https://apnews.com/article/rus...332587b39150f1fd1738

Navalny dead in prison, what a surprise. The nerve agent didn’t quite work last time but whatever he did this time obviously worked.

Anyone surprised?

From what I read of the guy, I had an uneasy feeling that he might just be another Robespierre. Im not sure he was the salvation the west was looking for. Regardless its just another symptom of how truely bad the russian system and culture really is.

While it looks suspicious, face it the guy didn’t have exactly a healthy lifestyle.

We shouldn’t jump to conclusions, although I agree that regardless of what really happened the reports will look identical that we see.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
While it looks suspicious, face it the guy didn’t have exactly a healthy lifestyle.

We shouldn’t jump to conclusions, although I agree that regardless of what really happened the reports will look identical that we see.

That goes without saying - disagree with Putin at your peril. And Trump says with envy that Putin is a man who knows how to handle power. Maybe you should take that into consideration.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
While it looks suspicious, face it the guy didn’t have exactly a healthy lifestyle.

We shouldn’t jump to conclusions, although I agree that regardless of what really happened the reports will look identical that we see.

That lifestyle was imposed upon him by the Putin regime. Poisoned and then sent to an extreme penal colony in the arctic to suffer. He had alleged earlier that he was being given so many antibiotics without any need. Before he was poisoned, when someone chucked paint in his face, it permanently damaged his right eye.

He believed in his cause, probably had a misplaced faith in his people that they would raise against the tyrant called Putin, and refused to give the latter the pleasure of him living in exile. He returned fully aware that he would forfeit his freedom and life. He was sentenced for 19 years for dissent.There is no jumping to conclusions here. His death was mandated by the regime and it was achieved. There can be speculations about what specific event resulted in his death but the cause is not.

The next in line is Vladimir Karamadza who is also incarcerated unfairly for raising his voice. He comes from a long line of political dissenters and voluntarily chose the path of fighting Putin with words on his turf. It is a matter time before he too loses his life.

Surely Trump’s best friend wouldn’t stoop to violence. After all, both are geniuses….

Color me not at all surprised at who wants all possible due process for Vladimir Putin.

Ignore the fact that Russian citizens who try to pay tribute to Navalny are being arrested all over the Country.

Dr. Butler didn't see Putin kill the guy, so we shouldn't judge...

quote:

Originally posted by shankspony:
Anyone surprised?

From what I read of the guy, I had an uneasy feeling that he might just be another Robespierre. Im not sure he was the salvation the west was looking for. Regardless its just another symptom of how truely bad the russian system and culture really is.

He wasn't what we would consider saviour for Russia, he fully supported Putins grab of the Crimea. He did at least believe in stamping out corruption and by virtue of the fact that he was going to stand against Putin he believed in democratic process.

Russia now is no different to what it was in the soviet era. Back then it was run by a dictator for the benefit of a few top level party members. Now its run by a dictator for the benefit of a few corrupt oligarchs.

A healthy lifestyle? No, it is not healthy to be poisoned by the KGB and come within a trice of death, then get shipped to an Arctic penal colony. Shame on him for not taking better care of himself.

Alcohol abuse, bad exercise habits, poor (fatty) diet. (Kind of by definition for a Russian politician)…

Couple that with stress.

Did getting put in a penal colony make the situation worse?

Likely.

But the guy was a poster boy for sudden cardiac death.

Should he have been in prison?

No.

But I wouldn’t put homicide as cause of death either. I’d want an autopsy.

I don’t disagree that I wouldn’t trust an autopsy from Putin’s Russia on the guy.

But assumption that Putin killed him makes you not a critical thinker.

In essence we won’t know, and that means there is always suspicion that he was killed to silence him…

I guess if you'll simp for Trump nothing's off the table...

Putin is a bloody monster.

How about all the people you lot kill to serve your purpose?

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
Alcohol abuse, bad exercise habits, poor (fatty) diet. (Kind of by definition for a Russian politician)…

Couple that with stress.

Did getting put in a penal colony make the situation worse?

Likely.

But the guy was a poster boy for sudden cardiac death.

Should he have been in prison?

No.

But I wouldn’t put homicide as cause of death either. I’d want an autopsy.

I don’t disagree that I wouldn’t trust an autopsy from Putin’s Russia on the guy.

But assumption that Putin killed him makes you not a critical thinker.

In essence we won’t know, and that means there is always suspicion that he was killed to silence him…

This is inexcusable. The man was imprisoned in hard labor for speaking out against Putin Regime. Putin cannot escape moral, political responsibility to this. Why folks to the right of me want to apologize for Putin and Trump is beyond me.

