I've hunted grouse with a 12 gauge and 20 gauge for many years but lately I've enjoyed carrying a lightweight .410 when I hunt grouse in the mountains here in Utah. I love the challenge and the light weight gun it is chambered in. I started with an old Iver Johnson .410 single shot when I was young and I've come full circle. Has this happened to anyone else?

As long as the gun fits you well you should be able to smoke the grouse without any problem. I have used .410 at times when hunting grouse in Canada...it is a bit challenging but a lot of fun.

McVik

I'm too old nowadays to tell you that I,too, came full circle about the 410 -But your post caught my eye because a 410 was my first "shotgun" (Win.Mod.42)at about age 13. I put it in quotes because I didn't think of it as a real shotgun until I got a 16 at about age 15. I shot rats with a 410 in a barn routinely with it. I started to use it on crows -and dropped them. Still, I never thought of it as a shotgun. I was a ruffed grouse hunter all my life -and envy you if you were dropping ruffs with a 410. It just never occurred to me to use a 410 on grouse. (They were so darn hard to swing with and fire that I wanted as much of a spread pattern as I could get!) Anyway, thanks for the post. It revived further memories about the 410.

.410 shotguns were often designed as "toys for boys"....they were cheap,short, light, and not necessarily a good hunting or shooting tool.

Get one in a Browning (or other quality built) man sized O/U and you'll change your mind about the .410. Hell, try a M-23 Winchester golden quail side by side.....what a treat!!!

Get some large pieces of cardboard and pattern them at 40 yards.....it'll amaze you!.....Use a 3" shell with 7 1/2 shot....and all of a sudden.....it's not for kids anymore!

I guide Greywing partridge hunts in the Karoo highlands in South Africa over schooled English Pointers. This is a challenging hunt, but extremely rewarding and it takes place in a breathtaking environment with endless and dramatic vistas.
Now Greywing hunting is a strictly 12 and 20 gauge affair and you load up with 1 ¼ ounces of No.5 shot!
I was approached to guide Italian hunter Alberto Rizzini of Caza Rizzini fame with his team of camerawomen to make a show for Sky Italy. Now which guide would be able to resist this? CATCH - He wants to shoot Greywing with a .410!
So I agree and take my 12 gauge with so he can use that instead once he realizes it can not be done. Boy was I wrong. He pitched up with a beautiful Denis Fontana side-by-side in .410 (3inch), choked improved modified and full. It patterned in about 8 inches at 20 yards!
When the 1st Greywing fell to the little .410 I thought it was luck, but when he made his bag on the first day, I had to eat my hat! Well, in the end all had a great time and Alberto got his bag limit every day.
My conclusion: the .410 in an exceptional shot's hands can be used to hunt game birds effectively. (By the way, he shot some Egyptian geese with it too) BUT, it can not be the gauge of choice to the average shot gunner.
You can see photos of his hunt on my Facebook group. Search for Karoo Wingshooting, or on my webpage's gallery. Go to www.KarooWingshooting.co.za. Once I have a copy of the DVD, I will put on some video footage of this hunt on Facebook and on the website. So, join me on Facebook and I will send you a reminder when the video clips are available.

Greywing
Enjoyed your post....thanks for sharing your experience.

I have used the 410 for the last couple years to hunt turkey, dove, and ducks. I have been pleasantly suprised with its performance. In all cases it is a "special situation" gun. Fore ducks (3" #6 steel 3/8oz loads) it is used for timber/slough hunting of mallards. For turkey hunting it is a 25 yard max gun (using 3" #7.5lead)used in TIGHT woods. For dove I use it in very good fields(3" #7.5 lead) where you have the option of picking and chosing your shots. It just enjoy using it when shots are close to prolong a hunt that normally would take a short while into a little longer hunt by making you be much more selective on your shots.

I have extensivly patterned both the 7.5 lead load and the #6 steel load before using them in the field. Both these loads met the widely used standards for effective loads for the bird.

thanks
224TTH

My first shot on a real hunt was with a .410 at a rabbit being closely pursued by an old beagle named Tippy.

It was my friends dads gun (an over / under .22 and .410). To my friends dads horror I missed the rabbit and barely missed Tippy as the shot pattern clearly was visible in the snow just inches in front of Tippy.

A few years later I bought a .410 single shot and it sits beside the front door now as it has for years.

That $45 gun has accounted for more critters than all my other guns combined. Many possums in the dogfood, rabbits eating the garden, woodpeckers drilling holes in my wooden house, squirrels chewing on my wood shingles, copperheads hiding in the flower garden waiting to kill somebody, blackbirds crapping on my truck and one rabid fox have felt its sting. For most of them it was the last thing they felt.

