so i hit the range yesterday w/ my new 700ML, and was gettin a weird pattern. I was shoot 2 pellets of 777 under a 223gr. p-belt aero tip and was gettin this pattern: first shot, dead center, next 2 shots 1 1/2 inches left, stacked on top of each other. the patterns looked the same 3-4 groups in a row. i ran a bore mop down after every shot. obviously i loaded it consistently, but has anyone ever seen this, or know how this is happening? I think i do need to try pyrodex pellets next time instead of 777.

Instead of another brand name pellet, I would invest in....
1) loose powder for tweaking those patterns
2) a bore brush instead of a mop
3) 2-1/2 to 3" patches dipped with a cleaner-solvent that states it removes copper, lead and plastic fouling.

got a bore snake the other day. works like a charm so far. hope it keeps doin this good.

I've seen some ultra strange grouping in muzzleloaders that I can not explain... Last summer I was developing some loads for a long range 50cal muzzleloader. I tried several different bullets, from 200gr Shockwaves, to 240gr and 300gr XTP's. My best group was 4 shots into 3/8" at 100yds with the 200gr Shockwaves and 120gr of Swiss FFg. The very next day, same range conditions, but now I can barely keep them on a sheet of 8.5 x 11" paper!!! Same thing happened with the 240gr and 300gr XTP's. Excellent one day, out the window the next. I was at a loss after eliminating many factors. I'm pretty good at getting muzzleloaders to sing nicely, but this one is still a mystery... Good luck!!

120 grains of Swiss FF in a 50-cal rifle is not recommended by anyone. It's more pressure-lethal than three pellets of either 777, Pyrodex or American Pioneer sticks. 120 gr. is hot enough to melt plastic into your rifling... something a bore snake cannot remove without a strong plastic dissolving solvent attached.

Bore snakes are fine in non-problem bores. But if you are trying to cure a bore of buildup, a bore snake will not resolve your problem. Use a bore brush to avoid current/future problems.

quote:

a 223gr. p-belt aero tip and was gettin this pattern: first shot, dead center, next 2 shots 1 1/2 inches left, stacked on top of each other.

I would check your fore stock. Make sure you can slide a dollar bill between the barrel and the stock, this has all the ear marks of a tight spot that the barrel contacts once it expands from the heat of the first shot. Other than that where the first shot goes is the important thing with a ML.
Good Luck!

that is true. i only need one shot. the First shot is always DEAD ON accurate, like DEAD on. no less then 1/4" away from the center. lemme go check the free-floating condition.....nope, can't slide anything between the barrel/stock. Will pull out the dremel tomorrow, or soon, and try to take a little material off so that it will be floating. Maybe then I will be able to achieve on holers?? the second 2 shots are always touching, somewhat overlapping. maybe i will be able to accomplish some one holers..can't wait to try it out.

I tried 777 in my new gun. I was using a 460 gr bullet with 100 gr of 777. The gun shot like crap and my nipple and snail screw would not come out. A lot of guys that use 777 have trouble getting the breach plug out. TC came out with a thread tape for HIGH pressure.
I could not get a 50 yard group to save my butt. I also was getting a "crud ring" That ended up being a ring of lead and powder.
I was told to reduce it by, I think it was 15%. I said to heck with it and went to 60 gr and worked up from there. I ended up at 70 gr but I was still getting the crud ring. I went to a 410 gr Hornady 50 Cal and I also switched to pyrodex RS. My first 50 yard group was very nice with 90 gr of Pyrodex RS this was a average group.


I decided to go up to 100 gr and go for 100 yards. This is my best group but I still average 1 1/4" groups for 8 groups.


After I switched it was easy to get the nipple out. The barrel didn't foul with the crud ring. I can shoot around 8 times before I need to brush it out. The first three shots out of this barrel are all the same, perfect. Hunting accuracy is beyond what i ever thought I could get. I do have a stainless steel gun.

I like this gun a lot. It is just what I needed for my BP muledeer hunt this fall. Ron

well thanks for the posts guys. I noticed that when i was taking my gun down to clean, the nipple was extremely hard to get out. I knew it was because of high pressure forcing it back more. I really would like to pick up one of those 100 packs of pyrodex since it's alot cheaper in bulk, and i think i'm going to stick with powerbelts. seem to be a good bullet so far. i was using #11 caps w/ 777, so my guess is it should only get better with pyrodex??

beretta9289,
My opinion, Yes I do think you will have better luck with the Pyrodex. I am also using a #11 magnum cap.
About the bullet it is hard to say. Your twist of your rifle will be what says for sure. Like I said I had ok luck with a 460. I shortened to a 410 and it came together. I tried a 385 gr and the group started to spread out. I do like power belts but the fast twist of your gun might want a little longer bullet just as a test. Ron