Gentlemen

I'm a bit curious on the "new" hevi-shots from remington.

Anyone who has used them and what the opinion?

Cheers
/ JOHAN

I have used Hevi-Shot for the last three seasons. I found it works very well on ducks and geese.I use 12g, 3inch mags, #4 shot, and have flattened geese, DOA-dead on air, at fourty yards. My longest shot was 70-75 yards, witnessed. The stuff is heavier than lead, stronger than steel, and throws a tight pattern. I use an improved cylinder choke for everything. Make sure your shotgun is safe for steel before using the Hevi-Shot. Subscribe to their newsletter to get special offers, if you live here in the states. Check out their web site, www.hevishot.com for much more info.
Jeff in Texas

Johan,

I've used Hevi-Shot for a couple of seasons. It's great stuff. It's deadly an awful long way out. Try it; if you're hitting the bird it'll go down, even big geese at long, long distances. Open chokes still keep tight patterns.

Steve

I handload #4 Hevishot for duck & goose hunting for my son. This stuff is amazing at its lethality. I use 1 1/8oz pf shot and have seen him kill geese at a very long range, and they come down dead, no sailers, no submariners. I shoot a sxs and wish I could use Hevi. My Bismuth is pretty good, but not nearly in the same class as Hevi.
Fred in Colorado

Once you try it you will never go back to steel shot. I have been using it for a few years now and it is definitely worth the extra you pay for it.

Doug

I must respectfully disagree, sort of. I shoot waterfowl fanatically, some say, to the tune of well over 100 days a year. The way I like my birds is in close, and since I normally won't take a shot past 40 yards, see no need for HS, BIS, or TI. Sure, if I could buy the stuff for the same as steel I'd use it all the time, but at $1.50-2.00 *a shot*, no thanks, especially since I go through around 3 cases of shot a season (750 rounds). Now if you like to shoot at birds at 50-75 yard ranges, that's your choice, but I've seen enough people try to know it's 50% luck, and 50% skill, and a 1:1 chance at simply wounding birds is not on my agenda. I have seen some birds come down at staggeringly long distances, but the customary and unfortunate result of this has been that the few hunters, usually the casual/inexperienced ones, who have once pulled it off now feel that they can reliably kill them out that far, and keep shooting at that distance. On their frequent subsequent failures, it then becomes "ah damn, must have missed", when probably it's more likely they put a pellet or three in the bird, and it's going to fly off to die later of a raging infection. Not for me, thanks.

I haven't yet received an answer, but of all the birds I have killed pass shooting, jumping and over blocks, not a one yet has noticed that I was using 'only' steel. But then it's your dime, as we say.

Cheers from New England,

Leighton

Casual/inexperienced ones?

I would say that it would take the more experienced ones to understand the advantages of Hevi shot.

I am very fortunate in that I have had the pleasure to hunt with a few of the best gunners in the business over the years for waterfowl and other species, In all cases since its introduction Hevi-Shot, Bismuth etc has been in the blind for our waterfowl hunts.

If you shoot that many days you have certainly seen a hit bird continue to fly off for a while then all of a sudden drop from the sky after being hit with SS. If this has never happened to you and you drop every bird you have shot at you should consider shooting competitively.

SS does not possess the properties to truly make an effective hunting load unless the birds are hit straight on with quite a few more pellets at much closer ranges than with the HS.

Steel shot works as is proven every waterfowl season, it is just not NEARLY as effective when it comes to knockdown killing ability which is also proven every season.

BTW- I shoot appx 40-50 cases min of shells every year,waterfowling, upland, turkey and the various trap, sporting clay events I shoot across the country.

just my 2cents

Doug

>I would say that it would take the more >experienced ones to understand the advantages of >Hevi shot.



The advantages have been stated, and it doesn't take a PhD. to figure out why. HS is more dense, hits harder, and can take birds down at farther distances. I never argued that. My point was, and is, if you're like me, you call them in close and pick your shot, and the advantages of a $2.00 load become moot. There hasn't been the duck made that'll take a well-placed load of steel 2s in the lips in close and fly away. What *is* clear in my mind that there are people who try to use the reputation of HS and other pricey notox loads as a substitute for practice, skill and patience. "Hey, there's a duck at 60 yards. Since I have this magical $2.00 HS load in the chamber, I think I'll let fly..."



>I am very fortunate in that I have had the >pleasure to hunt with a few of the best gunners >in the business over the years for waterfowl and >other species, In all cases since its >introduction Hevi-Shot, Bismuth etc has been in >the blind for our waterfowl hunts.



If you can afford to spend 2.00 a pop, hey, that's terrific. Very happy for you. Shoot a million dollars' worth. I prefer not to have to pay $1000 for waterfowl ammo every season fopr something I see is unnecessary, but then that's just me.



>If you shoot that many days you have certainly >seen a hit bird continue to fly off for a while >then all of a sudden drop from the sky after ?>being hit with SS.



