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In August of 2017 I posted how a buddy and I had gotten screwed by Jeri Booth and Detail Company Adventures. Search this forum and you will find it. We were each out over $6K because of her ineptitude. We filed Ethics & Grievance complaints with both DSC and SCI (SCI charges you $500 to do this) and both of them blew us off. I had falsely assumed that if DSC and SCI allowed exhibitors to book hunts at their meetings that the hunter should be reasonable safe in assuming the exhibitor was honest. Obviously not true. DSC and SCI care more about the repeat exhibitor income than the attendees. Anyone wanting more information can PM me. DSC and SCI have gotten their last $.01 from me. "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | ||
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Wow! So sorry to hear that! But, what is even worse is to hear that SCI charges you $500 just to file an ethics complaint. Ridiculous!  | |||
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Complaining with posting the details is pointless. Why don’t you post all the relevant details here, and see what members think. It can draw the attention of people from both SCI - don’t expect anything from them. And DSC - who might help. | |||
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An interesting thread. At the recent DSC show, I saw the outfitter booth of the man that I think defrauded me and other hunters on a pronghorn hunt recently. I stopped and politely told him so. Because the hunt was booked by a friend who may not have thoroughly checked outfitter references, I filed no written report. I grew up in Texas pronghorn country and having hunted pronghorn in Texas, New Mexico, Colorado, Kansas, and the panhandle of Oklahoma, I can say that that hunt was on the poorest and most overgrazed property I ever hunted. There were also a few other hunters not in our group on the already over crowded ranch. The poor pronghorns were in bad condition and no real trophies were to be seen. I could go on, but suffice it to say that I left after the first day and headed back to Texas. I will pass this on if ever asked for a reference, but for me it was another reminder of the importance of the care required to locate trustworthy outfitters. I reckon this is true for most business and personal transactions. NRA Life Benefactor Member, DRSS, DWWC, Whittington Center,Android Reloading Ballistics App at http://www.xplat.net/ | |||
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Per Saeed's request, here goes: (Disclaimer: I have a 1/2 inch thick file on this so I am going to summarize) January 2016: My buddy (who is a custom rifle maker and has exhibited at both SCI and DSC for 30 years+ and who has known Jeri Booth for close to that long)was approached again at SCI with the request "when are you going to book a hunt with me?" She told him about her "new" pigeon lodge in Bolivia, "The Pigeon Palace". He booked a hunt for the two of us for June of 2016. We both asked for a contract and were both told on multiple occasions that "I have been in the business for over 30 years and I don't do contracts-I do emails and phone calls". Due to her longevity in the business we agreed (first and biggest mistake). June 2016: We fly from San Antonio through Dallas to Miami. AA cancels the flight from Miami to Santa Cruz. No flights available for at least 3 days, and since we were traveling with our shotguns (which means no alternative travel without prior approved paperwork) we had no alternative but to come home. July 2016: Jeri tells us that the lodge operator (Mozo Vidal) will allow rebooking for 2017 but there will be an increased cost of $460 to cover "administrative costs" and shells were going up by $2/box (we both shoot 28 gauges and shoot a lot-we anticipated our shell cost to be >$2500 for the trip). We agree to rebook with these terms. As my buddy and I are both self-employed we tell Jeri to book us when it is convenient for Mozo and as long as we get enough notice to be gone from our businesses we will deal with it. September, 2016: Jeri tells us by phone and email that she is going to Bolivia to see Mozo to "specifically take care of our rebooked trip for 2017". October 2016: Costs of 2017 trip are confirmed by Jeri. Dates for 2017 are selected by Jeri. We rebook our flights through Jeri. One email from Jeri states "we need to try to get six hunters-please talk to your friends". This was the only time she said this. November 2016: I got a phone call from Jeri stating that she "had a good trip to Bolivia and everything is worked out for you (us) to to go Bolivia in 2017". May 2017: Emails and phone calls to Jeri regarding the possibility of taking a charter flight from Santa Cruz to Mozo's lodge to avoid the long drive. I asked if we were going to have the lodge to ourselves and was told only that "I am working on an additional hunter". June 2017: Asked about obtaining current gun import permits and was told she "would take care of everything". Confirmed again the previously quoted cost increases and was assured it would be fine to pay the increases directly to Mozo upon arriving at the lodge. June 28, 2017 (we were scheduled to fly out of San Antonio very early on June 30): I receive a phone call from Jeri while I was driving at 11:45 a.m. stating that "we may have a problem-Mozo wants a minimum of four hunters or a large cost increase which I am not going to pay. Don't worry, I have someone down there talking to him". June 29, 2017: I receive a phone call from Jeri that "this trip is definitely cancelled and I will book you someplace else". My buddy and I had already committed to paying folks to run our businesses while we were gone. I informed Jeri that I had shoulder surgery