https://x.com/sentdefender/status/1893357932995322178

This is the level to which the US has sunk today. After 9/11, numerous countries came to USA's aid. The US called on article 5 of NATO, and so many countries stepped up. Including Sweden... and we were not even in NATO. Because that's what you do when partners, allies, friends get viciously attacked.

But hear this: the next time US gets attacked, or has a natural disaster of biblical proportions... There will be countries coming to assistance. If the price is right. We'll set up a fund where you pay us 50% of your earnings as a punishment for being attacked from a foreign aggressor.

Dammit, this is like seeing your best friend become a toothless crack junkie in a week's time.

I couldn't possibly eat the volumes I would like to vomit right now. This is disgusting.

quote:

Senior U.S. Officials, including National Security Advisor Mike Waltz, are reporting that the United States and Ukraine are on the verge of signing an “Improved” Mineral Deal and Partnership. According to the New York Times, who has read the Document, the Deal calls for Ukraine to relinquish Half of its Revenues from Natural Resources, including Minerals, Gas and Oil, as well as Earnings from Ports and other Infrastructure, without any kind of U.S. Defense or Security Guarantees. The Revenue from Ukraine’s Natural Resources will be directed to a Fund in which the U.S. holds 100% Financial Interest, and that Ukraine should contribute to until it reaches $500 Billion; while stating that for any additional Military Assistance provided by the United States, Ukraine will be required to contribute to the Fund a sum equal to twice the amount provided to Ukraine. As stated previously, the Deal does not contain any Security or Defensive Guarantees by the United States to Ukraine, but does state that the U.S. intends to provide a “Long-Term Financial Commitment to help Ukraine develop Economically.”

So they get billions of dollars and they don’t have to pay back anything?
Now, let me barf

quote:

Originally posted by M.Shy:
So they get billions of dollars and they don’t have to pay back anything?
Now, let me barf

Just give me a truthful count about how many times you have felt upset that the US hasn't compensated Sweden for our 20 year tour in Afghanistan, 9/11 was an attack on the US and not really our business.

If it's higher than zero, I know you have your head screwed on right. But you have to be truthful.

I assume President Zelensky is too smart to sign any such deal, more punitive than the reparations extracted from the Nazis for WWII, all for the sin of being invaded. The U.S. is not the only source for weapons, and most Countries don't demand double the cost and half your GDP.

Until I see something from President Zelensky I'll assume this is just another attempt by Trump, Putin and their thugs to coerce Ukraine into a ruinous position.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:
I assume President Zelensky is too smart to sign any such deal, more punitive than the reparations extracted from the Nazis for WWII, all for the sin of being invaded. The U.S. is not the only source for weapons, and most Countries don't demand double the cost and half your GDP.

Until I see something from President Zelensky I'll assume this is just another attempt by Trump, Putin and their thugs to coerce Ukraine into a ruinous position.

YOUR hero, Zelensky , that hasn't allowed for elections for president? THAT guy, fifi?

so, IF trump does it, you are cool with it?

hypocrite

mr "i hate trump with every fiber of my being" - expressing you have no intellectual control and are only reacting on an emotive level, like a 4 year old

No free lunch.
Let me see - Zelensky and Biden concocted a scheme to get $170 B in US military stuff. Zelenshy can not account for all of it or even half.

Hunter Biden and Crooked Joe likely have a nice stash based on past deals.

Now DOGE and Trump want an accounting. Seems logical to me. You mortagage your country and were crooked, now you want a freebie???

Don't work that way. Luigi the Legbreaker is back... Pay up.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:
I assume President Zelensky is too smart to sign any such deal, more punitive than the reparations extracted from the Nazis for WWII, all for the sin of being invaded. The U.S. is not the only source for weapons, and most Countries don't demand double the cost and half your GDP.

Until I see something from President Zelensky I'll assume this is just another attempt by Trump, Putin and their thugs to coerce Ukraine into a ruinous position.