Yeah, and I've seen it with lead, TI, BIS and HS too. If you don't break a wing or hit the head or neck, any bird will do it's best to make a getaway. Not sure of your point. Are you suggesting that there are exponentially more cripples with steel? If so, then might I suggest you wait a bit longer or pick your shots better. Look, there's no question in my mind that the notox products are superior to steel in some ways, and I *never* said that steel is better when push comes to shove. What I *did* say is that steel, if used *within its limitations*, has no trouble killing birds. It's the hunter who makes the biggest difference as far as I am concerned, not what kind of metal you stick through it's beak at 1450 FPS.



>If this has never happened to you and you drop >every bird you have shot at you should consider ?>shooting competitively.



I hunt for my pleasure and sanity, not for competition. That said, of course I've lost birds. But I don't blame the friggin' ammo. I blame myself for missing an easy shot, or for taking one a bit outside my regular range. And then there are those WTF moments in every serious bird hunter's life, where there is no logical or practical explanation as to how the hell *that* one got away. :c)



>SS does not possess the properties to truly make >an effective hunting load unless the birds are >hit straight on with quite a few more pellets at >much closer ranges than with the HS.



OK, we've been over that, and first off, I say BS on the 'effective hunting load' comment. My crew and I killed some 700 ducks and geese last year. That's ineffective?



I derive much more pleausre in fooling birds into landing right in my blocks than decking one at 65 yards that had no intention of stopping for a visit, so the power of HS, again, is not a big deal for me.



>Steel shot works as is proven every waterfowl >season, it is just not NEARLY as effective when >it comes to knockdown killing ability which is ?>also proven every season.



Again, at 20 yards, IT DOES NOT MATTER.



>BTW- I shoot appx 40-50 cases min of shells >every year,waterfowling, upland, turkey and the >various trap, sporting clay events I shoot >across the country.



I shoot upland and turkey too, and fool around with clays, but that doesn't have a whit to do with what we were talking about, best I can tell.

And yes, I've lost clays using steel too, but I'm not going to blame the shot for that either.



Cheers,



Leighton

I've shot a lot of ducks and geese over the years and a helluva lot more doves and I only shoot steel when I'm out of hevi-shot or other premium shot.



I've heard all this crap about steel "kills them just as good at 20 yards" as lead, tungsten, bismuth, and now hevi-shot and I can tell you from personal experience in many, many blinds that is pure BS. Of course, at 20 yards it will kill them if they're centered, but the birds all aren't centered, even by the best of shots. Then, that 20 yard "gimme" becomes a going away 40 or 50 yard (or more) cripple you have to shoot in the butt and STEEL frigging WON'T kill that bird, unless you happen to break a wing or hit them in the head. Hevi-shot will crush them if you're on them.

Quote:

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OK, we've been over that, and first off, I say BS on the 'effective hunting load' comment. My crew and I killed some 700 ducks and geese last year. That's ineffective?

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You're damn right that's ineffective. I don't know how many are in your "crew" but a crew implies at least 3. If they all shoot as many shells as you do, that's well over 3 shots per duck, according to you in the "don't miss" zone.

Screw it, do yourself and the ducks a favor, buy or reload better shot. You'll kill more ducks with fewer shots, I don't give a damn what range you care to shoot them at. BTW, premium shot is made FOR the good shot, a miss is a miss with anything.



PS: not that it matters, but the killingest DUCK load I ever used, when it was legal, was the 2 3/4 inch 1 1/2 ounces of Federal Premium copper plated BBs. I sure hated to shoot the last of them up in Canada after our lead shooting was closed, I wish I had saved some for souvenirs. I backed up many shooters and friends letting them shoot their 2 or 3 shots and then killing the bird, often well in excess of 60 yards. Hevi-shot is better, but I haven't had the reasons to push it that hard yet, but it will CRUSH big Canadas at ranges well beyond what most people will consider.



Wishing you and yours a good hunting season this year.

Johan:

Sorry, got sidetracked. Back to the original question.

Hevi-shot is very lethal shot, likely the most lethal ever loaded so far. However, unless non-toxic shot is required in Sweden or your hunting area, the advantages over GOOD lead loads, while present, is not that significant. I'd shoot lead if I could. Easier on the wallet and the gun. Hevi-shot is very hard, more or less like steel and cannot, or at least probably should not, be used in many of the classic old doubles or older single barrels. Good shooting.

We can argue back and forth into eternity on this, but since I'm kinda' booked up, I'll leave you with this shot, er, thought, fatcat. You use what you feel like in the blind, and I'll do the same. You want to pay for HS, go right ahead. I'll use my 'ineffective' steel and eat duck all year, every year, and enjoy myself.



