Thanks for the replies gents,
All things considered, seems I'll end up sticking with the 12 guage. My current Brittany has done very well with conditioning to gunfire by obedience training outside the gun club (about 100m) and slowly bringing him closer in overtime. It's worked well so far. The .410 was an option that all things considering may not be such a good idea, one thing I definately don't want is the pup's first "real" retrieve being a wounded bird, and the crack of the smaller bores is sharper.
Cheers...
Con

Con,

I'm a professional trainer. You'd be far better off with a 28 ga. There are some fairly cheap ones available in the US. Not sure about Australia, of course. EAA comes to mind because I have one of their over unders for just the reasons that you mention. It takes a beating and I don't have to worry. I tried a 410. As was mentioned they do crack and they are hard to hit and kill with.

knobmtn

Guys,
I'm debating purchasing a cheap Boito .410 SxS and just wanted to run my reasoning by some others with experience. Reason I'm after a "cheap" .410 is that the gun will be used to assist in training a young dog and my priority is the dog not the gun, so the gun needs to be able be accidently damaged without me having a coronary. I'm thinking of using the .410 to introduce the young dog to gunfire but also to "hunt" planted quail/pigeons with. Most planted birds will be "shot" with a primer filled cartridge, but if the dog gets bored, then a few birds will be taken to recapture interest. I figure ranges will be short as no shots will be taken on bumped birds, only those pointed and within 25m. In this role does the .410 have any merit? How effective is a 3" .410 on quail etc and is it significantly quieter than a 12 guage loaded with say a 7/8 ounce load at 1200fps?
Cheers...
Con

Con:

I'm an old retired hunter and haven't trained a bird dog in many years but I am quite familiar with the 410 (like a lot of American hunters for whom it was their first shotgun)

You ask about shooting quail at "25m". Figuring a meter as 39", I figured that this was about 27 yards. Using 3" shells and if you're a real good wing shot, you can put down quail at that range but frankly I think it's stretching it.

The 410 with 3" shells has a certain "cracking" sound to it. That brings up what I really want to ask you.

You are very right in not wanting to scare a pup out of his wits and ruin him from day One -but I'm not sure the 410 is the shotgun to start him off with. It isn't as "loud" as a 12 ga - but -and here's the point I want to make - I think the report may be more painful to a pup's ears than even a 12 ga. It's like when you shoot a big bore rifle with a low muzzle velocity -and then shoot a small caliber very high velocity rifle. Didn't the latter bother your ears more? That's what I wonder about -but look, hey, this is a big country and I could even be wrong. (No! Impossible!) I always started a pup off by firing field loads from a 16 ga - AND I always stood off about 100 yards away. (My father or mother, later my wife would hold the pup on a leash. wec all watched the pup's reaction. gradually, over a period of days we closed the distance to perhaps 35 yards. The only point was to get the pup used to gunfire. I always used treats and the pup always got a lot of playing, hugging and petting so that the pup always associated gunfire with a good time. I then took him out in the field and had the pup watch older dogs do their stuff. Then the pup was introduced to discipline, choke line so he obeyed a whistle, letting him/her make the connection between what I was doing with that shotgun that went off and what i wanted him to do. Retrieving comes almost naturally to a dog. (It's getting the pup to bring it back and not to play with it along the way that you have to work on)

Sorry I went on here but I guess that I only mean that a 410 may be unnecessary. (Sooner or later he/she has to hear the sound of a hunting shotgun like a 20,16 or 12. BTW, don't ever let a young puppy be close by to the sound of a pistol shot for the reasons I mentioned about types of sound. (decibel level)

BTW, this may be irrelevant but we Yanks are very grateful for the help you gave our guys in Iraq. A lot of us know that the Aussie Special Forces were so helpful and saved a lot of lives. (yeah, you also have to know that we have Southerners up here who don't like that word "Yank" but they'll stand for it from the Aussies because they know you mean well!)