Oops . . . Rand Paul . . . Tariffs will lead to "political decimation"

03 April 2025, 19:00

At this point even if Trump and MAGAts decided to wake up and realize that the tariff foray was ill-conceived and ill-advised, it is too late. Trump's ego is simply too big for him to back down. That's why he lies even when his nose is rubbed in the truth. So he gets to cripple the economy and destroy the mid-terms. Well done MAGAts. Well done.

Rand Paul predicts Trump tariffs will lead to 'political decimation'

Rand Paul predicts Trump tariffs will lead to 'political decimation,' says Republicans will lose both the House and Senate
The Mirror US

Republican senator Rand Paul says Trump's newest tariffs are political suicide.

The Kentucky senator has been outspoken about Trump's reciprocal tariffs and even voted in favor of a resolution to block Trump's tariffs on imports from Canada on Wednesday, just hours after Trump's "Make America Wealthy Again" ceremony at the Rose Garden.

The resolution passed with a 51-48 vote. Paul told reporters that imposing tariffs has historically gone bad for Republicans.

"Tariffs have also led to political decimation, McKinley most famously put tariffs on in 1890, they lost 50% of their seats in the next election. When Smoot–Hawley put on their tariffs in the 1930's we lost the House and the Senate for 60 years. So their not only bad economically, their bad politically," he said.

This comes after Trump tried to strong arm Paul and other Republican senators on social media into not voting for the resolution. He urged them to “get on the Republican bandwagon, for a change.”

But Paul stood firm and said Trump’s tariff war against Canada is bad for the economy. “Trade is a good thing. Trade is proportional to prosperity and so tariffs are bad economically,” he said. “It’s a terrible idea to run a country by emergency where representatives to vote on raising or lowering taxes.”

Paul said tariffs “are bad for the country, bad for prosperity, bad for the economy.”

“Our Constitution was very specific that taxes — tariffs are a tax — taxes originate in the House, come to the Senate and then go the president,” he said. “They don’t just go to the president and no one else. What kind of system would it be if all of our taxes and laws were passed by one person?”

On Wednesday, Trump unveiled sweeping tariffs that the United States will levy on countries of at least 10% or even higher, increasing the risks of spurring a global trade war.

While Trump claimed that the reciprocal tariffs will cause jobs and manufacturers to come "roaring back" into the US and create stronger competition and lower prices for consumers, economists have far from agreed, sounding alarm bells over dangerous impacts, especially on working-class Americans.

In Trump's speech, the president insisted that tariffs are a revenue-generating mechanism, which was true about 150 years ago. However, with the global economic, social, and political landscape shifting, it is no longer a "viable option" to the national debt problem, said Abigail Hall Blanco, an economist at the University of Tampa, in an interview with Mirror US. Blanco added that the problem lies in government spending, and tariffs will not help cover the deficit.

03 April 2025, 19:28

Mike Mitchell

If the market is any indication this morning, more than just the GOP is getting decimated.

Fucking trump...

03 April 2025, 21:21

medved

your country never learnt from history ...

04 April 2025, 00:30

LHeym500

I have always gave a person credit when they were right; even if, I did not like them.

Sen. Paul is right on both arguments.

1. He is right on the economic consequences regarding this tariff course of action.

And

2. He is right on the constitutional legality concerning the Chief Executive’s unilateral implementation of tariffs.

05 April 2025, 03:32

TomP

I would very much like to see us choosing elements of two well-considered programs, as opposed to seesawing between perceived sets of dunderheads.

05 April 2025, 04:02

Scott King

quote:
Originally posted by TomP:
I would very much like to see us choosing elements of two well-considered programs, as opposed to seesawing between perceived sets of dunderheads.

Ahhhh! But isn't that interesting!
Trump isn't considered a dunderhead millions and millions of our fellow Americans. Trump is "The One". Orange Jesus. Our friends here have said more than once that Trumps brilliance in politics will be studied for decades and that he is "the only one who can save gh country.

Obama was, "The One". "Hope". Instead we got a continuation of Afghanistan and domestic tensions that bore fruit with BLM. I seem to understand that African Americans make up 10% of our citizenry and yet race relations became a 100% topic and issue.

Jeffive has told us redundantly that Biden was just the golly best ever. Again, Afghanistan, Corona, debt,......

America has retreated behind its partisan walls and machine gun emplacements and the political posters of Mao, Stalin and Hitler compete for staples in the telephone poles.