YOUR hero, Zelensky , that hasn't allowed for elections for president? THAT guy, fifi?

so, IF trump does it, you are cool with it?

hypocrite

mr "i hate trump with every fiber of my being" - expressing you have no intellectual control and are only reacting on an emotive level, like a 4 year old

I'm having a hell of a time keeping this all straight. Are Ukraine and Zelensky bad because he invaded Russia and Started the war? Are Russia and Putin our friends and deserving of our help after defending their homeland so nobly? It wasn't long ago that Russia's influence on our country was not welcomed. It's all so confusing. We need a Ministry of Truth; or, do we already have one? Regards, Bill.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Leeper:

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:
I assume President Zelensky is too smart to sign any such deal, more punitive than the reparations extracted from the Nazis for WWII, all for the sin of being invaded. The U.S. is not the only source for weapons, and most Countries don't demand double the cost and half your GDP.

Until I see something from President Zelensky I'll assume this is just another attempt by Trump, Putin and their thugs to coerce Ukraine into a ruinous position.

YOUR hero, Zelensky , that hasn't allowed for elections for president? THAT guy, fifi?

so, IF trump does it, you are cool with it?

hypocrite

mr "i hate trump with every fiber of my being" - expressing you have no intellectual control and are only reacting on an emotive level, like a 4 year old

I'm having a hell of a time keeping this all straight. Are Ukraine and Zelensky bad because he invaded Russia and Started the war? Are Russia and Putin our friends and deserving of our help after defending their homeland so nobly? It wasn't long ago that Russia's influence on our country was not welcomed. It's all so confusing. We need a Ministry of Truth; or, do we already have one? Regards, Bill.

if you can decipher the choir of the trump fan base let us know ... it is hard to follow but now putin is the new friend and the previous allies are now the enemies ...

quote:

Originally posted by medved:

quote:

Originally posted by Bill Leeper:

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:
I assume President Zelensky is too smart to sign any such deal, more punitive than the reparations extracted from the Nazis for WWII, all for the sin of being invaded. The U.S. is not the only source for weapons, and most Countries don't demand double the cost and half your GDP.

Until I see something from President Zelensky I'll assume this is just another attempt by Trump, Putin and their thugs to coerce Ukraine into a ruinous position.

YOUR hero, Zelensky , that hasn't allowed for elections for president? THAT guy, fifi?

so, IF trump does it, you are cool with it?

hypocrite

mr "i hate trump with every fiber of my being" - expressing you have no intellectual control and are only reacting on an emotive level, like a 4 year old

I'm having a hell of a time keeping this all straight. Are Ukraine and Zelensky bad because he invaded Russia and Started the war? Are Russia and Putin our friends and deserving of our help after defending their homeland so nobly? It wasn't long ago that Russia's influence on our country was not welcomed. It's all so confusing. We need a Ministry of Truth; or, do we already have one? Regards, Bill.

if you can decipher the choir of the trump fan base let us know ... it is hard to follow but now putin is the new friend and the previous allies are now the enemies ...

The hardcore MAGA base, the stupidest third of Trump's voters, have absolutely no principles that interfere with them following where-ever the Trump wind blows. Zelensky was a shining example of courage under fire until Trump said, bizarrely, that somehow he started the war.

An awful lot of the other two-thirds of his voters sure don't seem all that happy, seems like some polls show his approval down 11 points in a month.

quote:

Originally posted by M.Shy:
So they get billions of dollars and they don’t have to pay back anything?
Now, let me barf

You NEVER gave a PENNY without EXPECTING a DOLLAR back!

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
https://x.com/marklevinshow/st...371016157581326?s=46

Only IDIOTS listen to other DERANGED IDIOTS

quote:

Originally posted by HerrBerg:

quote:

Originally posted by M.Shy:
So they get billions of dollars and they don’t have to pay back anything?
Now, let me barf

Just give me a truthful count about how many times you have felt upset that the US hasn't compensated Sweden for our 20 year tour in Afghanistan, 9/11 was an attack on the US and not really our business.

If it's higher than zero, I know you have your head screwed on right. But you have to be truthful.

There is a long list of countries who supported the US adventures in Iraq (twice) and Afghanistan who I assume haven't submitted an invoice...

