quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Leeper:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
The problem is that Ukraine can never win. The only way to actually defeat Russia is for the USA and/or NATO to get directly involved militarily.

So otherwise…you negotiate.

"Negotiate" is a lot like "suck up". I believe it would have been possible to bring the war to a close, but Trump isn't capable of it. His confused messaging won't do it. Bill

And what EXACTLY did goofy Joe and Barak Hussein do?????

.

At least neither of them bombed another country when told to!

THE ORANGE MAGA FUCKWIT!

NitanHitler’s PUPPET!

SHAME ON AMERICA!

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Leeper:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
The problem is that Ukraine can never win. The only way to actually defeat Russia is for the USA and/or NATO to get directly involved militarily.

So otherwise…you negotiate.

"Negotiate" is a lot like "suck up". I believe it would have been possible to bring the war to a close, but Trump isn't capable of it. His confused messaging won't do it. Bill

And what EXACTLY did goofy Joe and Barak Hussein do?????

.

EXACTLY? Biden provided Ukraine with more than $66 billion in military aid to fight the Ukrainian invaders. Obama left office in 2016, Russia invaded Ukraine in 2022.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Pondoro:

quote:

Originally posted by M.Shy:
He is working on it and you all bitching
What a surprise

The problem is not that Trump is trying, the problem is that he is never consistent. He thereatens with further sanctions one week and the next he is rolling out the red carpet for a war criminal..who has an international arrest order on him..

Putin must be pushed much harder if this war can see its end..

There is the carrot AND the stick in negotiations.

Why would you want someone who is likely compromised to the other party to be negotiating for you, esp. one that has more of his interests in mind than yours?

It is entirely possible for Ukraine to win. If they make it more and more costly for Vlad at some point he will cease or he will have an "accident".

The Afghans made it too costly for the Russians ( with western help).

It is fully within Trumps power to make this massively more painful for Vlad.

Ukraine has permanently changed the way wars will be fought from now on. Their ingenuity and determination thus far has defied all expectations.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:
Trump.....Putin's lap dog

Trump is in over his head, and his ego will not permit him to acknowledge that simple fact.
Someone with imagination and guts will have to fix this off the radar, or it won't get fixed.

As mentioned above, what Ukraine can do is just make it too expensive for Putin to continue.
When the return is less than the investment, the investment stops.

They may decide to never quit resisting. The Holodomor occurred within living memory.

trump's threats are meaningless and putin knows it. He's not going to do anything to Russia.

trump thinks he and putin are pals and business associates doing a real estate deal. He doesn't understand that relations between countries don't work that way, especially with the Russians.

The argument that Ukraine can never win the war may or may not be true. They seem to be doing pretty well so far...and, a lot of people might say they win by not losing. And, they have fought the Russians to a stand-still so far. We should keep feeding them everything they need to fight as long as they are willing.

trump's meeting with Putin ended just the way everybody knew it would. A foreign dictator got a red carpet welcome, a great lunch, a meeting with the President of the United States.... and trump got nothing but egg on his face. He's a inept buffoon. Always has been and always will be.

The security guarantee is arguably a good move I suppose..... if you think the US ought to be unilaterally and on our own guaranteeing Ukraine's security. But, I've seen nothing that indicates Zelensky is going to cede territory in return for it. And, it's most likely an empty promise from trump anyway. He's desperate and will say or do anything to try to get a deal at this point. Does anybody really think the United States is going to attack Russia the next time Putin pushes further into Ukraine? I promise you Zelensky will not believe it. And, why should he?

The same thing could be accomplished by letting Ukraine into NATO but that's not being floated because Putin might escalate in the face of a NATO promise because NATO might actually follow up on that promise. Putin knows trump will not.

I distinctly recall orange jesus promising severe sanctions/consequences if no deal was reached in Alaska. Crickets since Putin played him for the blowhard he is. DON’T MAKE PROMISES YOU CANT OR WON”T KEEP. It simply exposes you as a fraud.

I suspect that trump's upcoming meeting with Zelensky is going to be less about trying to talk him into accepting Putin's conditions with the status quo and more about threatening to cut off the US flow of arms and ammunition to Ukraine unless he takes the deal. Hopefully, the Europeans will promise to take up the slack if that happens.

We need to stand up to Putin. I'm never going to be an advocate of US boots on the ground involvement. But, it seems like the Ukrainians have their shit together when it comes to defending their country. They just need the arms, ammunition and support that allows them to do it. We should supply them with whatever they need to thwart Putin and Russia.

quote:

Originally posted by JTEX:

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Leeper:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
The problem is that Ukraine can never win. The only way to actually defeat Russia is for the USA and/or NATO to get directly involved militarily.

So otherwise…you negotiate.

"Negotiate" is a lot like "suck up". I believe it would have been possible to bring the war to a close, but Trump isn't capable of it. His confused messaging won't do it. Bill

And what EXACTLY did goofy Joe and Barak Hussein do?????

.

Doesn't matter what they did or did not do. The argument that "they were stupid so our guy can be stupid too", doesn't really hold water.
I may be wrong in my assessment, as M.Shy said, but I don't think so. I just think Trump is in over his head and doesn't really know what he's doing. His advisors are too busy ass kissing to be able to offer any much needed support. His followers are not able to judge his actions critically, so everything he does is alright. They will see no fault. Just like Democrats wouldn't see Joe's glaring deficiencies. The world has several problems, and I don't think we have a problem solver. Bill

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:
I suspect that trump's upcoming meeting with Zelensky is going to be less about trying to talk him into accepting Putin's conditions with the status quo and more about threatening to cut off the US flow of arms and ammunition to Ukraine unless he takes the deal. Hopefully, the Europeans will promise to take up the slack if that happens.

We need to stand up to Putin. I'm never going to be an advocate of US boots on the ground involvement. But, it seems like the Ukrainians have their shit together when it comes to defending their country. They just need the arms, ammunition and support that allows them to do it. We should supply them with whatever they need to thwart Putin and Russia.

This!^^^^^^