05 April 2025, 06:40

Magine Enigam

quote:
Originally posted by LHeym500:
I have always gave a person credit when they were right; even if, I did not like them.

Sen. Paul is right on both arguments.

1. He is right on the economic consequences regarding this tariff course of action.

And

2. He is right on the constitutional legality concerning the Chief Executive’s unilateral implementation of tariffs.

https://youtu.be/6NjZMlUDgro?si=E1PBvGEVltIF-IVa

Lawrence: Trump's 'biggest tax increase in history' makes Republicans admit 'tariffs are taxes'

https://youtu.be/8n9PSkxOUBc?si=9-1vDcsJyTVGSdQl

Haberman reacts to Trump playing golf as stocks plunge

*************
“Those who control the present, control the past and those who control the past control the future.” George Orwell, 1984
https://www.google.com/search?...sclient=gws-wiz-serp

Degenerate 1:1
1 Then Trump said, "Let Us re-make a Nation in MY Image, after My likeness, to rule over everything in the Nation, and over all the earth itself and every creature that crawls upon it".

Degenerate 1:2
2 Then Trump said, "Vengeance is mine, I will repay on your behalf."

Degenerate 1:3
3 "My Kingdom come, My will be done."

"When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." - Sinclair Lewis

O.J. Trump aka Trumpism's Founding Farter, aka Farter Martyr.

"Be careful. When a democracy is sick, fascism comes to its bedside, but it is not to inquire about its health." - Albert Camus

05 April 2025, 06:41

wymple

The numbers say that both Obama & Biden are 2 of the best. And it's not Obama's fault that Racists crawled out from under every rock. Biden didn't bring us the virus but did get us thru it quite well. trump made the deal & timeline for leaving Afghanistan. Both Obama & Biden handed trump a plum & he's fucked up both.

05 April 2025, 07:27

JTEX

quote:
Ahhhh! But isn't that interesting!
Trump isn't considered a dunderhead millions and millions of our fellow Americans. Trump is "The One". Orange Jesus.

Scott? Why does he have to be the " Orange Jesus"?

Why can't he just be a President that wants to end wholesale illegal immigration?

Why can't he be a President that wants us to quit subsidizing Europe, while they enrich Russia?

Why can't he be a President that wants to put the United States of America first?

Why can't he be a President that wants to end all theses idiotic foreign wars?

Why does he have to be "Orange Jesus"???

I dont worship anyone except our lord and savior......but I don't like unfettered illegal immigration. I dont want my very hard earned tax dollars wasted on those that won't help themselves. I,dont want our blood and treasure wasted on senseless wars and nation building.

What American doesn't want American interests placed first?

.

05 April 2025, 07:38

MJines

Why? Because the Orange Messiah’s economic policies suck and he is a bungling idiot of a leader. Rumor is his Secretary of the Treasury is already looking to jump ship after a whole two months on the job.

05 April 2025, 08:20

Scott King

quote:
Originally posted by JTEX:

Scott? Why does he have to be the " Orange Jesus"?

.

I don't know, I wouldn't have a clue.

You've seen it tho right? Why was Obama labeled with "hope" and given the Peace Prize?

Why does Jeff refer to Biden as best ever any why is Donald, the man who failed so miserably last time around refered to here as, "the one man who can save our country!".??????

You tell me.

How in the frig did we go from a healthy skepticism of any "Ruler" to this fealty to Don and GOP. Regardless the law or Constitution, regardless precident and common sense how in the world did we get to this place where we roll over and play dead to whatever lunatic rant gets broadcast on Truth Social.

Trump isn't "Orange Jesus"?!?!?!?!

No I'm not accusing you, but I know you've seen it.

05 April 2025, 18:28

Magine Enigam

quote:
Originally posted by Scott King:
quote:
Originally posted by JTEX:

Scott? Why does he have to be the " Orange Jesus"?
.

I don't know, I wouldn't have a clue.

Why ... is Donald, the man who failed so miserably last time around refered to here as, "the one man who can save our country!".??????

You tell me.

How in the frig did we go from a healthy skepticism of any "Ruler" to this fealty to Don and GOP. Regardless the law or Constitution, regardless precident and common sense how in the world did we get to this place where we roll over and play dead to whatever lunatic rant gets broadcast on Truth Social.