scheduled for the week we returned and would not be able to shoot for 6-12 months. After much discussion between by buddy and myself we decided that since Jeri had a whole year to rebook us and since she cancelled our trip with less than 48 hours notice that we did not trust her or her company any more. I called her and told her we wanted a refund for our trip costs (the trip cost was paid in full the year before) she refused and said "go ahead and sue me". I would like to add that from July of 2016 to June of 2017 I don't think a week went by without me communicating with Jeri Booth. Whenever I emailed her with questions/concerns she would always reply "call me". I have learned a hard lesson. I just don't want any other AR members to get screwed by her or her company, Detail Company Adventures. We did look in to legal action, but three different attorneys looked at how her company is structured and were told that even if we won in court (99.9% chance) we would probably never collect any money. I did receive one response to my initial post saying how well Jeri took care of him, but that event happened many years ago. I filed an Ethics and Grievance complaint with both DSC (no charge) and SCI ($500 charge). DSC told me that since Jeri offered to rebook us (no discussion about the lost airfare-$2200 each as we were flying BC) that they were not taking any action. SCI interviewed me on a conference call and spent most of their time chastising me for not having travel insurance, which I reminded them would not have paid for the booking agent (Jeri) cancelling our trip. When I asked both DSC reps and SCI reps point blank if they would book another hunt with Jeri Booth/Detail Company Adventures after how we had been treated by her all I heard was "crickets". Hopefully this is enough information for you to make your own judgment. If you want more details PM me. "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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I heard about this when it happened from drj’s hunting buddy through my father (who is also friends with the hunting buddy). I don’t know dark other than through his posts on AR. His companion is one that always has some right by my father in their dealings. That being said, the process was BS. Both hunters got shafted. I meant to be DSC Member...bad typing skills. Marcus Cady DRSS | |||
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Utterly unacceptable behavior from a booking agent! | |||
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drj, It would seem you got led down the garden path and perhaps your hunt never was really firmed up. Sorry to hear that! People often say they don't want a contract but it just makes it very clear who is providing what and what the outfitter's and client's responsibility is. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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Mark you are correct. We blew it by assuming that a booking agent who had exhibited at DSC and SCI for many years could be trusted. We will not make that mistake again OR trust DSC or SCI. "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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I think it might a good idea for both SCI and DSC to look into this sort of thing. Incompetent outfitters should not be allowed to exhibit and book clients when they are not capable of looking after them. | |||
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sure wosh they would - but but but - any bests is will ever happen | |||
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So, this is actually a very interesting situation. I know nothing about the internals of SCI, other than once having shared a dinner table with some of their senior leadership, but it is important to note that the full time staff of the DSC is **tiny**. I believe the actual number is something like 12 persons. When a situation like this occurs and accusations are traded, an investigation is necessary, and that costs both time and money. Is the outfitter right? Is the hunter right? Are both totally wrong? Are both perhaps mostly right and were the circumstances merely unfortunate? Barring someone from a convention isn't an action that should be done arbitrarily as it can have profound financial consequences, and the DSC doesn't have the resources to investigate / mediate every dispute in the hunting world. So ... what to do? If an outfitter manages to outrage the entire community, it's easy enough to blacklist him; and rightly so. For lesser offenses, it's much more difficult. Not to cast any doubt (truly!) on the story presented here, but we've seen numerous disputes on the various Internet hunting boards over the years that revealed twists and turns with every new posting. An accusation of malfeasance, in isolation, isn't reasonable grounds for punitive action by the DSC. Don't get me wrong. I'd be mad as a hornet if I'd received the described treatment, and I'd be telling my story all over the Internet, partly to warn others, and partly to inflict financial loss on the person who'd defrauded me. The DSC does care, really, but expectations need to be reasonable. analog_peninsula ----------------------- It takes character to withstand the rigors of indolence. | |||
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True. But I understand there are people still exhibit at both conventions who have been habitually cheating clients. | |||
