I have a Johnston’s Ultimate Muzzleloader which I dearly love. Had it for a few years .

It has done something the last two times I shot it that it has never done before. I shot a deer. To be clear, this was the first shot after cleaning. I went to reload. I could not get the bullet/sabot down the barrel. I pushed so hard that I broke the bullet started.

This happened 2 days ago. I cleaned the gun and it loaded fine. At that point, I thought it was a freak event. Well, I just shot again . The same thing happened.

Any ideas why this is happening?

This may be a stupid question but have you switched sabots?

No. Everything is the same.

Try running a damp patch or a loose fitting nylon brush down the barrel between shots.

Then try some different sabots.

It sounds like your bore is too tight if there is any fouling at all.

It could be a light polishing of the bore could solve the problems too.

Flitz Metal Polish works well at removing rough spots without taking off too much metal

I have shot this gun hundreds of times with the exact same bullets, powder and sabots .
I do not think that is the issue.

How long ago since you shot the gun before these last couple of times? The sabots may have changed with age and are stripping some plastic leaving it behind in the barrel?
All else being exactly the same it has to be a sabot issue, change in burning characteristics of the powder may cause a little fouling but not enough to be a problem for seating the saboted bullet. Plastic on plastic could be the issue.

quote:

Originally posted by eagle27:
How long ago since you shot the gun before these last couple of times? The sabots may have changed with age and are stripping some plastic leaving it behind in the barrel?
All else being exactly the same it has to be a sabot issue, change in burning characteristics of the powder may cause a little fouling but not enough to be a problem for seating the saboted bullet. Plastic on plastic could be the issue.

About a year.

quote:

All else being exactly the same it has to be a sabot issue

Try a new batch of sabots.
Maybe the ones you have now are out of spec on thickness.

If that doesn't help, give the barrel a good scrubbing with a solvent that will dissolve plastics.

As I proposed in my first post, I suspect it is the plastic sabots causing the problem and while they are the same ones you have previously used without issue, they are a year older.
Your cleaning regime before the next shot is solving the problem therefore strongly indicating some form of fouling is being removed, can only be sabot plastic!!
CRC5.56/WD40 dissolves plastic. Dry brush out and run an oiled cloth through a shotgun barrel after a shoot and it looks nice and clean. Spray down the barrel with CRC or WD40 and have a look, you'll see streaks of plastic gunge appearing. Wipe out with a cloth or soft dense bronze brush (I use) and you'll be amazed just how much gunge from the wads has built up. Once all that is out only then do you have a clean barrel.

I had that problem one time. It turned out to some grains of powder right at the end of the muzzle.

Ruined two bullets trying to get them started. One of the guys at the range suggested I do a quick swab down the first few inches of the bore.

I did and problem solved.

BH63

I got my gun back yesterday. The gun was not dirty and had no build up.

Their theory is that the sabots are harder than most because the gun shoots 4 pellets. Further, I have had them for years. They may well have gotten harder over time.

Also, the pellets are super dirty. The combination of the 2 created this problem.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I got my gun back yesterday. The gun was not dirty and had no build up.

Their theory is that the sabots are harder than most because the gun shoots 4 pellets. Further, I have had them for years. They may well have gotten harder over time.

Also, the pellets are super dirty. The combination of the 2 created this problem.

Good result and glad you have got it sorted. Obviously a gun you like using and one that does the job you ask of it. Thanks for posting the outcome, always nice to hear back what the cause of a problem is and how it is fixed. We all learn from that. Now just keep your powder dry

Little late to the conversation but I’ve been messing with higher performance muzzleloaders quite a bit lately. Even though many say it’s not needed, I still swab a slightly damp patch of balistol and water (50/50) after each shot followed by a dry patch. Keeps the fouling consistent and you can load and shoot all day. This is with 777 (definitely needed with that), BH209, and even smokeless loads I. A 50 cal sabot. Takes an extra minute to reload, but oh well.

Year old post.
Friend Jack insisted I get a M/L.
Not convinced and not wanting to spend
much on it. I got a CVA from the Guide
for around $200. .54 cal as I'm an elk
hunter.

Before I had any balls or bullets I got
a Lee REAL mold and cast a 3# coffee can
full of the heavy one's, not sure the wt
now.

Had no clue, and no soft/pure lead on hand
either so I used hard stuff I use for pistol
slugs.

No way in hell of getting them started down
the barrel. Someone said to have the muzzle
relief bored. Gunsmith agreed that would be
a great help and did it for $20 right then.

Sure cured the problem for me. They just drop
in, then push 'em on down with the rod.

Larry this might solve your problem if you
still have it hassling you.

George

I sent this gun back to the manufacturer. They checked it extensively. When they shot it, they had no issue.

To make a long story short, the pellets I used were defective. That has caused the entire issue apparently.

I always swab the bore one time with a pre lubed patch, then reload, even when hunting. At the shot on game, there is no rush for the second shot, either its down and can't get up or its making tracks for a follow up tracking job..At least thats been my experience with muzzle loaders. You probably have a pretty tight bore or need to change powders...

If people would drop all this modern pellet and substitute nonsense and use real black powder, they would not have any issues at all. You quickly learn how to manage it and it will never let you down. Yes I even use sabots and CVA power belts with Black Powder. Works very well.

Larry, 4 powder pellets? Wow, that must create some velocity and energy.

The lure of the black powder gun is killing game like papaw did, black and lead, its the real deal otherwise give me my 30-06..When I see folks hunting deer and elk with a scope muzzle loader, pre made charges, loaded from the breech, I see nothing more than hunting with a single shot modern cartridge rifle, and they get the better seasons and location..so much for a primitive hunting camp...My soap box for today and to each his own..WE raised enough in Idaho as they renamed the hunts "primitive hunts? and thats what is allowed..

quote:

Originally posted by Biebs:
Larry, 4 powder pellets? Wow, that must create some velocity and energy.

Yup.

Packs a serious punch. Dropped a big buck dead in its tracks at 309 yards a couple of years back.

I was having the same trouble with a Remington ultimate ML.

Upon finer reading of the manual they clearly said to run a moistened patch down the bore between shots.

Probably has something to do with the tolerances. This gun is by far the most accurate ML I’ve ever used.

I’d have to look and see if 4 pellets is OK- but my ranges are such that I don’t need 300 yard capability with it…

Isn’t the Johnson and the Remington essentially the same?

They are very similar but not identical as I understand it.