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
https://x.com/marklevinshow/st...371016157581326?s=46

Think about this for a moment.

US companies invest in Ukraine. US companies go to Ukraine in a large way. Russia attacks Ukraine again it jeopardizes invoking article 5 and receiving a NATO response.

This deal is the next best thing to being a NATO member for Ukraine. They should jump on it.

US companies are already in Ukraine, google, snap, Nvidia, Bunge and various others.

If Russia attacks US assets that wont be sufficient to invoke article 5. Your logic is defective, unless of course Trump buys the country and turns it into part of the US.

quote:

Originally posted by nute:
US companies are already in Ukraine, google, snap, Nvidia, Bunge and various others.

If Russia attacks US assets that wont be sufficient to invoke article 5. Your logic is defective, unless of course Trump buys the country and turns it into part of the US.

If US companies go to Ukraine in a large way way physically (the companies you mentioned aren’t there with large infrastructure holdings) the US will or at least could choose to defend those holdings. Attack against a US defense could invoke article 5. Listen to Levin’s podcast.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by nute:
US companies are already in Ukraine, google, snap, Nvidia, Bunge and various others.

If Russia attacks US assets that wont be sufficient to invoke article 5. Your logic is defective, unless of course Trump buys the country and turns it into part of the US.

If US companies go to Ukraine in a large way way physically (the companies you mentioned aren’t there with large infrastructure holdings) the US will or at least could choose to defend those holdings. Attack against a US defense could invoke article 5. Listen to Levin’s podcast.

Go read the NATO Charter; Article 5 ONLY applies to the territories of signatories as of the specified date in 1947. It doesn't apply to a signatorie's troops deployed elsewhere nor to companies based in a signatory but located elsewhere.

For Ukraine to join NATO would require a special codicil, just like other Members who have since joined; that is not available to American troops on Ukrainian soil, nor American companies.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by nute:
US companies are already in Ukraine, google, snap, Nvidia, Bunge and various others.

If Russia attacks US assets that wont be sufficient to invoke article 5. Your logic is defective, unless of course Trump buys the country and turns it into part of the US.

If US companies go to Ukraine in a large way way physically (the companies you mentioned aren’t there with large infrastructure holdings) the US will or at least could choose to defend those holdings. Attack against a US defense could invoke article 5. Listen to Levin’s podcast.

You should read article 5 (and article 6 as this defines the meaning of an attack on a signatory) rather than relying on social media to tell you what it is.

Article 6
“For the purpose of Article 5, an armed attack on one or more of the Parties is deemed to include an armed attack:

on the territory of any of the Parties in Europe or North America, on the Algerian Departments of France 2, on the territory of Turkey or on the Islands under the jurisdiction of any of the Parties in the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer;
on the forces, vessels, or aircraft of any of the Parties, when in or over these territories or any other area in Europe in which occupation forces of any of the Parties were stationed on the date when the Treaty entered into force or the Mediterranean Sea or the North Atlantic area north of the Tropic of Cancer.”

Ukraine is not part of the US or a NATO member. The US has no forces in Ukraine and Ukraine is/was not occupied by the US at the date of the treaty.

Of course the US could do whatever it wants with its own forces but that is totally different to the invocation of A5/6.

While agreeing it would not be an automatic trigger…an attack on US forces in Ukraine would likely garner a consensus among NATO members to back the US in conflict.

It would certainly serve as an equal deterrent to future Russian aggression in Ukraine.

Like General Jack Keane always says: “The last thing Russia ever wants to do is to engage in the exchange of ordinance with the USA.”

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
While agreeing it would not be an automatic trigger…an attack on US forces in Ukraine would likely garner a consensus among NATO members to back the US in conflict.

It would certainly serve as an equal deterrent to future Russian aggression in Ukraine.

Like General Jack Keane always says: “The last thing Russia ever wants to do is to engage in the exchange of ordinance with the USA.”

Not what you said, you brain-dead crawfishing MAGAt, you specifically cited "Article 5"
without any idea what the fuck you were talking about.

And shit you shoot at other people is "ordnance", not some municipal code.