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analog_peninsula: Just so you know, this incident could not be considered to be a "misunderstanding" in any way, shape, or form. Jeri Booth had a full year to rebook our trip with her picking the dates, etc. then she unilaterally cancelled our trip with less than 48 hours notice, and the only offer to compensate us was "I'll just book you someplace else". Her last words to me on the phone were "just go ahead and sue me". At that point I had never mentioned any legal action. FWIW we did pursue legal action. Two different attorneys that we consulted with unequivocally stated that they had no doubt that we would win in court, but due to how Detail Company Adventures was structured the odds of us ever collecting any money was very low. We then decided not to throw a lot of good money after bad, except for the $500 SCI charged us to file the Ethics Complaint. My $.02 here-this is why I have felt strongly for over 40 years that we need the British system of justice in the U.S., by that I mean "loser pays". Regarding your comment about having "reasonable" expectations: I was a practicing veterinarian for over 42 years in Texas. At one time I was very involved in "organized" veterinary medicine, at the local (county) level, state level, and the national level. I held many offices at the local and state level and chaired many committees. I was involved in growing our annual state convention in to a multi-state meeting (Southwest Veterinary Symposium) which is now in the top 3-5 veterinary meetings annually as far as attendance in the U.S. The exhibitors always paid the bulk of the cost of putting these meetings on (which a lot of attendees did not know), but we incentivized the exhibitors making sales at the meetings (and thereby justifying the expenses they incurred exhibiting) by having drawings for monetary prizes, and the attendees received more chances for the drawings based on the quantity of their purchases. Having said that, the Board that ran the meetings had a strict policy that if a member who attended the meeting had a problem of any kind with an exhibitor, and that exhibitor did not "make it right", they were not allowed to exhibit until they corrected the problem. And yes, the convention always had a waiting list of exhibitors who wanted to attend. Last and not least, the most irritating thing to me was the lack of response from either the DSC executive director or the two SCI Ethics Committee volunteers when I asked all three of them, point blank, "would you personally ever book a trip with Jeri Booth/Detail Company Adventures after the way we have been treated?" and all I heard was "crickets". The DSC executive director's last words to me were "since Jeri Booth is willing to book you on another trip DSC has no further involvement. Disgusting as far as I am concerned, and I will never, ever, book a trip at any of their meetings (assuming I even attend another of their meetings) again. "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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I don't doubt the veracity of you story. I also agree with you about the need for tort reform. Unfortunately, we live in a country where anyone can sue anyone for any or no reason with very few consequences. For that matter, slander and libel laws also need to be brought into a reasonable state, but such is the world in which we live. Once again though, without investigative resources, what is a prudent way for organizations like the DSC to proceed? If you follow the online forums at all, you know that people fight at the drop of a hat; sometimes they drop the hat themselves. I've seen the most bitter exchanges here on AR over questions about as objectively significant as, "How many spirits can dance on the head of a pin?" A third party observer would note that you were offered a rebooking, but rejected it. What other redress could be asked of a booking agent? More to the point, once you told Cory Mason that you were offered a rebooking and rejected it, what did you expect from him? The DSC can't guarantee customer satisfaction for every product and service purchased at the convention. It's an unreasonable standard for any trade show. I've seen thousands of products, at dozens of venues, at which I just shake my head at the marketing propaganda. Who would believe such utter garbage? Ultimately, a business' reputation depends on the satisfaction of their customers; compare ATN and Sightmark in the world of thermal imaging as an example. None of this is meant to minimize your experience. As I mentioned above, I'd be just as mad as you are and I'd tell anyone who would listen exactly what happened. But organizations like the DSC can do very little for situations other than outright systematic fraud or widespread public notoriety where failures are public and unambiguous. All of this is a round about way of asking, "What would you have the DSC do as a systematic policy?" Have you followed any of the threads on AR about the outrageous behavior inflicted on outfitters and guides by some of their more troublesome clients? My point isn't that you aren't 100% in the right; it sounds like you are. My point is that if the DSC chose to become involved with customer service disputes, it would have to be equally fair to both parties, and that requires investigation, mediation, etc., etc. As I'm sure you know, those humans are quarrelsome creatures. The DSC members that I've know are hunters who lay out hard-earned cash for hunts with outfitters / booking agents, just like you did and feel exactly the same way that you do about these kinds of failures. They really do care, but it's important to understand that they must act with imperfect information. In an effort to be fair to everyone, most of the time the least unfair action is to stay out of disputes and let the greater hunting community judge the right and wrong of individual conflicts. analog_peninsula ----------------------- It takes character to withstand the rigors of indolence. | |||