The origin of "Orange Jesus":

https://youtu.be/D5muuwQGP-c?si=PD7BMBtJCyhKZkKb

Tim Alberta explains:
I started the video at the place where he explains.
Why evangelicals feel Trump is like a 'mercenary' for their beliefs

https://youtu.be/x3R-Vo6sNOA?s...d_6cS66cOu5I5a&t=128

Why White evangelicals continue to support Donald Trump

https://youtu.be/NvkHKsM9vsU?si=WwDl5ae86Og2lP6z

https://youtube.com/shorts/z3i...?si=EWuJTpeyUP92ZH2-
Woodward on Trump: ‘Fear is his method’

Also remember Trump's "American Carnage" speeches.

https://youtu.be/nSh_hqkVbBo?si=JbY6sgSaCFasg7J3

Is Trump using fear during his campaign?

https://youtu.be/JK6VT9kJYR4?si=TyFhksY7yP1YPH1W&t=97
Is Trump Fulfilling End Times Prophecy?

Remember, Stephen (Wormtongue) Miller was and is the key speech writer for Trump.

05 April 2025, 20:29

Magine Enigam

The Mass Psychology of Trumpism

The real TDS - Trump Delusional Syndrome:

https://youtu.be/WLh6vvQB9tE?si=qkaB-0O6vQhWdozw

https://youtu.be/074gEsTCLMY?si=0HoUYRnvObbR0P_F
Why TRUMP Supporters Really Believe In Him? A Psychiatrist's Insight

05 April 2025, 20:47

Magine Enigam

quote:
Originally posted by LHeym500:
quote:
Originally posted by Scott King:
quote:
Originally posted by LHeym500:
Just because it is me. For the fun of it.

It is spelled demagogue.

Being a political leader who seeks support by appealing to the desires and prejudices of ordinary people rather than by using rational argument.

A demagogue engages in demagoguing. Demagoguing being hetorically exploit (an issue) for political purposes in a way calculated to appeal to the desires and prejudices of ordinary people.

President Trump is a demagogue. The demagogue President Trump is more concerned with demagoguing against gay people then governance anchored in our Constitution.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/demigod

I think Boomstick and I were thinking like "The Rock's" character in Moana.

Here on the PF Trump has been referred to as OJ, the One as in Trump is the only one,.....

I think a demigod if only a wannabe demigod isn't to big a stretch.

If you guys mean it as such, that would be correct.

05 April 2025, 21:55

LHeym500

Our resident veterinarian lead pro tariff faction need to read up the affects of tariffs at the onset of the Great Depression.

05 April 2025, 22:25

Magine Enigam

I have no qualifications or even good sense to analyze and understand Trump(ism).

But I'm sure there is a problem or two.

So, what is a curious guy to do?

Appeal to Authority?

What/which authority?

Since curiosity demands answers in this case, one has to choose. This is THE red pill vs blue pill time.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_pill_and_blue_pill

One could choose the blue pill, like Fox News, or the red pill, like the following video:

https://youtu.be/xp19MR89JzM?si=Kv-K_udZJzV6d_ql

The Mind Of Donald Trump And Why He's Sabotaging The Global Economy

Two quotes:

"The result of a consistent and total substitution of lies for factual truth is not that the lie will now be accepted as truth and truth be defamed as a lie, but that the sense by which we take our bearings in the real world—and the category of truth versus falsehood is among the mental means to this end—is being destroyed."
Hannah Arendt

https://hac.bard.edu/amor-mund...uotations-2024-08-04

“Those then, who resist a confirmation of public order, are the true Artificers of monarchy—not that this is the intention of the generality of them. Yet it would not be difficult to lay the finger upon some of their party who may justly be suspected. When a man unprincipled in private life desperate in his fortune, bold in his temper, possessed of considerable talents, having the advantage of military habits—despotic in his ordinary demeanour—known to have scoffed in private at the principles of liberty—when such a man is seen to mount the hobby horse of popularity—to join in the cry of danger to liberty—to take every opportunity of embarrassing the General Government & bringing it under suspicion—to flatter and fall in with all the non sense of the zealots of the day—It may justly be suspected that his object is to throw things into confusion that he may “ride the storm and direct the whirlwind.”
― Alexander Hamilton

05 April 2025, 22:37

LHeym500

Appeal to the Constitution and the economic consequences of Trump’s actions.

Do not let any nonsense go indebted upon said grounds.

05 April 2025, 23:25

LHeym500

We cannot and shall not accept any derogation on the Checks and Balances established in the Constitution and historical understanding.