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

The hardcore MAGA base, the stupidest third of Trump's voters, . . .

. . . so why did AR end up with this group? Talk about being the tallest in a room full of midgets . . . ouch.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
While agreeing it would not be an automatic trigger…an attack on US forces in Ukraine would likely garner a consensus among NATO members to back the US in conflict.

It would certainly serve as an equal deterrent to future Russian aggression in Ukraine.

Like General Jack Keane always says: “The last thing Russia ever wants to do is to engage in the exchange of ordinance with the USA.”

If things get out of hand, you will look just as bad as Russia.

You have lost EVERY war you needlessly started m and got kicked unceremoniously out!

Remember Kabul??

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
While agreeing it would not be an automatic trigger…an attack on US forces in Ukraine would likely garner a consensus among NATO members to back the US in conflict.

It would certainly serve as an equal deterrent to future Russian aggression in Ukraine.

Like General Jack Keane always says: “The last thing Russia ever wants to do is to engage in the exchange of ordinance with the USA.”

I’m sure you are right that Vlad won’t take on the US.

That does however presuppose that US troops are actually stationed there. There is nothing on the table to that effect and politically it’s not going to happen.

Believe me I’d love to see an end to this but not at the expense of Ukraines interests. It is a sovereign state and its population should be free to chart their own future. If that means fighting for their freedom then so be it, they deserve the tools to be able to do so.

quote:

they deserve the tools to be able to do so.

Nobody “deserves” anything they can’t provide for themselves.

If I were Ukraine…I would look real hard at this deal. In the end…I bet it gets done.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

they deserve the tools to be able to do so.

Nobody “deserves” anything they can’t provide for themselves.

If I were Ukraine…I would look real hard at this deal. In the end…I bet it gets done.

It's a betrayal of Ukraine. What is Russia giving up to rebuild all the infrastructure they destroyed?

Tell us, Ledvm, why does Trump always suck up to Putin?
He doesn't fawn over any other nation's leader like that. So why Putin?

Meanwhile Zelensky to. Ukraine has built more artillery pieces this year than NATO, our goal was to build 1 million drones, we built 2 million.

Also tells the world that he will step down as president if its a condition of joining NATO and a condition of peace.

quote:

Originally posted by M.Shy:
So they get billions of dollars and they don’t have to pay back anything?
Now, let me barf

Billions of dollars of ammo which was about the expire, and weapons which were collecting dust and likely had to be thrashed anyway. Yes, the value in the books might have been many billion dollars, but in practice most of those dollars were 'lost' anyway.

Now now.

Don’t use logic on the muppets.

quote:

Originally posted by M.Shy:
So they get billions of dollars and they don’t have to pay back anything?
Now, let me barf

I suspect an undercurrent of non-reported news, like Smedley Butler's description of our entry into WWI.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

they deserve the tools to be able to do so.

Nobody “deserves” anything they can’t provide for themselves.

If I were Ukraine…I would look real hard at this deal. In the end…I bet it gets done.

The west was unreserved in its support for the US following 9/11, and your subsequent score settling with Saddam, and your adventure in Afghanistan. We didn’t ask for half your mineral rights or send an invoice. You deserved our support.

You are right the US will probably get the rights to Ukraines mineral reserves, but Ukraine has the sword of Damocles hanging over her, and Trump is standing by with a knife ready to cut the thread on which it hangs.

Se also - https://forums.accuratereloadi...3811043/m/4211056082

Zelenski Has Yet To Eat The Shit Sandwich

https://www.moonofalabama.org/...t-sandwich.html#more

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by Jefffive:

The hardcore MAGA base, the stupidest third of Trump's voters, . . .

. . . so why did AR end up with this group? Talk about being the tallest in a room full of midgets . . . ouch.

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHA

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

they deserve the tools to be able to do so.

Nobody “deserves” anything they can’t provide for themselves.

If I were Ukraine…I would look real hard at this deal. In the end…I bet it gets done.

It's a betrayal of Ukraine. What is Russia giving up to rebuild all the infrastructure they destroyed?