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Let's start a fix here then. Why not create a "Blacklisted Outfitters" forum here, editable only by moderators? When this type of thing comes up, a "Blacklist Proposal" thread can be created to discuss the matter and the community can ultimately make the call. analog_peninsula ----------------------- It takes character to withstand the rigors of indolence. | |||
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Sounds like a plan to me. While we are at it, to be fair, start a "thumbs up" list as well. My first contribution to "thumbs up" would be Joe Patterson at Trek in Florida. I remember when I first got on AR many years ago one of the most valuable posts was the "Packing List" thread. While it is many years old I have referred to it as recently as last year. I am not averse to going on a trip with a handshake with a few outfitters I have been with (but I can count them on one hand). How about a thread listing the minimum things that should be in a contract (currently) and things that could have/have happened that should set off "alarm bells"? That said, I'm still not letting DSC and SCI off the hook "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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analog_peninsula: I just saw your post before the one I just responded to. Like it or not, I believe that the vast majority of folks that attend DSC and SCI conventions assume that the exhibitors are reputable. After all, what is SCI's motto? I believe it is "First For Hunters"? Absolute Bullshit. You know and I know that everyone that exhibits at SCI and DSC does so because the success of their business depends on it, otherwise they wouldn't shell out the big bucks that they do to exhibit (and work their asses off while there). Are you going to tell me that if DSC did not tell Jeri Booth that she had to make this right or she could not exhibit at DSC again that she wouldn't have done right by us? Give me a break. "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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Forgot to add: as I stated above I was in the business of dealing with "humans" for over 42 years. Did I have PIA clients? Absolutely. Did I fire some? Absolutely. That said, one of the biggest PIA's I had as a business owner was to remind my staff that if I fired every PIA client we had we would have to shut our doors. I am intimately familiar with dealing with "humans". "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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Last and not least I can document EVERYTHING I stated in my complaint about Jeri Booth. SCI at least asked for documentation. DSC barely asked for anything. "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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analog_peninsula: OK, I need to take a deep breath and address all the points in your response defending DSC. Yes, Cory Mason did state that Jeri Booth offered to "rebook" us. Two points: 1. She never offered to address the fact that we each had to eat over $2200 in biz class airfare; and 2. and MUCH more importantly, SHE REFUSED TO GIVE US A CONTRACT!!! Would you have "rebooked" with her under these circumstances? What assurance did we have that the same damned thing would not have happened to us? NONE!!! "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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Last and not least I am not asking DSC to "guarantee" or "warranty" everything exhibited/sold at DSC. For goodness sakes, the food and drink often sucks  . We are talking about close to $13,000.00 that two regular attendees (one of which is an over thirty year exhibitor at DSC) have been screwed out of. Not chump change. "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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I mentioned some of the same to Jeri Booth and basically got her middle finger salute. "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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I would like to first state that you got a raw deal. No doubt about it. However, it MAY be for reasons other than what you are seeing. I am not saying it was this way, it MIGHT be. What if the Detail Company in fact did everything right and the outfitter cancelled at the last minute? Who would be at fault in that circumstance? I have experienced a last minute cancellation by an outfitter in South America. It happens. I think one has to consider the practical problems associated with publicly hammering on a company that didn't perform. It is not what SCI and/or DSC are in business to do. They aren't staffed to perform investigations of every hunt that is alleged to not go the right way. DSC is especially not staffed to do such investigations. These allegations can be problematic for those making them. I state this from personal experience. I made negative posts herein about a person and his company. They were truthful. This person sued, myself, DSC and about 10 other people making sorts of crazy allegations. No one had to pay a penny to this guy but it cost me $286,000 in legal fees. My advice to you is to be very careful about the proposed blacklist. Good luck. | |||
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Larry, Great points. I do feel drj’s angst directed at the organizations is misplaced. Ms. Booth/Detail Company do seem to have some culpability from what I’ve heard. I still think there could’ve been a better “make good” to make drj and companion whole. As always, there are always two sides to the pancake, regardless of the thickness. I meant to be DSC Member...bad typing skills. Marcus Cady DRSS | |||
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I do not doubt that Ms. Booth has issues in this. The sue me comment says a lot. | |||