06 April 2025, 00:37

jeffeosso

quote:
Originally posted by LHeym500:
Our resident veterinarian lead pro tariff faction need to read up the affects of tariffs at the onset of the Great Depression.

words matter, and lane has offered none on this thread -- why make stuff up?

06 April 2025, 02:21

theback40

I cant make any sense out of the tariff stuff. The news says one thing, people you talk to say another.
I got an e-mail this AM from a canadian mill, I've shipped to.
"Prices remain the same as 1/1/25. No tariffs on forestry products across the border either direction".
What the hell does anyone suppose to believe?

06 April 2025, 02:47

Magine Enigam

https://youtu.be/MJbZCbBLqkk?si=A0hOUrm9c-wiDpXv

The ridiculous real story behind the tariff plan that turned Donald Trump into a global disaster

Ron Vara:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/1....html?smid=url-share

06 April 2025, 02:47

LHeym500

Use your born brain.

We know that adding 25 percent tax to our daily goods is not going to help keep prices down, buying power up.

This President ran and won on stuff costing too much.

Well, inflation was, indisputable, coming down. Fuel cost were reasonable. The stock market was strong. Housing cost had stabilized.

Here we are as Trump puts double digit tariffs on everyone (unilaterally and unconstitutionally).

You know the answers. You just do not want to accept them.

06 April 2025, 02:49

LHeym500

quote:
Originally posted by jeffeosso:
quote:
Originally posted by LHeym500:
Our resident veterinarian lead pro tariff faction need to read up the affects of tariffs at the onset of the Great Depression.

words matter, and lane has offered none on this thread -- why make stuff up?

I am not making stuff up. He has said a hundred times. Tariffs do not matter. He has defended this Administrations tariff policy.

Dr. Easter, JTEX, etc are brought here by their own advocacy.

President Trump’s unilateral tariffs are unconstitutional. They are bad policy as well.

06 April 2025, 03:36

theback40

Heym, I dont know if your prattle was directed at me.
The mill told me, there was no tariff invoked, and to send them logs.
I dont think you work for them, do you?
I am trying to figure out if there are tariffs on everything, why did the mill say there is not?
There seems to be more going on than the "experts" here know about.

06 April 2025, 04:17

Magine Enigam

quote:
There seems to be more going on than the "experts" here know about.

There always is.

That's what conspiracy theories are for.

06 April 2025, 04:45

theback40

Well at least give me a conspiracy Kabob!
There seem to be carve outs going on, at least for now. Yet the news is all about across the board tariffs. Talk to the maple buyers at least every couple days, as we are in the middle of the syrup producing season. Both, this side the border and the other. No tariffs invoked on maple products at this point.
As it impacts me, and many others where I live, it would be nice to know what is really going on in all aspects of the tariffs.

06 April 2025, 05:03

LHeym500

Tariffs failed at the onset of the Great Depression.

We know this is bad policy.

We know that it is harmful economic policy.

We know that unilateral tariffs by the President is unconstitutional.

And you know it.

One does not have to be an “expert” to know a failed idea when it is tried again.

Or when a President engages in unilateral power the Constitution has not vested in the presidency.

Just like some of us knew Sec. Hegseth had no busbrong nominated and confirmed. We are glad you finally came to the realization.

06 April 2025, 05:31

theback40

Heym, you little prick. I asked a specific question about why there seems to be carve outs.
All you want to do is parrot your same old shit.
Call Fontaine Inc Forestry or Maple Grove, Maple products and tell them they are full of shit, only you know what is going on. I will wait for your answer of what they tell you. Lets see if it's different than what they tell me, and why.

06 April 2025, 05:36

LHeym500

Yawn, because even Trump does not want to spike oil and gas. Not hard to figure out.

Again, you know this is bad policy.

Go cuss yourself for being a political tool.

Again, Ol’ Hawley-Smoot turned out to be a pretty bone-head move. Notice these were tariffs passed by Congress like the Constitution requires.

https://www.reuters.com/busine...-russell-2025-04-02/

06 April 2025, 06:12

theback40

Explain how talking about carve outs is being a political tool? I said nothing, I repeat, NOTHING about the tariffs in general in my post. I talked about specific items.
I find you talking about across the board tariffs strange when it is not all across the board.
Your own fucking ego is as bad as trumps, you cant admit you dont know everything.

06 April 2025, 06:31

theback40

Oh, explain how the maple industry is tied to oil and gas while you are at it.