Tell us, Ledvm, why does Trump always suck up to Putin?
He doesn't fawn over any other nation's leader like that. So why Putin?

Fawn???

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

they deserve the tools to be able to do so.

Nobody “deserves” anything they can’t provide for themselves.

If I were Ukraine…I would look real hard at this deal. In the end…I bet it gets done.

It's a betrayal of Ukraine. What is Russia giving up to rebuild all the infrastructure they destroyed?

Tell us, Ledvm, why does Trump always suck up to Putin?
He doesn't fawn over any other nation's leader like that. So why Putin?

Fawn???

Kowtow would be more a more accurate description of the spineless Felon in Chief's behavior don't you think Lane?

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

they deserve the tools to be able to do so.

Nobody “deserves” anything they can’t provide for themselves.

If I were Ukraine…I would look real hard at this deal. In the end…I bet it gets done.

It's a betrayal of Ukraine. What is Russia giving up to rebuild all the infrastructure they destroyed?

Tell us, Ledvm, why does Trump always suck up to Putin?
He doesn't fawn over any other nation's leader like that. So why Putin?

Fawn???

Kowtow would be more accurate for the spineless Felon in Chief don't you think Lane?

Looks like winning to me.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

they deserve the tools to be able to do so.

Nobody “deserves” anything they can’t provide for themselves.

If I were Ukraine…I would look real hard at this deal. In the end…I bet it gets done.

It's a betrayal of Ukraine. What is Russia giving up to rebuild all the infrastructure they destroyed?

Tell us, Ledvm, why does Trump always suck up to Putin?
He doesn't fawn over any other nation's leader like that. So why Putin?

Fawn???

Kowtow would be more accurate for the spineless Felon in Chief don't you think Lane?

Looks like winning to me.

Putin certainly feels that way comrade. Trump is obviously Putin's bitch, that much could not be clearer.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

they deserve the tools to be able to do so.

Nobody “deserves” anything they can’t provide for themselves.

If I were Ukraine…I would look real hard at this deal. In the end…I bet it gets done.

It's a betrayal of Ukraine. What is Russia giving up to rebuild all the infrastructure they destroyed?

Tell us, Ledvm, why does Trump always suck up to Putin?
He doesn't fawn over any other nation's leader like that. So why Putin?

Fawn???

Kowtow would be more accurate for the spineless Felon in Chief don't you think Lane?

Looks like winning to me.

Putin certainly feels that way comrade. Trump is obviously Putin's bitch, that much could not be clearer.

Please show me the victories for Putin. Putin is stuck in your head 24/7/365…you should seek psychiatric help.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Bertram:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

Originally posted by RolandtheHeadless:

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:

quote:

they deserve the tools to be able to do so.

Nobody “deserves” anything they can’t provide for themselves.

If I were Ukraine…I would look real hard at this deal. In the end…I bet it gets done.

It's a betrayal of Ukraine. What is Russia giving up to rebuild all the infrastructure they destroyed?

Tell us, Ledvm, why does Trump always suck up to Putin?
He doesn't fawn over any other nation's leader like that. So why Putin?

Fawn???

Kowtow would be more accurate for the spineless Felon in Chief don't you think Lane?

Looks like winning to me.

Putin certainly feels that way comrade. Trump is obviously Putin's bitch, that much could not be clearer.

Please show me the victories for Putin. Putin is stuck in your head 24/7/365…you should seek psychiatric help.

See Trump promoting all of Putin's talking points in regards to Ukraine and the abandoning of our allies.


It is you who should seek help, you have lost all sense and sensibility in your loyalty to the orange turd.

We’ll see in the end how Ukraine turns out.

Please remember Ukraine was invaded under Biden’s watch.

quote:

Originally posted by ledvm:
We’ll see in the end how Ukraine turns out.

Please remember Ukraine was invaded under Biden’s watch.

It was and Trump will role over like the little bitch that he is for his master Putin. Fucking sad. Even sadder to watch a significant portion of the population walk away from what they had claimed was their beliefs to mindlessly follow a charlatan. You cannot truly have supported Reagan and now support caving to Putin, simply incompatible. Pathetic too.