Done, you never examined this man, all your statements are beyond assumptions.

You do know the difference between a regime and administration?

Putin certainly has moral, political, and ethical responsibility for putting a guy into prison for putting the guy into a prison camp for the "crime" of not agreeing with the leader.

Did the guy die of a heart attack or was he poisoned with novichok?

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
Alcohol abuse, bad exercise habits, poor (fatty) diet. (Kind of by definition for a Russian politician)…

Couple that with stress.

Did getting put in a penal colony make the situation worse?

Likely.

But the guy was a poster boy for sudden cardiac death.

Should he have been in prison?

No.

But I wouldn’t put homicide as cause of death either. I’d want an autopsy.

I don’t disagree that I wouldn’t trust an autopsy from Putin’s Russia on the guy.

But assumption that Putin killed him makes you not a critical thinker.

In essence we won’t know, and that means there is always suspicion that he was killed to silence him…

This is inexcusable. The man was imprisoned in hard labor for speaking out against Putin Regime. Putin cannot escape moral, political responsibility to this. Why folks to the right of me want to apologize for Putin and Trump is beyond me.

Done, you never examined this man, all your statements are beyond assumptions.

You do know the difference between a regime and administration?

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
Alcohol abuse, bad exercise habits, poor (fatty) diet. (Kind of by definition for a Russian politician)…

Couple that with stress.

Did getting put in a penal colony make the situation worse?

Likely.

But the guy was a poster boy for sudden cardiac death.

Should he have been in prison?

No.

But I wouldn’t put homicide as cause of death either. I’d want an autopsy.

I don’t disagree that I wouldn’t trust an autopsy from Putin’s Russia on the guy.

But assumption that Putin killed him makes you not a critical thinker.

In essence we won’t know, and that means there is always suspicion that he was killed to silence him…

Fell off his own yacht, fell out of a window of the Russian embassy in Berlin, fell out of a window in Moscow, poisoned with a nerve agent x2 and survived, fell out of a window in StPetersburg, shot in the head and found in his swimming pool, plane he was on suddenly exploded, shot on a bridge in Moscow, tripped whilst smoking and fell out of a 6th floor window, made to look like suicide by hanging, fell off a cliff whilst hiking…

It doesn’t take critical thinking to realise being associated with Putin, Russian corruption or speaking out against the war is bad for your health.

It seems unlikely that Navalny volunteered to be locked up in a penal colony where he died.

he'd all ready been poisoned. His health was pretty poor due too that, then they chucked him in a frigid cell and waited for the environment/ jail conditions to finish him.
Theres no way putins regime is not responsible for this.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
Alcohol abuse, bad exercise habits, poor (fatty) diet. (Kind of by definition for a Russian politician)…

But assumption that Putin killed him makes you not a critical thinker.

I respectfully ask if you have followed Navalny over the years or even seen his photos?

Before he was poisoned with the nerve agent, he was a picture of health. A prime example of manhood. Young, strapping and driven.





When someone hurled an antibiotic chemical die in his face which resulted in permanent damage to his right eye.



After he was poisoned with Novichok which took him to the every verge of death and put him in a coma.



Just a day before he tragically died in an Arctic penal colony



The transformation of the man is right there for everyone to see. He might have survived the Novichok poisoning but it does not mean that he came out unscathed. It damaged him and damaged him badly.

When you bring in alcohol abuse, bad diet and lack of exercise as probable causes in this case because those typify a Russian politician in your view, it is hard not to come to the conclusion that you really do not know what you are talking about. I did not intend to come across rude but this is how it looks.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
Alcohol abuse, bad exercise habits, poor (fatty) diet. (Kind of by definition for a Russian politician)…

Couple that with stress.

Did getting put in a penal colony make the situation worse?

Likely.

But the guy was a poster boy for sudden cardiac death.

Should he have been in prison?

No.

But I wouldn’t put homicide as cause of death either. I’d want an autopsy.

I don’t disagree that I wouldn’t trust an autopsy from Putin’s Russia on the guy.

But assumption that Putin killed him makes you not a critical thinker.

In essence we won’t know, and that means there is always suspicion that he was killed to silence him…

Well, there is at least one person in the world who will believe Putin when he says he had nothing to do with killing the guy.

I find this fascinating!

I don’t like killing!

But, it seems a person is only worth remembering if he is killed by someone we don’t like!

Have you ever heard any uproar when America killed half a village by drones?

I wonder why it is like this??

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:

But I wouldn’t put homicide as cause of death either. I’d want an autopsy.

I don’t disagree that I wouldn’t trust an autopsy from Putin’s Russia on the guy.

But assumption that Putin killed him makes you not a critical thinker.