06 April 2025, 06:48

LHeym500

I’ll say it again for you.

You kinks this is bad economic policy. You know it is unconstitutionally implemented.

Yet, you keep acting like you do not understand. You do not know what is going on.

It is very simple. Trump has crashed the economy with a dubious executive action. He did this after scaring everyone that unless he was elected their economic stability would be destroyed.

You simply come here to try to give cover to this unconstitutional political action. A political action that is and will cause economic harm.

The only part you really cannot believe is that Trump followed through w this political moronic action.

Oh, and Hegseth never deserved a chance. As with most things in politics, deserve has next to nothing to do with it. This President never deserved a second term.

06 April 2025, 07:36

LHeym500

Even Musk knows this is bad.

'I hope it is agreed that both Europe and the United States should move ideally in my view to a zero tariff situation, effectively creating a free trade zone between Europe and North America,' the SpaceX founder continued.

06 April 2025, 09:12

Tumbleweed

quote:
Originally posted by theback40:
Heym, I dont know if your prattle was directed at me.
The mill told me, there was no tariff invoked, and to send them logs.
I dont think you work for them, do you?
I am trying to figure out if there are tariffs on everything, why did the mill say there is not?
There seems to be more going on than the "experts" here know about.

In this case, you are the seller.
The Canadian mill is the buyer.
The U.S. might have tariffs (that you would pay) on things you buy from Canada, while Canada might not impose tariffs on the product you’re selling to Canada.

But carry on please, continue repeating Trumps bullshit about how Canada is taking advantage of you. Tell us about the 200% tariff Canada charges you on dairy products, when in fact it is ZERO, with the exemption of a dumping clause which has never EVER been reached or invoked. What you really need to figure out is who is actually lying to you…or rather admit who’s lying to you.

06 April 2025, 13:36

theback40

dickweed, the dumping tariffs is never implemented because roadblocks are put up to even reach the amounts allowed. Look up the USDA filed complaints about that.
The tariffs coming in the US on grain or lumber or maple is not in place.
heym, you are a liar, flat out liar.
I have wanted zero tariffs between major trade partners, and said so. I dont like to repeat the same thing in every post like you do.
I want to know why you call it across the board tariffs, when there are carve outs. That is a lie.
Will those change? maybe. But I would like to know what is in their heads with the plan.
So Heym, keep trying to put words in my mouth. What I asked is what I asked, you cannot twist it into your own version of a rant.
As for deserve, what has happened has happened. I will live with it, like all the rest of the past politicians. If I had my way. Joe manchin would be president, it's who I wrote in.

06 April 2025, 18:33

medved

List of products from the United States subject to 25 per cent tariffs effective March 13, 2025

https://www.canada.ca/en/depar...e-march-13-2025.html

Canada made a tariffs retaliation because your country started it and more are coming ... but you are right theback40 there is no tariffs war lol ...

06 April 2025, 19:22

theback40

Ahh, another dickweed, chimes in.
Show me where I said there was no tariff war? You make the claim, so show it.
If you exert yourself, read where I said there are carve outs. I wondered why, and how they are decided, and if they will change.
But keep going, change the context of my posts and look like an idiot, you are doing it well.

06 April 2025, 19:24

MJines

. . . I am amazed everyday here to learn of folks that purport to be "conservatives" that apparently love taxes. They are as happy as sailors in a whorehouse with Trump's massive tax increases. Go figure.

06 April 2025, 19:45

Steve Bertram

quote:
Originally posted by MJines:
. . . I am amazed everyday here to learn of folks that purport to be "conservatives" that apparently love taxes. They are as happy as sailors in a whorehouse with Trump's massive tax increases. Go figure.

Until they get the bill, I had several clients this week that were quite unhappy to find that the tariffs will be applied to their purchases.

06 April 2025, 20:06

Bill Leeper

There IS a considerable amount of bullshit involved in this situation, and it comes from every source, starting with the White House. Trump is spouting BS and various Canadian sources are responding in kind. Much like retaliatory tariffs, this is retaliatory bullshit. The best response to Trump's tariffs would be to do nothing but business as usual (while seeking out more reliable trading partners). In Canada, our politicians panicked and overreacted to Trump's rhetoric. Hopefully, they have sense enough to put Trump on "ignore", for the time being. At the same time, Canadians need to pay attention to the fact that Trump wants Carney as PM. Carney is a banker. Trump can manipulate bankers. He's done it all his life. Regards, Bill