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Larry and Marcus: I have followed many posts that each of you have made during my time on AR and I respect both of you and your opinions. Having said that, I would like to address your comments: Larry: There is no doubt that Jeri Booth unilaterally cancelled our trip, causing us to have to eat over $2200 each in airfare plus the trip cost. I have been in direct communication with the outfitter in Argentina and he has informed me, in writing, that he told Jeri Booth, in writing, exactly what it was going to cost for us to rebook our hunt. He informed me that when Jeri Booth booked our hunts that he was charging $3500 each at the time, and Jeri Booth paid him $2800 for each of us (20% commission). We paid Jeri Booth $4350 each. The outfitter told me that he told her that if we wanted to come by ourselves that he would have to charge us $1K each. She told us that the increase cost was going to be $460 each. When she cancelled our hunt her exact words to me were "he wants $1000 more for you to go and I'm not going to pay that". Based on this we can only assume that she was trying to "fill his lodge" and was going to recoup our increased cost from other hunters-what other explanation could there be. Marcus: Yes, we are frustrated with DSC and SCI. I find it hard to believe that if either organization would have taken the simple step of telling Jeri Booth that she would have to make this right with us or she might not be able to continue to exhibit that she would have done so. Larry: Regarding your comment about her saying "go ahead and sue me"-we did look in to legal action to recover our money. The first attorney that we contacted in Houston (whom we were referred to by a hunter that we had traveled with to South America before) initially said he would take our case, then after a couple of days he notified me that he was not going to take our case because he realized that he had represented Jeri Booth in a similar case previously and was concerned about a conflict of interest ethically. That attorney referred us to another attorney who agreed to look in to our case. He advised us that while he could give us over 90% assurance that we would prevail in court, after he researched how Detail Company Adventures was structured, the likelihood of us actually collecting on a judgment was very low. We decided not to throw any more "good money after bad" (except the $500 SCI charged us to investigate). I'm sure Jeri Booth told us to "go ahead and sue me" was because she knew she had legal protections in place. "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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Who pocketed your money? Booth or the outfitter? | |||
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Both. "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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Jeri pocketed $3100 ($1550 each) and the outfitter $5600 ($2800 each). "Never, ever, book a hunt with Jeri Booth or Detail Company Adventures" | |||
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Perhaps you should talk to law enforcement. That might be a felony on Ms. Booth’s part. | |||
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drj, Thanks for the clarification. It sounds like the entire transaction screwed both of you to the benefit of Jeri/Detail and the outfitter. I hate hearing situations like that and thankful for this forum to educate others about the bad or shady operators. A fine example of this is regarding the reemergence of an outfitter who did not take care of business the right way. Your tag line and those with Blair WW are also out there to make others think twice before using with entity. There are too many reputable people out there than to take a chance. Regarding the organizations handling claims such as yours, the $500 SCI charged is ridiculous. DSC disregarding the complaintis also. It might make sense to have something like the State Bar of Texas (I’m sure the veterinary/medical and other professional boards do as well). Basically, allow for someone with an issue to submit a written explanation of all details. Should it have merit, as yours does, allow the other side to respond in writing to the specific issues. I know it’s almost like serving as an arbitrator and no idea what sanctions might be available or enforced, but just throwing it out there. I meant to be DSC Member...bad typing skills. Marcus Cady DRSS | |||
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To be constructive here, let's ask what the DSC **should** do in this type of situation. Twenty years ago, it was perfectly sufficient to have a conversation somewhere along the lines of, "Bob, you and I have been friends for ten years and outfitter Baboons Unlimited screwed me over. You're an officer of the club, so make an announcement at the next monthly meeting, and everyone will know they shouldn't do business with Baboons U." In a small, local club, this kind of response is perfectly reasonable, but when you grow the scale to mediating conflicts between thousands of individuals, there's no possible way to arrive at a just resolution without an investigative arm of the organization, which is far, far beyond the means of the DSC. It just isn't possible. Some of the warnings earlier in this thread about legal consequences are well taken. As mentioned above, anyone can sue anyone in America for anything or nothing. A simple "Not Recommended" forum here that lists names without making any assertions about conduct should obviate the need for most legal concerns. analog_peninsula ----------------------- It takes character to withstand the rigors of indolence. | |||
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