the high 90s (I think it was 98 or 99 but can't remember the exact number) to win one of our tournaments. I thought, well, what does that tell you about this?

You shoot trap (and other shotgun games) with your eyes and almost every time I miss a target it's because I moved the gun before I moved my eyes to the target.

Here's the sequence.

1. Mount your gun and let your eyes settle while you soft-focus in the area you hope to break the target.

2. Call for the target and move your eyes to the target while keeping the gun still.

3. Once you have a solid lock on the front edge of the bird move your gun to the target while maintaing focus on the front edge of the bird.

4. Pull the trigger.

You have to understand WHY you're hitting targets before you can inderstand why you are missing. Let's face it...Trapshooting is pretty darned easy....Most shooters routinely score in the 90's in a 100 bird event. Unfortunately, most shooters tend to focus all their analysis on those few misses, rather than seeking to understand what they did correctly on the vast majority of the birds they are hitting.
Changes in conditions can definterly cause scores to "go South"...especially if you fail to adjust your shooting accordingly. For example, if the winds shifts, and the birds start going much higher right out of the trap...you might weant to adjust your hold over the house "up" a bit so that your net move to the target stays pretty much the same.
If your scores slide badly in a round, for no obvious reason...take a break. Don't keep trying to "shoot through it"...Return to your fundamentals. This is where your understanding of why you broke all those other targets is important. If the frustration starts to settle in...Stop Yourself. Put the gun away and do something else before you start to develop a lot of bad habits and just waste your shells stabbing away at birds without rhyme or reason.

Same problems shooting Skeet. I found it helpful to have a friend watch me and try to tell me what is going wrong. Often very obvious things like lifting head from the stock etc. bad habits do creep in. Probably doesn't work in a tournament though!
Peter.

I think the best suggeston I remember was to get the shot off faster. Anyway, lots of good advice here. But, a few questions -

What's the thinking about field guns? I've run them with my 26" Citori O/U hunter model (using several chokes), one of the guns I duck hunt with. Also done OK with an 1187. Some think that's not the way.

Does lead have a place in trap? I don't try to do that, but don't know what everyone else does. One fellow told me it's irrelevant in trap, "when you pull the trigger the shot's there immediately, but if the bird's so far out lead's necessary then that's not the way to do it in the first place". Or words to that effect.

As for technique, I believe I'm doing what's called "swing thru" in waterfowling. In trap, start low, begin swing upward, come up from behind and catch up with and coincide with bird and press trigger while keeping barrel moving on thru. In waterfowling I start from behind bird, catch up, pass thru bird to obtain the lead, then fire, then keep swing going, all in one quick motion. My pet name for it is "painting the target".

If you shoot an O/U, which barrel?

I know wind matters, but how about lighting conditions?

Best kind of glasses? Yellow tint for darker days and smoky for real sunny? Or clear for all?

Does anyone shoot with one eye shut? I experimented both ways when new at it, then settled on both open just like I do in hunting. But I still sometimes close one eye to line up the barrel before calling for the bird, then open both.

And what does everyone think of release triggers?

I broke my first 100 straight with a Browning field gun.

I broke 498 out of a 500 bird marathon with a Browning field gun.

I have never been able to use "swing through".
I have always lead with a sustained lead. That is the way we have always learnt to shoot flying birds.

quote:

Originally posted by Gatogordo:
Well, I would have mentioned shooting with Saeed, but I hate to drop names.......

Saeed was the exception that proves the rule, he did almost everything wrong from a stance point of view, but he just kept breaking those targets......frankly it was amazing. He shoots or did shoot trap standing on one foot with his back foot on tippy toe, more or less, not to mention using his middle finger for his trigger finger.......but damn could he break 'em and he only shot trap for a couple of years but he was serious about it when he started.

I've told this story before, but it doesn't take long to repeat, Saeed tied with Dan Bonillas at the Grand American, then in Vandalia, Ohio for the Doubles Championship, both with 100s (I think, been a while). Bonillas was and is a well known very high quality shooter from Cal, getting a bit long in the tooth now, but at the time in his prime.
They're going to the shootoff and Bonillas is talking with Leo Harrison, looking out at this skinny Arab going to the line, who no one outside of our area of Louisiana and Texas had ever heard of, I'm next to them, mostly by accident, and Bonillas says, "I'll see you later, this won't take long." It didn't, first round Bonillas misses and Saeed doesn't, Saeed won the Doubles Championship of America. Saeed went home and quit shortly after that, he would have been the Tiger Woods of trap if he had kept it up, and that's no BS.

It was three of us who tied with 100 straight in doubles that year.

Myself, Dan and another gentleman by the name of Albright. He was a young shooter, and seemed to be a bit nervous that day at the shoot off.

He dropped a bird in the first shoot off. Me and Dan broke them all.

In the second set to, Dan dropped two targets, and I managed to break them all.

If memory serves right, there were about 1263 shooters in double that year.

Walter is standing behind me, he is say "how the hell can you remember all these details with an advanced case of Alzheimer?"

Nice friend to have ha?

Some of those ballsy running kill shots at big game that I have seen Saeed make are now making much more sense...

Shack, in skeet I do everything wrong. The recommended way is sustained lead, I shoot swing through! The recommended way is both eyes open, I shoot one eye closed! At my age it is not worth my while to change my style, especially as I can still shoot 25 straight with all gauges. Not 100 straight however. I have no interest in that. When I want things more difficult I shoot doubles or shoot low gun, delayed pull.
Peter.

If you don't shoot skeet low gun or farther back or both, it is like kissing your sister, you're going thru the motions but the thrill isn't there (says a trap shooter)...........

Hang on a minute gentlemen, I thought tra was a man's sport, while skeet is supposed to be for girls?

Isn't that why they shoot 410?

Saeed, I wonder why you never try to shoot trap with 1/2 ounce of shot. It can't be the recoil. Doubt there would be many 100's. But then again the guys at the top of the heap would find a way.