Just last night it accounted for two armadillos who were digging in Irenes flower bed. That always calls for a death sentence.

I don't know how anyone could live or defend his home and family from varmints without a .410.

1/2oz of Hevi #9 will make a believer out of you! I have also found that most 410s have fairly tight chokes on tubeless guns. Getting a set of tubes for your 410 is one of the best modifications you can do.

quote:

Originally posted by 224TTH:
Fore ducks (3" #6 steel 3/8oz loads) it is used for timber/slough hunting of mallards.

*3/8* oz?!? Wow! I will say that I started with heavy loads in 3" 12 ga, and have always been a proponent of loads I know well and smack the heck out of ducks/geese, but in recent years have begun to experiment with lighter loads and smaller shot. I've been pretty surprised at what they're capable of. Perfect example: prior to a recent javelina/small game/waterfowl trip to AZ, I found a case of something I thought somewhat bizarre. They were Winchester 2.75" 1 oz loads of steel 7s. I was like, WTF? Who would hunt big ducks with that load. I got a case of it for like 22 bucks! Well, guess what? It was perfect for what we were going for--if it worked!-- as we would likely be chasing small game (quail, rabbits, etc) as well as waterfowl. Since the steel could be legally used on both, I figured I'd see how it did on a duck or two, and see what happened. What happened is that the ducks couldn't tell that I wasn't using my pet 3" 1 3/8 oz of #2s, that's what. I was downright shocked at what that little wimpy load could do. I'm happy about the whole learning experience, as I often will hunt both waterfowl and upland in the same day, and am always worried about getting stopped with lead I use for upland squirrel/rabbit/pheasant/grouse when ducking. Now it certainly won't become my go-to load, but I'd not hesitate one bit to use it all day long on teal or on larger birds decoying in close.

I haven't used a .410 for anything but potting red squirrels, but it's sure a pleasure to tote around!

Anyway, cool thread.

This old man has read the above posts about shooting ducks using a 410 -with awe. Even with 3" shells, I just don't believe that a 410 could be effective on ducks. I hunted ducks along a brook on my property as a boy and young man -and I was jumping them (mallards and teal)and the shots were maybe 10-15 yards at most -and it never occurred to me to use a 410 - because I had to finish off enough cripples using my 16. Oh, well, I guess I wasn't as good with a 410.

McVik; This is kind of funny, my Grandpa gave me his Iver Jhonson 410: Sixtytwo years ago. It was used for years, and much loved, and still is. A week ago I stopped into my favorate gun store; and they had a like new IJ Chapion 410, just like mine. I now have two. Jack

Gerry

The effectiveness of the 410 on waterfowl has more to do with shot development such as Hevi-Shot than the size of the shell. There is a poster NV Guide. He has provided me with load data for 410 using 1/2oz of #9 Hevi-Shot that is lethal on ducks to further than you would believe. It does take some practice though. NV Guide has also used a 28ga to take geese, swans and I think cranes too. It is as much load development and the shooter as it is the guage of shotgun. No doubt there are those that think the only way to really hunt gees is with a 10ga. I feel sorry for them.

quote:

Originally posted by Gerrypeters375:
This old man has read the above posts about shooting ducks using a 410 -with awe. Even with 3" shells, I just don't believe that a 410 could be effective on ducks.

I might just have to add that Roberto go for head and neck shots only! And he used 19 grams (2/3 Onces) of No.7 1/2 shot.

I would like to find a handload to try some TSS in my 410. If you have a load for the 410 in hevi shot/TSS I would be interested in it.

The 3/8 oz load I use is #6 steel loaded by winchester. This year federal is loading the 410 in 3/8oz in steel 6 and 7. I am getting 106 pellets average in a 30" circle at 25 yards with this load of steel #6. Of my three test patterns I only had 1 pellet outside of the 30" circle. The gun is a full choke mossberg pump.
You need 85-90 pellets in the 30" circle to be an effective mallard load.

Any yes a friend uses 20ga 3/4oz steel #7 on mallards at times and it is effective within a reasonable range.

thanks
224TTH

drewhenrytnt

Many thanks for your informative post. (There's a lot of water under the bridge since I hefted a 410!) I'm perfectly willing to accept your thoughts. I do have to mention that kamo gari -a quite experienced duck hunter -certainly far more so than I {he's one of those madmen who hunt from a blind where the ice piles up) is apparently not too keen on using the 410 on ducks. Look, I loved the 410 - I shot crows with it -and our local crows were certainly as big as any wood duck.Fact. I shot rats with it in a barn. kamo gari shot red squirrels with it. That tells you what the 410 was used for in our neck of the woods when I was a boy and sapparently even today. (NY and MA)