In essence we won’t know, and that means there is always suspicion that he was killed to silence him…

Well, there is at least one person in the world who will believe Putin when he says he had nothing to do with killing the guy.

There's two:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news...610e94115dde3f&ei=28

Faced with actual example of political persecution, Trump goes uncharacteristically silent

========================================

And at least one who will believe nothing Putin says:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news...KVa?ocid=socialshare

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
Putin certainly has moral, political, and ethical responsibility for putting a guy into prison for putting the guy into a prison camp for the "crime" of not agreeing with the leader.

Did the guy die of a heart attack or was he poisoned with novichok?

quote:

Originally posted by LHeym500:

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:
Alcohol abuse, bad exercise habits, poor (fatty) diet. (Kind of by definition for a Russian politician)…

Couple that with stress.

Did getting put in a penal colony make the situation worse?

Likely.

But the guy was a poster boy for sudden cardiac death.

Should he have been in prison?

No.

But I wouldn’t put homicide as cause of death either. I’d want an autopsy.

I don’t disagree that I wouldn’t trust an autopsy from Putin’s Russia on the guy.

But assumption that Putin killed him makes you not a critical thinker.

In essence we won’t know, and that means there is always suspicion that he was killed to silence him…

This is inexcusable. The man was imprisoned in hard labor for speaking out against Putin Regime. Putin cannot escape moral, political responsibility to this. Why folks to the right of me want to apologize for Putin and Trump is beyond me.

Done, you never examined this man, all your statements are beyond assumptions.

You do know the difference between a regime and administration?

Well, Russia is calling it “sudden death syndrome.” His family is calling it poison. Russia will not release his body.

I will take the flyer on not being a heart attack not induced by cardiac disease.

No, I did not examine the man.

I can't say it was murder.

I also said that we can't trust what comes out of the Russian government.

What actually killed him? Who knows.

Is the Putin government responsible for the unwarranted incarceration? Absolutely.

That they are not releasing his body to the family certainly indicates they are hiding something.

It could be that there are injuries showing he was beaten and tortured. It could be that he was starved to death.

He could be poisoned.

Who knows.

I do know of more than a few 40-somethings who looked the picture of health suddenly have a significant MI and end up with stents/bypass. If that happened in the middle of Siberia I kind of suspect you just die... even if you are not an enemy of the government there.

There is a difference between a cause of death on a death certificate and who may have put someone in jeopardy.

I agree that the guy did not belong in a gulag.

https://www.newsweek.com/putin...list-navalny-1870692

Full List of Putin Critics Who Have Died in Mysterious Circumstances
Published Feb 16, 2024 at 11:02 AM EST

https://www.theguardian.com/wo...ritics-alexi-navalny

The mysterious, violent and unsolved deaths of Putin’s foes and critics

https://apnews.com/article/rus...0ecc4f64092fc1f9ceb5

Over 400 detained in Russia as country mourns the death of Alexei Navalny, Putin's fiercest foe
Story by By DASHA LITVINOVA, Associated Press • 5h

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news...7966928d3c6d4d&ei=21

‘Some buy the propaganda. Many have changed their minds’: life in Russia after the invasion
Story by Pjotr Sauer • 8h

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news...7966928d3c6d4d&ei=76

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-68337794

And another. A pilot who defected from Russia to Ukraine has been found shot dead in Spain.

A few months after Mr Kuzminov defected, Russian state TV showed a man said to be a Russian intelligence officer saying: "I don't think he'll live long enough to face trial.“

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news...9b82dcc4ccaf4d&ei=85

Russian FSB intelligence network operating throughout Europe represents ‘colossal threat’ – diplomat
Story by Alla Shcherbak • 5h

The confirmation of Kuzminov's death on Feb. 19 by the Ukrainian military intelligence came after Russian social media and news outlets were abuzz with the details of his killing, which involved up to twelve gunshot wounds.

Putin is a gangster with an army, secret police, an intelligence apparatus and 6,000 nuclear weapons.

He probably had a peanut allergy and was given kung pao chicken. For sure comrade Putin had nothing to do with. Just another happy coincidence for Trump’s best friend.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Mitchell:
Putin is a gangster with an army, secret police, an intelligence apparatus and 6,000 nuclear weapons.

Putin owns a country.

Trump WANTS to own a country.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news...f0d62032a3115d&ei=58

Defected pilot killed in Spain a 'moral corpse,' says Russia

Russia's foreign intelligence chief described a Russian pilot who defected to Ukraine and was found shot dead in Spain as a "moral corpse" for betraying his country, in Moscow's first comment on the case since news of the killing emerged. Isaine Blatry reports.