The original poster asked about HS, and I gave my opinion, and you yours. I guess what we have here is a classic difference of opinion, and I can live with that. But spare me your lectures about HS being the only thing good enough to kill ducks, because that's a bunch of bullshit. As far as your claim of playing backup gun hero and killing birds "well in excess of 60 yards", let me get this straight: you kill ducks with afterburners on, heading out, at well over 60 yards? What's 'well over' 60? 62? 67? Bring your rangefinder along in the blind, did you? Why not just go ahead and call it 70, or 100 even? Sheeeit, *now* I've heard it all.



Cheers,



Leighton



P.S. A 1.5 oz load of BBs for ducks, huh? We differ in strategies indeed.

I could care less whether you believe my shotgunning stories. I have multiple witnesses that can attest to their veracity. If you can afford to duck hunt 100 days a year, then you're either a complete bum or you can afford better shells. Only you know the answer to that.

And yes, I've killed quite a few going away ducks IN EXCESS of 60 yards with that load of 1 1/2 ounces of BBs. Do I take that as a first shot, nope, but if someone has hit a duck, I shoot until the duck is down or I'm empty, which doesn't take long since I normally shoot an O/U. Since you are so knowledgeble about duck hunting I won't bother to explain why big shot works better than smaller shot on ducks and geese. I'll just refer you to the Winchester tests as a starting point. Suffice it to say, just like in big game hunting, it is better to use a load that will handle the marginal shots that we sometimes are forced to take. After all, if it will kill them at 60 it'll damn sure kill them at 20, now won't it?

First time I ever saw hevi-shot used was in Canada on a walking woounded Canada Goose a friend had shot. He was walking in thin soup over about 3 feet of mud. We both were nearly exhausted from working that marsh, and spotted the goose, which he had wingtipped 600 or 700 yards out in the marsh, on the way out. Goose was walking away and he crushed it with hevishot 4s at about 50 yards. Doesn't sound like much until you have chased and shot at a few wounded greater Cans. Try that shot with steel and see how many first shot dead geese you get. Of course, if you hit it in the head he'll die, but that ain't as easy as is sounds at 50 yards.

I'd bet that you have never used hevi-shot and don't have a clue what the real differences are between it and steel, KILLING differences that are so apparent to someone who has used it and knows how to shoot.

And no, you haven't heard it all. 100 yard doves?

Good shooting.

I choose not to pay 1000 dollars a year for ammo and that makes me a bum, huh? You wacky Texans really have it all figured out, don't you?



Big shot will work better on ducks in some circumstances, but given that I'd rather put 6 # 4s in a bird rather than 1 BB, I guess again it's a matter of choice and experience(s). I use BBs pretty much only for geese, and I often shoot them over corn with 2s as they're landing. Works fine.



I have used HS, and some of my buddies use it. And hell yes it works. But IMO not any better than steel in close, for all *practical terms*. Yeah, I wring some necks, but big deal. Since I choose not to take fool 60 yard shots, it doesn't matter; down they go as long as I do my part and hit them well. By the way, for every 60--oops, I meant, *far in excess of 60 yard shot (he he)* kills you've made, how many have you taken where your target kept flying? Hmm. Don't tell me--none, right?



As far as 100 yard doves (another TX okey dokey), afraid that here in the PDR of MA, they call 'em song birds. Shame, since they're here in good numbers, and the one I ate once upon a time tasted pretty good. Don't ask me how I know that.



I offer the white flag. You hunt waterbirds, so I guess you can't be *all* bad. I have a few pictures I'd like to post of birds killed with steel, but I just can't figure out how to do it. I wish there were a simple attach file option. Oh well.



Cheers, and good shooting there, Fatcat. Early goose opens in just over a month. Limit 5. Yeehaw!



Leighton

I guess I have to disagree with you. i have shot a lot of ducks over the last 37 years. Steel sucks I have watched way to many ducks in good range under 40 yards take a load of steel and fly off. They would have been dead with lead bismuth or Hevi shot. I hand load hevi shot a lot cheaper then buying loaded shells. Because it works so much better you don't have to load big mag charges of it to get it to work thus lowering your cost.

No go ahead and keep using your steel but for me there are a lot better ways to kill waterfowl.

That's fine, but since it's a rarity that I take a 40 yard shot, I don't care that much what happens at what I personally consider to be long distances. I almost never take a first shot @ 40 yards, and if I do it's a *really* slow day. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. A question, though, for all the naysayers on steel: when was the last time you used it? I had this debate on another site a few years back, and learned after much to- do about the lethality of steel that most claiming steel was garbage had not shot the much more effective, higher velocity stuff; they used it for awhile after lead was banned, and it was crap. I personally have had some lousy results with some older, slower loads, that were good for nothing. But with trusty rusty along and 3" loads of Winchseter Supreme in #2 humming along at 1450+, there hasn't been any type of duck I've met yet that didn't appreciate that it does kill effectively. This includes canadas up to 15 pounds, and big, tough seaducks such as eider.

Cheers,

Leighton

P.S. Finally, some waterfowl talk on AR!